Date   

Re: Cost of New IPhone

Gene
 

I said in another message that I wasn't talking about cellular phones.  Not as clear voice transmission?  That is an incorrect overgeneralization, since we are talking about cellular phones. 
Some companies provide better sound quality than others.  I've heard plenty of good voice quality with cellular phones. 
 
And fiber optic voip phone service, as my phone company provides it, is identical in quality and volume to copper phone service.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 5:41 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

 
You claim that signing up for Lifelock protection is like an insurance policy.  Well, for me maintaining my land line service is an insurance policy.  According to you, the probability of a natural disaster striking a major metropolitan area is low, so why hang on to antiquated technology?  Well, nobody ever thought Hurricane Sandy would cause such catastrophic damage in a city like New York.  Nobody ever thought they would see rowboats floating along lower Broadway near the Battery.  But it happened.  And many experts insist that it could happen again because of climate change, which the current president dismisses as a hoax.  There is currently no cell phone on the market that is as reliable as a land line phone tethered to an underground copper wire network, nor is there any cell phone that provides loud and clear sound quality comparable to a land line phone.  So stick to your cell phone if it makes you feel safe and secure. I’ll stick to my reliable land line phone.
 
Gerald
 
  
From: Gene
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 7:01 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone
 
your ability to sling ad homanem arguments on completely unrelated subjects is astounding and reduces your arguments, whether valid or not by making them petty and vinddictave, and inaccurate.  I now use Life Lock.  I signed up with them because it appeared to me that my former service was not as thorough.  I'm willing to consider alternatives as I get more information.  for example, I've read argguments that taking steps such as freezing your credit bureau accounts and taking a few other actions may render credit protection of considerably less importance and that it may be that credit protection isn't particularly useful.  Which side is right?  I don't know.  Is either side right?  I don't know.  but at this time, I choose to spend some money for what may be protection that may be of some value.  That isn't paranoia.  It may not be necessary, but hardly paranoid.  but to say that I can't live without something is simply an ad hominem argument and is completely unrelated to the subject we are discussing.
 
Now, to return to the subject we were discussing:
Things may have changed.  A year or two ago, I read articles about the soon to come demise of the old copper system.  Your information is worth considering and may indicate that the copper system will be around longer than was previously thought.  But it's dying, whether a faster or a slower death. 
 
The extreme what ifs are hardly a proper way to determine how to spend money by businesses or governments or people.  What if this horrible very low probability event occurred?  What if that very unlikely low probability ev ent occurred?  Before you know it, we would be personally bankrupt and bankrupt as a country by preparing for every single what if event. 
 
If you want to use the copper network and if others do, fine.  But you aren't assessing the risks and benefits.  There may be certain parts of the country that are more prone to disasters where it makes more sense to do so.  But saying, in general, that people should cling to the old copper network, paying considerably more money each month for slower Internet service than if they switch to fiber optic service if they don't live in high probability disaster areas, is simply not rational cost/benefit analysis.  Chicago, new York City, Madison Wisconsin, and so on, are low probability candidates for the kinds of terrible disasters you are worried about.  Yet you cling to the copper network because of a low or very low probability "what if." 
 
What about emergency generators to keep your modem working and kieep your phone service during emergencies?  What about the battery backup feature you can get for disasters?  I don't know if the battery backup runs down even if you don't use the service or if you can stretch it out for a long time if you use it sparingly. 
 
To take another example, I live on the third floor of a building that has stairs.  there is a very low probability that I'll fall down the stairs.  Should I not live in the building for that reason when there are many things aoub t the building and the community I like?  Just seizing on one possible problem or known deficiency to the exclusion of all sorts of other factors is not proper decision-making.  It is elevating one possibility over everything else and not doing any sort of cost/benefit analysis nor considering whether the probability is high enough to be worth worrying about.  and all sorts of decisions people make every day are based on probabilities, whether they consider them consciously or not.  Is it worth the risk of crossing a street to go somewhere when you consider the low probability of me being hit by a car when compared with the benefits of crossing the street?  and so on for decision after decision.
 
there is the very low probability of such a disaster in the area where you live and there is also the very low probability that you will have a heart attack or a stroke or some other such emergency while service is out.  If you want to spend perhaps forty dollars more a month for the combination of much slower Internet speed and standard phone service, which except for the possibility of loss during a disaster, is indistinguishable in quality from fiber optic service, that's your privelege.  But advocating repeatedly that everyone should have this fear and that it is on its face, without question, the correct decision and policy all over the country is just wrong. 
 
Have you seen what happens to your beloved phone service during a disaster or some sort of more or less emergency?  During the 1967 blizzard in Chicago, as a teenager, I saw how people had to wait often minutes for a dial tone during the first day or two of the extreme blizzard.  The system was overloaded.  So don't assume that just having wired service is some sort of paradise during disaster. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----

Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 4:35 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone
 
 
You are totally wrong about this issue.  For a blind person living alone, especially seniors with medical and physical problems, having reliable phone service in an emergency is absolutely essential, and could mean the difference between life and death. What if you suddenly had a heart attack or stroke?  How would you summon help if you don’t have a working phone?  Do you really believe that this could never happen to you?  Well, it happened to dozens of people in New Orleans, most of them disabled or seniors or both  after Hurricane Katrina who died because they did not have working phones to get help.  And contrary to your unfounded assertion, copper wiring isn’t going to be replaced in many parts of the country for many years, if ever.  It turns out that Verizon underestimated the cost of installing fiber optic cable in many urban areas, and in some cases has even renegged on contractual obligations to install it.  Here in New York, Verizon has abandoned plans too install fiber optic cable in all parts of the city, which is suing them for breach of contract.  And the state public service commision has forbidden them from removing copper wiring and replacing it with fiber optic cable: they must keep the copper wiring in place if they want to also install fiber optic cable. So I expect reliable copper wiring to be around where I live for a very long time.  And as long as we’re on the subject of paranoia, you’re the one who can’t live without Lifeloc “protection”, a service of dubious value from a company that has been heavily fined by the FTC for engaging in fraudulent and deceptive business practices.
 
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 4:10 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone
 
Maybe those people have much more to worry about than phone service.  And if you live in areas not prone to natural disasters putting ttoo much emphasis on this possibility is misplaced luddite paranoia.  It's like the old get a horse crowd.  If something so severe occurs in an area that power is lost and may be lost for weeks, for a lot, perhaps most people, being able to make calls would be, I would think a distant problem compared for example, to getting fresh watter, getting food, and perhaps finding a tolerable shelter. 
 
And sooner or later, it will be academic anyway.  the old archaic copper network is going to be completely shut down.  already, so many people have stopped using it that it is unreasonably costly to maintain per user.  I wouldn't be surprised if no more copper networks exist within three to four years. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 11:44 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone
 

Good for him!  Millions of people who live in Florida and Texas who now have
no power, and may not have it restored for weeks probably regret giving up
their reliable copper-wire land line phones in favor of cell phones that
they cannot use until the power is restored and the cell towers rebuilt.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Carolyn Arnold
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 12:14 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

I'd dump that thing today, but my husband wants to keep the thing.

Best from,

Carolyn

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Gerald Levy
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 11:23 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone


But what about the cost of your land line phone?

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Carolyn Arnold
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 11:14 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

We can get two lines at Consumer, and our AARP membership for about $40 for
the two lines plus tax, of course, about $45 a month. I have a few friends
who has it and are very satisfied with performance and service.

Best from,

Carolyn


-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of
heather albright
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 11:07 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

No just sign up for the membership threw the main site. It is 10 dollars but
it will take like over 100 dollars off the phone. My plan was like 130 but,
I only pay 105 a month. So add the savings 1560 1260 equals 300 a year you
can save. Heather



Heather Albright
Blindness is a characteristic, not a handicap!" Dr. Kenneth Jernigan ham
call sign:
kd5cbl
e-mail:
kd5cbl@...



From: Peter Spitz <mailto:peter.a.spitz@...>
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 9:56 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone



OK, this is a stupid question but do you have to be a member of the

NFB to qualify for the discount?



Peter



On 9/13/17, heather albright <kd5cbl@...> wrote:

> That is why I have te-mobile and the NFB discount. Now my mom is over 55
> so

> she wants to sign us for that plan for unlimited for 60 for two lines. If

> you have more than one line and over age 55 or if the other person is over

> 55, I highly recommend this plan. It is 60 no taxes. Cheers Heather

>

> Heather Albright

> Blindness is a characteristic, not a handicap!" Dr. Kenneth Jernigan

> ham call sign:

> kd5cbl

> e-mail:

> kd5cbl@...

>

> From: Carolyn Arnold

> Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 9:42 AM

> To: main@TechTalk.groups.io

> Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

>

> Yet my Verizon bill is as high as when I started with the

> iPhone 4S that supposedly was a penny or 99 cents, I can't

> remember which, but less than a dollar. So I checked with

> Verizon to see if the two of us could go cheaper now, over

> three years later with prepaid - no go, same price.

>

> Best from,

>

> Carolyn

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: main@TechTalk.groups.io

> [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Pablo Morales

> Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 7:30 AM

> To: main@TechTalk.groups.io

> Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

>

> Yes, they do. When every month they have problems to pay

> their bills, or when they try to buy something and they

> can't save money is when they notice it. The problem is that

> they are not understanding how works this business.

> We notice it, but whe are not thinking why it happen.

>

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: main@TechTalk.groups.io

> [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Pamela

> Dominguez

> Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2017 5:14 PM

> To: main@TechTalk.groups.io

> Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

>

> Most people don't notice that, or they don't seem to care,

> as long as they don't see the price all at once.  Pam.

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Rob Hudson

> Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2017 5:01 PM

> To: main@TechTalk.groups.io

> Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

>

> Carlos <carlos1106@...> wrote:

>> Most people get an iPhone the same way they get any other

> expensive

>> smart phone, as part of a contract or deal with the cell

> provider.

>

> Yeah but then you get gouged with interest and other

> surcharges, which makes the phone more expensive over the

> term of the contract lol. So it's probably cheaper

> relatively speaking to just plunk down your credit card and

> go on that canned tuna diet.

>

>

>

>

> ---

> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.

> http://www.avg.com

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

















 




Re: old menu structure for new versions of office

Carlos
 

As usual Gerald is quick to criticize and dismiss others opinions, but the minute you question some of his own attitudes, he accuses you of attacking him.  His dislike of ribbons just gives him something else to add to the long list of things that blind people supposedly either can't use well or can't do at all.

----- Original Message -----
From: Gene
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 8:33 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] old menu structure for new versions of office

I always like to see people discouraging blind people from developing into more competent and confident computer users just because they don't like a feature.  I already sent an article to the list, did you read it, which explains that the JAWS Virtual ribbons are not as good an interface as ribbons and explains why in specific detail with an example or two.  If you don't like ribbons, fine.  If you want to discuss what you don't like about them, fine.  That's different from actively discouraging people from trying something new and from learning the feature.  And that's different from attacking those who encourage trying things you don't like and impuning their motives. 
 
Actively discouraging others from learning them is not a good idea. 
And we all know who you are insulting with your description of me as high and mighty.  Another ad hominem attack, which I discussed your propensity for yesterday.  I am not advocating that people use or at least try using ribbons out of what you term a high and mighty attitude.  I'm doing so because the real ribbons had certain advantages, if you use the JAWS virtual ribbons you are becoming dependent on JAWS and if you want to switch or consider switching to another screen-reader, you will be less likely to do so, and because if you don't try new things, you may not be as competent and confident a computer user in general.  I just love people who actively discourage others from learning and trying new things, especially those who discourage blind computer users from doing so.  Many blind people don't have the confidence it would be good if they had as blind computer users.  Trying new things may increase that confidence.  You never answered the specific objections to ribbons in the article I linked to on the subject about a week ago.  You never said, I tried this objection to see if it is right and it is or it isn't.  You never explained why the author's objections and mine to discouraging the use of real ribbons is incorrect.
 
And your attack completely backfired.  I wasn't going to comment on this thread at all but your insults caused me to decide to do so.  I wasn't going to comment because I had discussed everything I had to say about ribbons when the subject  came up about a week ago and I saw no reason to repeat what I had said.  But of course, without even waiting to see if I wrote anything in the thread, you just had to both attack me and actively discourage learning and trying something new.
 
Gene
----- Original Messsage -----
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 5:37 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] old menu structure for new versions of office


You can restore the familiar classic menu structure by enabling the JAWS
virtual ribbon feature. To do this, launch the JAWS Help menu, and scroll
down to the Start-Up wizard.  On the third page of the Start Up wizard,
check the box to enable virtual ribbons and click on the Okay button.  The
menus in Outlook will now appear like the classic menus you are familiar
with.  And don't let anyone discourage you from trying this feature because
of their high and mighty attitude that it is better to learn how to navigate
the ribbon menus than sticking with what you are comfortable with.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Jeffrey Schwartz
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 10:03 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] old menu structure for new versions of office

They don't have to be free.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Robert Kingett
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 10:05 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] old menu structure for new versions of office

I do not know any free ones, sorry!


--
Robert Kingett, journalist. View my website below.<p></p><p><br></p><p>[view
my website here](www.blindjournalist.wordpress.com)<br></p><p><br></p>





 




Re: old menu structure for new versions of office

Gerald Levy
 

 
Jeff has reiterated that he is not comfortable with ribbon menus.  Because he is  a senior citizen, maybe he is just not comfortable learning new ways of doing things.  Stop being so intolerant of other list members and pretending that you know what’s best for them.  .  If he prefers classic menus, that is his perogative.     
 
Gerald
 
 
 

From: Gene
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 8:33 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] old menu structure for new versions of office
 
I always like to see people discouraging blind people from developing into more competent and confident computer users just because they don't like a feature.  I already sent an article to the list, did you read it, which explains that the JAWS Virtual ribbons are not as good an interface as ribbons and explains why in specific detail with an example or two.  If you don't like ribbons, fine.  If you want to discuss what you don't like about them, fine.  That's different from actively discouraging people from trying something new and from learning the feature.  And that's different from attacking those who encourage trying things you don't like and impuning their motives. 
 
Actively discouraging others from learning them is not a good idea. 
And we all know who you are insulting with your description of me as high and mighty.  Another ad hominem attack, which I discussed your propensity for yesterday.  I am not advocating that people use or at least try using ribbons out of what you term a high and mighty attitude.  I'm doing so because the real ribbons had certain advantages, if you use the JAWS virtual ribbons you are becoming dependent on JAWS and if you want to switch or consider switching to another screen-reader, you will be less likely to do so, and because if you don't try new things, you may not be as competent and confident a computer user in general.  I just love people who actively discourage others from learning and trying new things, especially those who discourage blind computer users from doing so.  Many blind people don't have the confidence it would be good if they had as blind computer users.  Trying new things may increase that confidence.  You never answered the specific objections to ribbons in the article I linked to on the subject about a week ago.  You never said, I tried this objection to see if it is right and it is or it isn't.  You never explained why the author's objections and mine to discouraging the use of real ribbons is incorrect.
 
And your attack completely backfired.  I wasn't going to comment on this thread at all but your insults caused me to decide to do so.  I wasn't going to comment because I had discussed everything I had to say about ribbons when the subject  came up about a week ago and I saw no reason to repeat what I had said.  But of course, without even waiting to see if I wrote anything in the thread, you just had to both attack me and actively discourage learning and trying something new.
 
Gene
----- Original Messsage -----
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 5:37 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] old menu structure for new versions of office
 

You can restore the familiar classic menu structure by enabling the JAWS
virtual ribbon feature. To do this, launch the JAWS Help menu, and scroll
down to the Start-Up wizard.  On the third page of the Start Up wizard,
check the box to enable virtual ribbons and click on the Okay button.  The
menus in Outlook will now appear like the classic menus you are familiar
with.  And don't let anyone discourage you from trying this feature because
of their high and mighty attitude that it is better to learn how to navigate
the ribbon menus than sticking with what you are comfortable with.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Jeffrey Schwartz
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 10:03 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] old menu structure for new versions of office

They don't have to be free.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Robert Kingett
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 10:05 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] old menu structure for new versions of office

I do not know any free ones, sorry!


--
Robert Kingett, journalist. View my website below.<p></p><p><br></p><p>[view
my website here](www.blindjournalist.wordpress.com)<br></p><p><br></p>





 




Re: old menu structure for new versions of office

Ann Parsons
 

Hi all,

RE ribbons, scarlet or otherwise, I just use the ribbons in their natural state. It's not difficult. It's not arcane or mysterious. It's just like the regular menus except that they're arranged somewhat differently.

Agree the virtual ribbons increase dependency on Jaws, but if that's the only screen reader being used, and there's no employment or educational goals, they work just fine.

Ann P.

--
Ann K. Parsons
Portal Tutoring
** New EMAIL: akp@...
web site: http://www.portaltutoring.info
Skype: Putertutor

"All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost."


Re: Cost of New IPhone

Gene
 

And if an asteroid had struck the earth, she might be dead as well.  All these low probability ifs piled on top of other low probability ifs.  Don't ever cross any streets.  What if a car runs a light while you are crossing?  What if a manhole is left uncovered, you don't use your cane properly, and you fall partway into a manhole and injure yourself.  What if, as you are extracting yourself from the manhole and dragging yourself toward the other side of the street with a sprained anckle, a truck hits you?  One very low probability event or if, as I've been calling them, piled on another.  It's a wonder anyone on earth is still alive. 
 
I haven't looked up information on this but it's probably much more likely that you will be hit by a car while crossing a street than that you will just happen to have a heart attack or a stroke at just the time a disaster has knocked out other than old copper wire land line communication.  Yet I don't see you advising people not to cross streets.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 5:38 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone


And if your friend's cell phone had run out of juice and she suffered a
heart attack and couldn't call for help, she would be dead now.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Carolyn Arnold
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 7:33 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

I've talked to all four of my Houston contacts on their cells. In fact, when
one of them was without power, she had no hard connection, so cordless was
out. I told her I'd hang up, for her to call me when she could, but save her
cell battery for necessity. She was three and a half days without power, but
by sparing her phone as much as possible, she did not lose phone power. I
didn't think to ask her how long it took her to recharge the thing.

Best from,

Carolyn

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Gerald Levy
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 6:23 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone


No mobile phone will ever be as reliable as a land line phone that is
tethered to an underground copper wire network.  In a major storm, the cell
phone towers are often knocked out, so a mobile phone would be useless, even
if you could charge it, which you might not be able to do, anyway.  After
Hurricane Sandy, thousands of people had no cell phone service for weeks
because of damage to cell phone towers and power outages caused by
catastrophic flooding. And the same thing is happening right now in Florida
and Texas.

Gerald



From: Joseph Hudson <mailto:jhud7789@...>
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 5:33 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

So we won't, because it relies on the Internet. But luckily, if you have a
mobile phone, and you have it forwarded to that device or if you have a way
of forwarding it through another means of Internet, then you can still
receive your calls.


Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 13, 2017, at 11:44 AM, Gerald Levy <bwaylimited@...
<mailto:bwaylimited@...> > wrote:




And what happens if you lose power like millions of people in Florida and
Texas?  Will Majic Jack still work?

Gerald



-----Original Message----- From: Peter Spitz
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 12:01 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

Gerald:

For mylandline, I use MagicJack and think it's a great cheap
alternative.  It's a great basic landline phone and it's dirt cheap.

On 9/13/17, heather albright <kd5cbl@... <mailto:kd5cbl@...> >
wrote:


That is why I have te-mobile and the NFB discount. Now my mom is over 55 so


she wants to sign us for that plan for unlimited for 60 for two lines. If


you have more than one line and over age 55 or if the other person is over


55, I highly recommend this plan. It is 60 no taxes. Cheers Heather





Heather Albright


Blindness is a characteristic, not a handicap!" Dr. Kenneth Jernigan


ham call sign:


kd5cbl


e-mail:


kd5cbl@... <mailto:kd5cbl@...>





From: Carolyn Arnold


Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 9:42 AM


To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>


Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone





Yet my Verizon bill is as high as when I started with the


iPhone 4S that supposedly was a penny or 99 cents, I can't


remember which, but less than a dollar. So I checked with


Verizon to see if the two of us could go cheaper now, over


three years later with prepaid - no go, same price.





Best from,





Carolyn





-----Original Message-----


From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>


[mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Pablo Morales


Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 7:30 AM


To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>


Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone





Yes, they do. When every month they have problems to pay


their bills, or when they try to buy something and they


can't save money is when they notice it. The problem is that


they are not understanding how works this business.


We notice it, but whe are not thinking why it happen.








-----Original Message-----


From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>


[mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Pamela


Dominguez


Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2017 5:14 PM


To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>


Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone





Most people don't notice that, or they don't seem to care,


as long as they don't see the price all at once.  Pam.





-----Original Message-----


From: Rob Hudson


Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2017 5:01 PM


To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>


Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone





Carlos <carlos1106@... <mailto:carlos1106@...> > wrote:


Most people get an iPhone the same way they get any other


expensive


smart phone, as part of a contract or deal with the cell


provider.





Yeah but then you get gouged with interest and other


surcharges, which makes the phone more expensive over the


term of the contract lol. So it's probably cheaper


relatively speaking to just plunk down your credit card and


go on that canned tuna diet.














---


This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.


http://www.avg.com






















































 




Esata Enclosure not Turning on

Rob Hudson <rob_hudson_3182@...>
 

A couple of weeks ago, I picked up this device:
Mediasonic PROBOX 4 Bay 3.5" SATA Hard Drive Enclosure - USB 3.0 & eSATA Support 10TB HDD (HF7-SU3S3)
However, the esata portion is not working. That is, no drives show up in Explorer. if i plug it in via SB, it works fine.
Research shows me that you have to switch modes from USB to esata on the enclosure. There are four buttons on the unit. But research also only shows me that you have to look for the lit up indicators to tell you what modes the unit is on.
Does anybody have an enclosure like this and can advise?


Re: AT&T Land Line Phone Service In Il.

Gene
 

When is the last time you heard of a disaster in Chicago that caused phone service to be disrupted?  I've lived in the city most of my life.  I'm a baby boomer.  There has never been a major disaster here.  A straw man argument. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 5:38 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] AT&T Land Line Phone Service In Il.

 
Pity the poor residents of Illinois.  Thank goodness, Verizon has been blocked from abandoning its copper wire network in New York.  It is especially sad that in cities like Chicago, where violent crime is rampant, residents may lose their only reliable means of calling for help.
 
Gerald
 
 
 
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 7:58 PM
Subject: [TechTalk] AT&T Land Line Phone Service In Il.
 

AT&T landline   service in Illinois to end, pending FCC approval

Published                                                                                       July 05, 2017

Fox News

Illinois residents whose sole method of electronic communication is through landline phones may soon need to rethink their methods. 

A bill allowing AT&T to disconnect its remaining 1.2 million landline customers throughout the state was passed in the General Assembly on Saturday, according

to the

Chicago Tribune.

The approval overrode Republican Gov. Bruce Rauner's veto of the legislation.

AT&T has been pushing for legislation to end landline phone service to focus on “modern alternatives.” The phone company claims it loses about 5,000 landline

customers in Illinois each week, but critics say the new law adversely affects those who have no choice but to rely on landlines.

 

"If AT&T succeeds in ending traditional landline phone service, we think that will hurt people — particularly seniors and those with medical conditions

— who depend on a landline as their most reliable link to vital services," Jim Chilsen, the spokesman for watchdog group Citizens Utility Board, told the

Tribune.

AT&T will need approval from the Federal Communications Commission to effectively end its landline telephone service, but the company has already successfully

passed similar legislation in 19 of the 20 states where it is the legacy phone service.

 

AT&T, by law, is now required to notify its customers statewide before petitioning to the FCC. Customers who believe that landlines are their only practical

method of communication will be able to appeal to the Illinois Commerce Commission.

 

CELL PHONES OUTNUMBER LANDLINE USERS FOR FIRST TIME

 

After reassuring customers in a statement Wednesday that their landline service isn’t “going away anytime soon,” AT&T Illinois president Paul La Schiazza

reiterated that the company still provides landline phone service.

 

"We value our customers, and we want to keep them," La Schiazza said. "While most customers are enjoying updated technologies today, including wireless

service and modern landline service, AT&T currently continues to sell and provide traditional landline phone service to our customers." 

 

 


Re: Cost of New IPhone

Gerald Levy
 

 
Yes, there are pendant-like devices designed mainly for senior citizens who live alone that they can  where around their neck all day and can use to summon emergency help simply by pressing a button.  Saturday Night Live used to poke fun at these gizmos, especially the commercial for the one in which an old lady blurts, “help! I’ve fallen and I can’t get up”.  But this is no laughing matter.  They cost “only a dollar a day for peace of mind”, according to their commercials.  But do the math, and this works out to over $300 a year, which isn’t exactly cheap.    And it is unclear how well these emergency alert devices work in an actual emergency when the power is out.
 
Gerald
 
 
 

Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 7:49 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone
 

Gerald,

That’s a great idea to have a cell phone just in case of an emergency.  That’s the only reason I have the Magic Jack phone for too.  I’ve heard of some people who wear something around their neck just in case they fall, but I’m not sure of the exact name though.   That is supposed to also help in an emergency. 

Janet

, .

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 6:33 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

 

 

I have a cell phone for emergencies, just in case my land line service is disrupted.  Don’t laugh, but my cell phone is a 12 year old LG VZ4650 that still works because I rarely use it, and so the battery hasn’t died yet.  Oh sure, it probably belongs in the Smithsonian.  But at least I can make calls using voice commands, so I don’t have to futz around with the keypad, which at least has tactile buttons, albeit on the tiny side.  And to answer a call, I just have to flip it open without fumbling around a touchpad.  And with Page Plus Cellular, I only pay $30 a year to keep it activated.  Since I almost never use it, I have over 6 hours of accumulated air time.

 

Gerald

 

 

 

From: janet gross

 

Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 7:20 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

 

Gerald,

There is that word if again.  What if this and what if that but what if this and what if that again!  I’ve been through that already with another list member, so that goes nowhere!  What if the world ended tomorrow? You could grab your land line, and I could grab my iPhone, and we both might be happy!  Lol! 

Janet

 

 

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 6:08 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

 

 

But if the power fails, your Magic Jack phone won’t be of any use.  So if there is a power failure, you might not be able to use either your cell phone or your Magic Jack phone.  Sure Magic Jack is cheap.  But you get what you pay for.  I have had land line service from Verizon and its predecessors for 67 years, and have experienced a disruption in service only once in all those years.  What cell phone service can match this record of reliability?

 

Gerald

 

 

 

From: janet gross

Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 6:50 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

 

Hey Gerald,

Aren’t we starting just a little to early for all this? Lol!  I have a Magic Jack phone just in case I lose my wonderful iPhone.  I would always have the Magic Jack for emergencies. 

Janet

 

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 5:41 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

 

 

You claim that signing up for Lifelock protection is like an insurance policy.  Well, for me maintaining my land line service is an insurance policy.  According to you, the probability of a natural disaster striking a major metropolitan area is low, so why hang on to antiquated technology?  Well, nobody ever thought Hurricane Sandy would cause such catastrophic damage in a city like New York.  Nobody ever thought they would see rowboats floating along lower Broadway near the Battery.  But it happened.  And many experts insist that it could happen again because of climate change, which the current president dismisses as a hoax.  There is currently no cell phone on the market that is as reliable as a land line phone tethered to an underground copper wire network, nor is there any cell phone that provides loud and clear sound quality comparable to a land line phone.  So stick to your cell phone if it makes you feel safe and secure. I’ll stick to my reliable land line phone.

 

Gerald

 

  

From: Gene

Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 7:01 PM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

 

your ability to sling ad homanem arguments on completely unrelated subjects is astounding and reduces your arguments, whether valid or not by making them petty and vinddictave, and inaccurate.  I now use Life Lock.  I signed up with them because it appeared to me that my former service was not as thorough.  I'm willing to consider alternatives as I get more information.  for example, I've read argguments that taking steps such as freezing your credit bureau accounts and taking a few other actions may render credit protection of considerably less importance and that it may be that credit protection isn't particularly useful.  Which side is right?  I don't know.  Is either side right?  I don't know.  but at this time, I choose to spend some money for what may be protection that may be of some value.  That isn't paranoia.  It may not be necessary, but hardly paranoid.  but to say that I can't live without something is simply an ad hominem argument and is completely unrelated to the subject we are discussing.

 

Now, to return to the subject we were discussing:

Things may have changed.  A year or two ago, I read articles about the soon to come demise of the old copper system.  Your information is worth considering and may indicate that the copper system will be around longer than was previously thought.  But it's dying, whether a faster or a slower death. 

 

The extreme what ifs are hardly a proper way to determine how to spend money by businesses or governments or people.  What if this horrible very low probability event occurred?  What if that very unlikely low probability ev ent occurred?  Before you know it, we would be personally bankrupt and bankrupt as a country by preparing for every single what if event. 

 

If you want to use the copper network and if others do, fine.  But you aren't assessing the risks and benefits.  There may be certain parts of the country that are more prone to disasters where it makes more sense to do so.  But saying, in general, that people should cling to the old copper network, paying considerably more money each month for slower Internet service than if they switch to fiber optic service if they don't live in high probability disaster areas, is simply not rational cost/benefit analysis.  Chicago, new York City, Madison Wisconsin, and so on, are low probability candidates for the kinds of terrible disasters you are worried about.  Yet you cling to the copper network because of a low or very low probability "what if." 

 

What about emergency generators to keep your modem working and kieep your phone service during emergencies?  What about the battery backup feature you can get for disasters?  I don't know if the battery backup runs down even if you don't use the service or if you can stretch it out for a long time if you use it sparingly. 

 

To take another example, I live on the third floor of a building that has stairs.  there is a very low probability that I'll fall down the stairs.  Should I not live in the building for that reason when there are many things aoub t the building and the community I like?  Just seizing on one possible problem or known deficiency to the exclusion of all sorts of other factors is not proper decision-making.  It is elevating one possibility over everything else and not doing any sort of cost/benefit analysis nor considering whether the probability is high enough to be worth worrying about.  and all sorts of decisions people make every day are based on probabilities, whether they consider them consciously or not.  Is it worth the risk of crossing a street to go somewhere when you consider the low probability of me being hit by a car when compared with the benefits of crossing the street?  and so on for decision after decision.

 

there is the very low probability of such a disaster in the area where you live and there is also the very low probability that you will have a heart attack or a stroke or some other such emergency while service is out.  If you want to spend perhaps forty dollars more a month for the combination of much slower Internet speed and standard phone service, which except for the possibility of loss during a disaster, is indistinguishable in quality from fiber optic service, that's your privelege.  But advocating repeatedly that everyone should have this fear and that it is on its face, without question, the correct decision and policy all over the country is just wrong. 

 

Have you seen what happens to your beloved phone service during a disaster or some sort of more or less emergency?  During the 1967 blizzard in Chicago, as a teenager, I saw how people had to wait often minutes for a dial tone during the first day or two of the extreme blizzard.  The system was overloaded.  So don't assume that just having wired service is some sort of paradise during disaster. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

 

From: Gerald Levy

Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 4:35 PM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

 

 

You are totally wrong about this issue.  For a blind person living alone, especially seniors with medical and physical problems, having reliable phone service in an emergency is absolutely essential, and could mean the difference between life and death. What if you suddenly had a heart attack or stroke?  How would you summon help if you don’t have a working phone?  Do you really believe that this could never happen to you?  Well, it happened to dozens of people in New Orleans, most of them disabled or seniors or both  after Hurricane Katrina who died because they did not have working phones to get help.  And contrary to your unfounded assertion, copper wiring isn’t going to be replaced in many parts of the country for many years, if ever.  It turns out that Verizon underestimated the cost of installing fiber optic cable in many urban areas, and in some cases has even renegged on contractual obligations to install it.  Here in New York, Verizon has abandoned plans too install fiber optic cable in all parts of the city, which is suing them for breach of contract.  And the state public service commision has forbidden them from removing copper wiring and replacing it with fiber optic cable: they must keep the copper wiring in place if they want to also install fiber optic cable. So I expect reliable copper wiring to be around where I live for a very long time.  And as long as we’re on the subject of paranoia, you’re the one who can’t live without Lifeloc “protection”, a service of dubious value from a company that has been heavily fined by the FTC for engaging in fraudulent and deceptive business practices.

 

Gerald

 

 

 

From: Gene

Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 4:10 PM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

 

Maybe those people have much more to worry about than phone service.  And if you live in areas not prone to natural disasters putting ttoo much emphasis on this possibility is misplaced luddite paranoia.  It's like the old get a horse crowd.  If something so severe occurs in an area that power is lost and may be lost for weeks, for a lot, perhaps most people, being able to make calls would be, I would think a distant problem compared for example, to getting fresh watter, getting food, and perhaps finding a tolerable shelter. 

 

And sooner or later, it will be academic anyway.  the old archaic copper network is going to be completely shut down.  already, so many people have stopped using it that it is unreasonably costly to maintain per user.  I wouldn't be surprised if no more copper networks exist within three to four years. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Gerald Levy

Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 11:44 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

 


Good for him!  Millions of people who live in Florida and Texas who now have
no power, and may not have it restored for weeks probably regret giving up
their reliable copper-wire land line phones in favor of cell phones that
they cannot use until the power is restored and the cell towers rebuilt.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Carolyn Arnold
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 12:14 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

I'd dump that thing today, but my husband wants to keep the thing.

Best from,

Carolyn

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Gerald Levy
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 11:23 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone


But what about the cost of your land line phone?

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Carolyn Arnold
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 11:14 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

We can get two lines at Consumer, and our AARP membership for about $40 for
the two lines plus tax, of course, about $45 a month. I have a few friends
who has it and are very satisfied with performance and service.

Best from,

Carolyn


-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of
heather albright
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 11:07 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

No just sign up for the membership threw the main site. It is 10 dollars but
it will take like over 100 dollars off the phone. My plan was like 130 but,
I only pay 105 a month. So add the savings 1560 1260 equals 300 a year you
can save. Heather



Heather Albright
Blindness is a characteristic, not a handicap!" Dr. Kenneth Jernigan ham
call sign:
kd5cbl
e-mail:
kd5cbl@...



From: Peter Spitz <mailto:peter.a.spitz@...>
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 9:56 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone



OK, this is a stupid question but do you have to be a member of the

NFB to qualify for the discount?



Peter



On 9/13/17, heather albright <kd5cbl@...> wrote:

> That is why I have te-mobile and the NFB discount. Now my mom is over 55
> so

> she wants to sign us for that plan for unlimited for 60 for two lines. If

> you have more than one line and over age 55 or if the other person is over

> 55, I highly recommend this plan. It is 60 no taxes. Cheers Heather

>

> Heather Albright

> Blindness is a characteristic, not a handicap!" Dr. Kenneth Jernigan

> ham call sign:

> kd5cbl

> e-mail:

> kd5cbl@...

>

> From: Carolyn Arnold

> Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 9:42 AM

> To: main@TechTalk.groups.io

> Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

>

> Yet my Verizon bill is as high as when I started with the

> iPhone 4S that supposedly was a penny or 99 cents, I can't

> remember which, but less than a dollar. So I checked with

> Verizon to see if the two of us could go cheaper now, over

> three years later with prepaid - no go, same price.

>

> Best from,

>

> Carolyn

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: main@TechTalk.groups.io

> [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Pablo Morales

> Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 7:30 AM

> To: main@TechTalk.groups.io

> Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

>

> Yes, they do. When every month they have problems to pay

> their bills, or when they try to buy something and they

> can't save money is when they notice it. The problem is that

> they are not understanding how works this business.

> We notice it, but whe are not thinking why it happen.

>

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: main@TechTalk.groups.io

> [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Pamela

> Dominguez

> Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2017 5:14 PM

> To: main@TechTalk.groups.io

> Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

>

> Most people don't notice that, or they don't seem to care,

> as long as they don't see the price all at once.  Pam.

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Rob Hudson

> Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2017 5:01 PM

> To: main@TechTalk.groups.io

> Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

>

> Carlos <carlos1106@...> wrote:

>> Most people get an iPhone the same way they get any other

> expensive

>> smart phone, as part of a contract or deal with the cell

> provider.

>

> Yeah but then you get gouged with interest and other

> surcharges, which makes the phone more expensive over the

> term of the contract lol. So it's probably cheaper

> relatively speaking to just plunk down your credit card and

> go on that canned tuna diet.

>

>

>

>

> ---

> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.

> http://www.avg.com

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

















 


Re: old menu structure for new versions of office

Gene
 

I always like to see people discouraging blind people from developing into more competent and confident computer users just because they don't like a feature.  I already sent an article to the list, did you read it, which explains that the JAWS Virtual ribbons are not as good an interface as ribbons and explains why in specific detail with an example or two.  If you don't like ribbons, fine.  If you want to discuss what you don't like about them, fine.  That's different from actively discouraging people from trying something new and from learning the feature.  And that's different from attacking those who encourage trying things you don't like and impuning their motives. 
 
Actively discouraging others from learning them is not a good idea. 
And we all know who you are insulting with your description of me as high and mighty.  Another ad hominem attack, which I discussed your propensity for yesterday.  I am not advocating that people use or at least try using ribbons out of what you term a high and mighty attitude.  I'm doing so because the real ribbons had certain advantages, if you use the JAWS virtual ribbons you are becoming dependent on JAWS and if you want to switch or consider switching to another screen-reader, you will be less likely to do so, and because if you don't try new things, you may not be as competent and confident a computer user in general.  I just love people who actively discourage others from learning and trying new things, especially those who discourage blind computer users from doing so.  Many blind people don't have the confidence it would be good if they had as blind computer users.  Trying new things may increase that confidence.  You never answered the specific objections to ribbons in the article I linked to on the subject about a week ago.  You never said, I tried this objection to see if it is right and it is or it isn't.  You never explained why the author's objections and mine to discouraging the use of real ribbons is incorrect.
 
And your attack completely backfired.  I wasn't going to comment on this thread at all but your insults caused me to decide to do so.  I wasn't going to comment because I had discussed everything I had to say about ribbons when the subject  came up about a week ago and I saw no reason to repeat what I had said.  But of course, without even waiting to see if I wrote anything in the thread, you just had to both attack me and actively discourage learning and trying something new.
 
Gene
----- Original Messsage -----

Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 5:37 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] old menu structure for new versions of office


You can restore the familiar classic menu structure by enabling the JAWS
virtual ribbon feature. To do this, launch the JAWS Help menu, and scroll
down to the Start-Up wizard.  On the third page of the Start Up wizard,
check the box to enable virtual ribbons and click on the Okay button.  The
menus in Outlook will now appear like the classic menus you are familiar
with.  And don't let anyone discourage you from trying this feature because
of their high and mighty attitude that it is better to learn how to navigate
the ribbon menus than sticking with what you are comfortable with.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Jeffrey Schwartz
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 10:03 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] old menu structure for new versions of office

They don't have to be free.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Robert Kingett
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 10:05 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] old menu structure for new versions of office

I do not know any free ones, sorry!


--
Robert Kingett, journalist. View my website below.<p></p><p><br></p><p>[view
my website here](www.blindjournalist.wordpress.com)<br></p><p><br></p>





 




Re: old menu structure for new versions of office

Robert Kingett <kingettr@...>
 

If you have a mac here is how to turn off the ribon.

https://support.office.com/en-us/article/Turn-off-or-turn-on-the-ribbon-4dce2753-6ccc-4fb2-bec2-44c24fea4999#bmwd

Here is a free add in that will put the menus back. Accessibility is fare, though. Not the best but it can be used with some trial and error.

http://www.ubit.ch/software/ubitmenu-languages/


--
Robert Kingett, journalist. View my website below.<p></p><p><br></p><p>[view my website here](www.blindjournalist.wordpress.com)<br></p><p><br></p>


Re: Cost of New IPhone

Ann Parsons
 

Hi all,

You've never heard of a QWERTY keyboard? That term's been around forever. Notetakers come in both Braille and QWERTY models. Naturally, the name comes from the keys on the third row up on a typewriter keyboard.

Ann P.

--
Ann K. Parsons
Portal Tutoring
** New EMAIL: akp@...
web site: http://www.portaltutoring.info
Skype: Putertutor

"All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost."


Re: Cost of New IPhone

Carlos
 

The Folder 2 is an Android phone so yes,TalkBack should work just fine. Although I believe Samsung has their own version of TalkBack which is probably what is included by default.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ann Parsons" <akp@...>
To: <main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 8:04 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone


Hi all,

So you'd put Talkback on it?

Ann P.

--
Ann K. Parsons
Portal Tutoring
** New EMAIL: akp@...
web site: http://www.portaltutoring.info
Skype: Putertutor

"All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost."


Re: AT&T Land Line Phone Service In Il.

Carlos
 

This is starting to stray off topic ladies and gentlemen.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Gerald Levy" <bwaylimited@...>
To: <main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 7:07 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] AT&T Land Line Phone Service In Il.



Yeah, Robb, you're right. It is sad that Chicago has one of the highest
rates of murder and other violent crime of any major city in the US. Just
ask the poor residents , many of whom are people of color and senior
citizens who live in crime-ridden housing projects and subsist on welfare
and food stamps whether their neighbors all have smart phones .

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Rob Hudson
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 6:51 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] AT&T Land Line Phone Service In Il.

janet gross <janet.harvard@...> wrote:
The pitiful residents of Chicago, will use their smart phones to call for help, but if they don’t have one, you can bet their friend or neighbor will have one!
That's if their neighbors give a damn about them in the first place. I
haven't been to Chicago except on the way to some place else, but from
talking to people who live there it's a cesspool, almost as bad as Detroit;
and who in their right mind wants to live in Detroit? Even the people who
live in Detroit don't want to be there.
Anyway. There are nice spots to live in Chicago, but you have to be as rich
as Donald Fracking Trump to afford them.


Re: Cost of New IPhone

Ann Parsons
 

Hi all,

So you'd put Talkback on it?

Ann P.

--
Ann K. Parsons
Portal Tutoring
** New EMAIL: akp@...
web site: http://www.portaltutoring.info
Skype: Putertutor

"All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost."


Re: Cell Phone Question?

Janet
 

Ann,
That's a great idea to take a cell with you when you go out because you
might need it just as much as you would at home. I take my iPhone with me
when I'm out.
I don't have anything against land line phones, but I can't afford to pay
for an iPhone and a land line phone.
Janet

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Ann Parsons
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 6:34 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cell Phone Question?

Hi all,

Having a cell phone, even a basic flip phone is a safety issue these days
for anyone, blind or sighted. I still have a landline which I use as my
main number, but I always take my cell when I go out.

Ann P.

--
Ann K. Parsons
Portal Tutoring
** New EMAIL: akp@...
web site: http://www.portaltutoring.info
Skype: Putertutor

"All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost."


Is there an NVDA Mailing list?

Howard Traxler <howard@...>
 

Good morning all.

I'm wondering if there is a mailing list specific to NVDA? I have some questions that maybe should be posted on such a list.

One I will post here is:

I have several vintage Braille displays (Navigator, PowerBraille, ALVA) that I'd like to use on my windows 10 machine using NVDA. Is anyone doing this successfully? If so, would you please describe the interface.

Thanks.

Howard


Re: Cost of New IPhone

Janet
 

Gerald,

That’s a great idea to have a cell phone just in case of an emergency.  That’s the only reason I have the Magic Jack phone for too.  I’ve heard of some people who wear something around their neck just in case they fall, but I’m not sure of the exact name though.   That is supposed to also help in an emergency. 

Janet

 , .

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 6:33 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

 

 

I have a cell phone for emergencies, just in case my land line service is disrupted.  Don’t laugh, but my cell phone is a 12 year old LG VZ4650 that still works because I rarely use it, and so the battery hasn’t died yet.  Oh sure, it probably belongs in the Smithsonian.  But at least I can make calls using voice commands, so I don’t have to futz around with the keypad, which at least has tactile buttons, albeit on the tiny side.  And to answer a call, I just have to flip it open without fumbling around a touchpad.  And with Page Plus Cellular, I only pay $30 a year to keep it activated.  Since I almost never use it, I have over 6 hours of accumulated air time.

 

Gerald

 

 

 

From: janet gross

 

Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 7:20 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

 

Gerald,

There is that word if again.  What if this and what if that but what if this and what if that again!  I’ve been through that already with another list member, so that goes nowhere!  What if the world ended tomorrow? You could grab your land line, and I could grab my iPhone, and we both might be happy!  Lol! 

Janet

 

 

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 6:08 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

 

 

But if the power fails, your Magic Jack phone won’t be of any use.  So if there is a power failure, you might not be able to use either your cell phone or your Magic Jack phone.  Sure Magic Jack is cheap.  But you get what you pay for.  I have had land line service from Verizon and its predecessors for 67 years, and have experienced a disruption in service only once in all those years.  What cell phone service can match this record of reliability?

 

Gerald

 

 

 

From: janet gross

Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 6:50 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

 

Hey Gerald,

Aren’t we starting just a little to early for all this? Lol!  I have a Magic Jack phone just in case I lose my wonderful iPhone.  I would always have the Magic Jack for emergencies. 

Janet

 

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 5:41 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

 

 

You claim that signing up for Lifelock protection is like an insurance policy.  Well, for me maintaining my land line service is an insurance policy.  According to you, the probability of a natural disaster striking a major metropolitan area is low, so why hang on to antiquated technology?  Well, nobody ever thought Hurricane Sandy would cause such catastrophic damage in a city like New York.  Nobody ever thought they would see rowboats floating along lower Broadway near the Battery.  But it happened.  And many experts insist that it could happen again because of climate change, which the current president dismisses as a hoax.  There is currently no cell phone on the market that is as reliable as a land line phone tethered to an underground copper wire network, nor is there any cell phone that provides loud and clear sound quality comparable to a land line phone.  So stick to your cell phone if it makes you feel safe and secure. I’ll stick to my reliable land line phone.

 

Gerald

 

  

From: Gene

Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 7:01 PM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

 

your ability to sling ad homanem arguments on completely unrelated subjects is astounding and reduces your arguments, whether valid or not by making them petty and vinddictave, and inaccurate.  I now use Life Lock.  I signed up with them because it appeared to me that my former service was not as thorough.  I'm willing to consider alternatives as I get more information.  for example, I've read argguments that taking steps such as freezing your credit bureau accounts and taking a few other actions may render credit protection of considerably less importance and that it may be that credit protection isn't particularly useful.  Which side is right?  I don't know.  Is either side right?  I don't know.  but at this time, I choose to spend some money for what may be protection that may be of some value.  That isn't paranoia.  It may not be necessary, but hardly paranoid.  but to say that I can't live without something is simply an ad hominem argument and is completely unrelated to the subject we are discussing.

 

Now, to return to the subject we were discussing:

Things may have changed.  A year or two ago, I read articles about the soon to come demise of the old copper system.  Your information is worth considering and may indicate that the copper system will be around longer than was previously thought.  But it's dying, whether a faster or a slower death. 

 

The extreme what ifs are hardly a proper way to determine how to spend money by businesses or governments or people.  What if this horrible very low probability event occurred?  What if that very unlikely low probability ev ent occurred?  Before you know it, we would be personally bankrupt and bankrupt as a country by preparing for every single what if event. 

 

If you want to use the copper network and if others do, fine.  But you aren't assessing the risks and benefits.  There may be certain parts of the country that are more prone to disasters where it makes more sense to do so.  But saying, in general, that people should cling to the old copper network, paying considerably more money each month for slower Internet service than if they switch to fiber optic service if they don't live in high probability disaster areas, is simply not rational cost/benefit analysis.  Chicago, new York City, Madison Wisconsin, and so on, are low probability candidates for the kinds of terrible disasters you are worried about.  Yet you cling to the copper network because of a low or very low probability "what if." 

 

What about emergency generators to keep your modem working and kieep your phone service during emergencies?  What about the battery backup feature you can get for disasters?  I don't know if the battery backup runs down even if you don't use the service or if you can stretch it out for a long time if you use it sparingly. 

 

To take another example, I live on the third floor of a building that has stairs.  there is a very low probability that I'll fall down the stairs.  Should I not live in the building for that reason when there are many things aoub t the building and the community I like?  Just seizing on one possible problem or known deficiency to the exclusion of all sorts of other factors is not proper decision-making.  It is elevating one possibility over everything else and not doing any sort of cost/benefit analysis nor considering whether the probability is high enough to be worth worrying about.  and all sorts of decisions people make every day are based on probabilities, whether they consider them consciously or not.  Is it worth the risk of crossing a street to go somewhere when you consider the low probability of me being hit by a car when compared with the benefits of crossing the street?  and so on for decision after decision.

 

there is the very low probability of such a disaster in the area where you live and there is also the very low probability that you will have a heart attack or a stroke or some other such emergency while service is out.  If you want to spend perhaps forty dollars more a month for the combination of much slower Internet speed and standard phone service, which except for the possibility of loss during a disaster, is indistinguishable in quality from fiber optic service, that's your privelege.  But advocating repeatedly that everyone should have this fear and that it is on its face, without question, the correct decision and policy all over the country is just wrong. 

 

Have you seen what happens to your beloved phone service during a disaster or some sort of more or less emergency?  During the 1967 blizzard in Chicago, as a teenager, I saw how people had to wait often minutes for a dial tone during the first day or two of the extreme blizzard.  The system was overloaded.  So don't assume that just having wired service is some sort of paradise during disaster. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

 

From: Gerald Levy

Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 4:35 PM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

 

 

You are totally wrong about this issue.  For a blind person living alone, especially seniors with medical and physical problems, having reliable phone service in an emergency is absolutely essential, and could mean the difference between life and death. What if you suddenly had a heart attack or stroke?  How would you summon help if you don’t have a working phone?  Do you really believe that this could never happen to you?  Well, it happened to dozens of people in New Orleans, most of them disabled or seniors or both  after Hurricane Katrina who died because they did not have working phones to get help.  And contrary to your unfounded assertion, copper wiring isn’t going to be replaced in many parts of the country for many years, if ever.  It turns out that Verizon underestimated the cost of installing fiber optic cable in many urban areas, and in some cases has even renegged on contractual obligations to install it.  Here in New York, Verizon has abandoned plans too install fiber optic cable in all parts of the city, which is suing them for breach of contract.  And the state public service commision has forbidden them from removing copper wiring and replacing it with fiber optic cable: they must keep the copper wiring in place if they want to also install fiber optic cable. So I expect reliable copper wiring to be around where I live for a very long time.  And as long as we’re on the subject of paranoia, you’re the one who can’t live without Lifeloc “protection”, a service of dubious value from a company that has been heavily fined by the FTC for engaging in fraudulent and deceptive business practices.

 

Gerald

 

 

 

From: Gene

Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 4:10 PM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

 

Maybe those people have much more to worry about than phone service.  And if you live in areas not prone to natural disasters putting ttoo much emphasis on this possibility is misplaced luddite paranoia.  It's like the old get a horse crowd.  If something so severe occurs in an area that power is lost and may be lost for weeks, for a lot, perhaps most people, being able to make calls would be, I would think a distant problem compared for example, to getting fresh watter, getting food, and perhaps finding a tolerable shelter. 

 

And sooner or later, it will be academic anyway.  the old archaic copper network is going to be completely shut down.  already, so many people have stopped using it that it is unreasonably costly to maintain per user.  I wouldn't be surprised if no more copper networks exist within three to four years. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Gerald Levy

Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 11:44 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

 


Good for him!  Millions of people who live in Florida and Texas who now have
no power, and may not have it restored for weeks probably regret giving up
their reliable copper-wire land line phones in favor of cell phones that
they cannot use until the power is restored and the cell towers rebuilt.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Carolyn Arnold
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 12:14 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

I'd dump that thing today, but my husband wants to keep the thing.

Best from,

Carolyn

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of
Gerald Levy
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 11:23 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone


But what about the cost of your land line phone?

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Carolyn Arnold
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 11:14 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

We can get two lines at Consumer, and our AARP membership for about $40 for
the two lines plus tax, of course, about $45 a month. I have a few friends
who has it and are very satisfied with performance and service.

Best from,

Carolyn


-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of
heather albright
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 11:07 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

No just sign up for the membership threw the main site. It is 10 dollars but
it will take like over 100 dollars off the phone. My plan was like 130 but,
I only pay 105 a month. So add the savings 1560 1260 equals 300 a year you
can save. Heather



Heather Albright
Blindness is a characteristic, not a handicap!" Dr. Kenneth Jernigan ham
call sign:
kd5cbl
e-mail:
kd5cbl@...



From: Peter Spitz <mailto:peter.a.spitz@...>
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 9:56 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone



OK, this is a stupid question but do you have to be a member of the

NFB to qualify for the discount?



Peter



On 9/13/17, heather albright <kd5cbl@...> wrote:

> That is why I have te-mobile and the NFB discount. Now my mom is over 55
> so

> she wants to sign us for that plan for unlimited for 60 for two lines. If

> you have more than one line and over age 55 or if the other person is over

> 55, I highly recommend this plan. It is 60 no taxes. Cheers Heather

>

> Heather Albright

> Blindness is a characteristic, not a handicap!" Dr. Kenneth Jernigan

> ham call sign:

> kd5cbl

> e-mail:

> kd5cbl@...

>

> From: Carolyn Arnold

> Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 9:42 AM

> To: main@TechTalk.groups.io

> Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

>

> Yet my Verizon bill is as high as when I started with the

> iPhone 4S that supposedly was a penny or 99 cents, I can't

> remember which, but less than a dollar. So I checked with

> Verizon to see if the two of us could go cheaper now, over

> three years later with prepaid - no go, same price.

>

> Best from,

>

> Carolyn

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: main@TechTalk.groups.io

> [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Pablo Morales

> Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 7:30 AM

> To: main@TechTalk.groups.io

> Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

>

> Yes, they do. When every month they have problems to pay

> their bills, or when they try to buy something and they

> can't save money is when they notice it. The problem is that

> they are not understanding how works this business.

> We notice it, but whe are not thinking why it happen.

>

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: main@TechTalk.groups.io

> [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Pamela

> Dominguez

> Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2017 5:14 PM

> To: main@TechTalk.groups.io

> Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

>

> Most people don't notice that, or they don't seem to care,

> as long as they don't see the price all at once.  Pam.

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Rob Hudson

> Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2017 5:01 PM

> To: main@TechTalk.groups.io

> Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Cost of New IPhone

>

> Carlos <carlos1106@...> wrote:

>> Most people get an iPhone the same way they get any other

> expensive

>> smart phone, as part of a contract or deal with the cell

> provider.

>

> Yeah but then you get gouged with interest and other

> surcharges, which makes the phone more expensive over the

> term of the contract lol. So it's probably cheaper

> relatively speaking to just plunk down your credit card and

> go on that canned tuna diet.

>

>

>

>

> ---

> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.

> http://www.avg.com

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

















 


Re: AT&T Land Line Phone Service In Il.

Rob Hudson <rob_hudson_3182@...>
 

janet gross <janet.harvard@...> wrote:
The reason why they want to get rid of the land line service here is because they claim it is costing to much money to keep it running, and because the majority of residents have either a smart phone or a cell phone!

And then there are places like rural Kentucky and Virginia/West Virginia, South Carolina, way down in rural Georgia, upstate New York and Vermont, way up north here in Minnesota and Wisconsin, where they still have phone networks that haven't been upgraded since the 50s or earlier. In those areas, you are lucky to get ADSL; and even then like I said, you are very lucky. Most places have to get by on 56k dialup. The other option is satellite internet which is still 150 300 dollars a month and even more, depending on the company. And if you have a cloudy day, there goes your twitter tweetin and facebook wallin. So, as hard as it is to believe when people are whining about only getting three bars of cell signal, there are still people out there who are lucky to get 56k dialup and scream for joy when they finally get 512k DSL.


Re: old menu items for new versions of office

Ann Parsons
 

Hi all,

Never heard of it. You'll just have to de4al, Jeff. It really isn't that bad. Use the Virtual Ribbons if that works better for you. Ribbons are just the menus combined with the toolbars. There's no rocket science involved.

Ann P.

--
Ann K. Parsons
Portal Tutoring
** New EMAIL: akp@...
web site: http://www.portaltutoring.info
Skype: Putertutor

"All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost."


Re: Cell Phone Question?

Ann Parsons
 

Hi all,

Having a cell phone, even a basic flip phone is a safety issue these days for anyone, blind or sighted. I still have a landline which I use as my main number, but I always take my cell when I go out.

Ann P.

--
Ann K. Parsons
Portal Tutoring
** New EMAIL: akp@...
web site: http://www.portaltutoring.info
Skype: Putertutor

"All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost."

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