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And since you yourself admit it is ;polarizing, you should advise the
company not to constantly repeat that this device will rrreplace the cane.
Saying it may over time, perhaps a long time, is one thing. Talking about
it being revvolutionary and replacing the cane is going to really turn off a lot
of blind people who see the cane as a symbol of independence and competence and
not as something to be disparaged and lightly discarded. and the factg
that these statements are being made by sighted developers doesn’t help.
If they understood the blind community, they wouldn’t emphasize this but they
don’t. If you want to see more people react like me, then they will get
such reactions in abundance if they keep marketing and advertising the product
in the wrong way.
If you want acceptance, you don’t disparage, and whether they know it or
not, that is how it will be perceived by a lot of people who know all to well
the not using a cane makes me less blind argument, the cane.
If they had consulted with various organizations and learned about their
audience, they would not approach that audience as they are. As a
proponent of this technology, you should advise the developers of this.
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 8:58 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap
I would agree with you, except that the blind community would be satisfied
using a Franklin Language Master rather than a touch screen on an iPhone. Some
still believe, to this day, that blind people should not and cannot use touch
screens. Unfortunately, the company behind Strap is not as financially well off
as Apple is, and many companies in this space don't do well not only because of
concepts that didn't translate well into the real world, although that is
certainly part of it, but also because of negative feedback from blind people
that are so resistant to change, so resistant to anything different, that they
literally have to be dragged kicking and screaming to begin to accept that
something might be useful.
As was clearly stated, this is a pre-order. This is not a product which has
been on the market for years. Some will wait and will not adopt the technology.
Completely understandable. The promo code is not for you, although you will
likely pay more for waiting. For early adopters, this offer is worth the
consideration, even if for no other reason than to support the innovations that
we as a community, whether we realize it or not, need.
Finally, the replacement of the White Cane is polarizing. I, along with
others I've spoken to, believe strongly that the cane does need replacing. Yet I
will also tell you, and I'm sure the Strap developers would as well, that this
is an incredibly lofty goal, unlikely to be met by the first iteration. If you
are happy with your cane, you are proud of it, you see it as a status symbol,
nobody will take it away from you. If you are happy using a dog, nobody will
take that away from you. If you are looking for an alternative, this device may
be worth trying, and this discount may be worth exploring. It certainly may be
worth learning about, at any rate, and that may mean reaching out to podcasters
who have met with the developers, it may mean listening to podcasts and checking
out the website of Strap, it may mean reaching out to the company directly to
get questions answered, etc. Hopefully, it doesn't mean spouting more garbage on
this, or other groups, without an understanding of the product, without doing
any kind of research, based on a short announcement with a promo code. And
hopefully, if you don't like the idea of a cane replacement, you can move past
that concept and on to the benefits that such a product may or may not have on
your independence and mobility needs.
For anyone wishing to discuss this further, hopefully without judgement and
without the misinformation and fear that Gene is so good at providing, please
join the BlindTechGuys mailing list, mailto:blindtechguys%2Bsubscribe@...
where you can interact with others in the community, ask your tech-related
questions, join in on community events via Zoom, Telegram, and Whatsapp, check
out our Facebook group, and get announcements of upcoming podcast episodes as
On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 4:43 AM Joe Orozco <jsoro824@...
Love the thought-provoking discussion! I'm not opposed to
Yet, having participated in several user testing groups where
was to improve navigation for the blind, I see years later that
of them endured beyond the prototype. I won't pretend to
intelligent enough to understand why that is, but there is
to be said for old methods like cane or dog that are fundamental
any future technology to be successful. A guide dog user cannot, in
opinion, be truly successful if they are not a strong cane user.
would assume an individual would not fully excel with
technology if they could not navigate successfully with a dog.
maybe the aim should not be to replace proven methods, but
enhance them. It would go a long way in earning the trust of the
community and better help the developers understand what the
pain points might be for the blind traveler. I do applaud the
thinking. I see nothing wrong with pushing the
On 5/6/21, val and david paul <valanddavidp@...> wrote:
> Well said
> On 06/05/2021 08:46, Gene wrote:
>> And I just
thought of another reason that this device is a bad idea.
>> It is
safer to be seen and known to be a blind person. Perhaps you
will get assistance more easily when you want it such as when
>> a street with turning arrows and a lot of high speed
>> [Perhaps you will have an easier time getting
directions. When I walk
>> into a store, if service people see
the cane, they will offer help.
>> How will they know I am blind as
easily and as quickly if it isn’t
>> made clear by a cane or a
dog? If you don’t have a cane, people won’t
>> know you are
blind. This strikes me as an attempt to hide a person’s
blindness. I don’t want to hide it. I am what I am and it
>> be hidden.
>> *From:* Gene <mailto:gsasner@...>
>> *Sent:* Thursday, May 06,
2021 2:39 AM
>> *To:* main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
>> *Subject:* Re:
[TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount
>> The car and horse
analogy doesn’t apply. The advantages are obvious
>> of a
car. What advantage does the cane replacement company offer?
Only one, that you can travel hands free. I don’t consider that
>> spending 250 dollars for.
>> You yourself say that
a dog gives you less information about your
People may be satisfied with that and that’s their
>> choice but I
really doubt that you are going to find many competent
>> cane users
who will substitute a 250 dollar device for a thirty-five
device when the 35 dollar device gives them more information.
people who use a dog may have reasons they are willing to accept
less information. There are reasons people prefer dogs. But this
>> not a discussion about replacing dogs with this device.
The device is
>> offered as a replacement for the cane. I doubt
many competent cane
>> users will pay 250 dollars for a device that
probably gives them less
>> I have no
trouble carrying what I want to carry with one hand using a
cane. I use larger bags. Others may prefer a back pack.
far as things like the cane breaking or a tip falling off, I’ve
been traveling with canes for about fifty years and such things
>> almost never happened. And you have no basis to assume
>> device will be as reliable. What if you forget to
charge it. Is the
>> battery user replaceable? If not,
how much will it cost to replace it?
>> And any prudent blind person
who doesn’t use a dog should be a skilled
>> cane user anyway so that
in case of trouble with the device, he/she
>> can switch to a low
tech device that works very well while the problem
corrected. I have an emergency cane. Having two canes costs
>> perhaps sixty dollars. People aren’t going to have two of
>> devices when they cost 250 dollars.
>> As I said, I
don’t object to a device that informs me about obstacles
>> above the
lefvel of the cane. I do object to the attitude that the
cane should be replaced and likely by something inferior.
>> -----Original Message-----
>> *From:* Nimer Jaber
>> *Sent:* Thursday, May
06, 2021 2:16 AM
>> *To:* email@example.com <mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org>
>> *Subject:* Re:
[TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount
>> This post is my opinion,
and is not affiliated with Strap or any other
>> entity. All opinions
in this message are my own.
>> People said the same
thing that you're saying about horses, too. And
>> yet, we are now
>> Guide dogs already take away much of what the cane
gives you, and dog
>> users are quite content being dog users. With a
dog, blind people go
>> around obstacles, they don't interact with
every obstacle in their path.
>> Does it count when a blind person
disparages the cane and says that we
>> need more innovation in the
space to get rid of the bloody thing?
>> Because I am one of those
>> Does it count that I want to be able to travel
unencumbered with both
>> hands free?
>> Does it count if I
want to not worry about whether someone trips over
>> my cane and
breaks it? Or if the tip flies off the cane?
>> Does it matter if I
don't want to worry about what happens to my upper
>> body because
that trusty cane doesn't protect it while I'm walking?
believe me, running into scaffolding bloody hurts, and yes,
>> Does it matter if I want to be able to actually walk in a
>> line? Because, short of tapping against a wall or grass
>> isn't a way to do it with a cane.
>> Does it
matter if I wish to traverse through a crowded downtown area,
any crowded environment without running into many things?
>> Does it
matter if I want to be inconspicuous, and not be asked whether
a poor blind man, require assistance to wipe my ass? Because that
is essentially what happens to every single blind person I know. I
>> not approached about my work. I am not approached about my
>> I am not approached about my shoes. I am not
approached about anything
>> except my blindness and someone wanting
to help me because they think
>> I am making a mistake trying to
cross a street.
>> So, sorry, but we definitely need a cane
replacement, in my view, and
>> any blind person disagreeing is,
frankly, a complete and utter fool.
>> And, I would ask blind people
to support the effort instead of
>> shitting on it, because
developers should be encouraged to innovate,
>> not be discouraged by
stupid posts like the one I've just read.
>> Does that mean that
Strap will, indeed, replace the cane? I don't
>> know, probably not.
But it's a much better attempt than we've seen so
>> far, with others
trying to reinvent the cane by making it heavier and
sensors to it.
>> So, I would say, support the effort. Stand by and
watch, if you wish.
>> But don't get in the way of what is possibly
the most progress we've
>> seen in a long time. We have cars that
zoom on the roads autonomously.
>> We have planes that can take off
and land themselves. We have trains
>> that can do the same, with
minimal to no human interaction. We have
>> probes going into deep
space sending back pictures of Mars. And yet,
>> the best the blind
people can do, is fight to use their canes, and say
>> they're proud
of their canes.
>> I say again, if you don't or can't help, and you
don't support the
>> effort, with the nicest and most respectful
intent possible, get the
>> hell out of the way, sit down and shut
up, and don't stop innovation
>> and progress.
>> And with
that, I will no longer engage in this thread, because I can
that more stupidity will be posted, and more people will come out
proud to be carrying a stick.
>> On Wed, May 5, 2021 at 11:57 PM Gene
>> Isn’t it interesting
how the cane is not respected and
>> because blind people use
it? I don’t see people trying to
eliminate cars because unassisted movement is a right and is
>> I’d like to see how expensive
this device is. I’d like to see how
long it runs on a charge. I’d like to see if it gives
>> information about my nearby environment
such as where a doorway is
>> to a building
or where there is grass to my left and where
>> grass is interrupted by a driveway,
which may be necessary for me
>> to find with
my cane to know where I turn to move toward
>> building and the counting of driveways
and walkways may be
>> necessary for me to
know when I’m turning at the right place.
Device after device has been made and they have none of them
>> widely adopted. Maybe there is
>> Blindness is considered a
tragedy and the ways blind people do
things are often disparaged, guilt by association. Some
>> blind people do things are neutral,
some inferior, some superior.
>> Will it be
replaced at some point by something superior?
>> knows. but its persistence and
wide use should give those who
>> chaff at
the bit to eliminate it pause.
>> As G.K.
>> “Don't ever take a fence
down until you know the reason it was put
>> *From:* Marco Curralejo
*Sent:* Thursday, May 06, 2021 1:39 AM
*Subject:* Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap
>> Three years in the
making, STRAP is an innovative, wearable
>> that fits over the chest and is
designed to detect any type of
STRAP’s vast array of sensors work by sending
>> information that detects
obstacles at your head, chest, and below
your waist - including bumps, holes, and steps, then notifying
>> with haptic language vibrations.
Designed for all ages and shipped
later this year.
>> At STRAP
Technologies we believe autonomy and independence
>> human rights; not luxuries. Our goal
is to be the first
>> replacement of the
white cane, giving the visually impaired a
>> overdue hands free
>> Use code BlindTech
strap.tech, for 50% off the current total
>> of a STRAP device. Preorder today at
this discounted price of $250
>> and pay only
$50 at this time to reserve your STRAP. Once STRAP
>> shipped to you, you will be billed the
remaining $200. This offer
>> is just
available with this Blind Tech Guys
>> The Blind Tech Guys
>> offer you the above exclusive code and
we are delighted to share
>> this with our
ever-growing community, so if you are keen to
>> this product, we encourage you to
pre-order it and keep an eye out
>> for a
demo of the product to hit your ears sometime
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