Date   

Re: accessing an element on a website problem

Mike B.
 

Okay, did you modify a scheme somewhere along the line so Jaws won't report clickable?

Take care and stay safe.  Mike.  Sent from my iBarstool.  Go Rams!
Main's Law:  For every action there is an equal and opposite government program.

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, November 21, 2020 1:58 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

I actually found this tip on a google search from 2016 from a jaws list but in short that box was already checked.

 

Kimsan Song

kimsansong@...

If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA

Also, you may follow me on twitter:

https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Mike B
Sent: Saturday, November 21, 2020 11:54 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

 

Yo Dog,

 

Check this setting from the steps below:

From: Carlos via BlindTech
In
"Settings Center"
under the
"Web / HTML / PDFs"
category, there is a subcategory labeled
"Miscellaneous"
Under
"Miscellaneous"
there is a setting labeled
"Indicate Element Attribute"
Unchecking this setting will stop Jaws from saying
"Clickable"
Although I would not recommend this since there are times when you will miss
out on elements of webpages that may be useful and are clickable.
Carlos

If that setting is unchecked, check it, to get clickable back.


Take care and stay safe.  Mike.  Sent from my iBarstool.  Go Rams!
Main's Law:  For every action there is an equal and opposite government program.

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 10:43 PM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

 

Thanks Ron,

I cannot seem to hear the announcement of clickable though, and I’m trying to figure out how to turn it back on as I must’ve turned it off lol.

 

Kimsan Song

kimsansong@...

If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA

Also, you may follow me on twitter:

https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Ron Canazzi
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 9:55 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

 

Hi Kinsam,

Navigate to the line of text that reads as follows:
This pack includes royalty free Melody loops, MIDI, and stems for every melody.

On the line just below this text is a group of items labeled clickable.  There is no text associated with these 'clickable' items.  Press enter on these items and the samples will play.

Repeat the process for each group of clickable items below and other samples will play.

On 11/20/2020 8:47 PM, Kimsan via groups.io wrote:

Hi,

I’m using jaws 2020 and latest chrome.

If anyone has time, can someone navigate to this website and help me find the play button?

This site has soundpacks which are a collection of melodies etc. I’m trying to listen to some of the contents in one of the packs.

I cannot seem to locate the play button though.

So, if anyone would like to look and try, after going to the site, search for night, and night fall should pop up.

I would push enter, left mouse click, but cannot seem to play anything.

https://cymatics.fm/collections/store/products/gems-vol-10-rnb-melodies-collection#MainContent

 

Kimsan Song

kimsansong@...

If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA

Also, you may follow me on twitter:

https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng

 

 

-- 
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


Re: accessing an element on a website problem

Kimsan
 

I actually found this tip on a google search from 2016 from a jaws list but in short that box was already checked.

 

Kimsan Song

kimsansong@...

If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA

Also, you may follow me on twitter:

https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Mike B
Sent: Saturday, November 21, 2020 11:54 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

 

Yo Dog,

 

Check this setting from the steps below:

From: Carlos via BlindTech
In
"Settings Center"
under the
"Web / HTML / PDFs"
category, there is a subcategory labeled
"Miscellaneous"
Under
"Miscellaneous"
there is a setting labeled
"Indicate Element Attribute"
Unchecking this setting will stop Jaws from saying
"Clickable"
Although I would not recommend this since there are times when you will miss
out on elements of webpages that may be useful and are clickable.
Carlos

If that setting is unchecked, check it, to get clickable back.


Take care and stay safe.  Mike.  Sent from my iBarstool.  Go Rams!
Main's Law:  For every action there is an equal and opposite government program.

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 10:43 PM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

 

Thanks Ron,

I cannot seem to hear the announcement of clickable though, and I’m trying to figure out how to turn it back on as I must’ve turned it off lol.

 

Kimsan Song

kimsansong@...

If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA

Also, you may follow me on twitter:

https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Ron Canazzi
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 9:55 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

 

Hi Kinsam,

Navigate to the line of text that reads as follows:
This pack includes royalty free Melody loops, MIDI, and stems for every melody.

On the line just below this text is a group of items labeled clickable.  There is no text associated with these 'clickable' items.  Press enter on these items and the samples will play.

Repeat the process for each group of clickable items below and other samples will play.

On 11/20/2020 8:47 PM, Kimsan via groups.io wrote:

Hi,

I’m using jaws 2020 and latest chrome.

If anyone has time, can someone navigate to this website and help me find the play button?

This site has soundpacks which are a collection of melodies etc. I’m trying to listen to some of the contents in one of the packs.

I cannot seem to locate the play button though.

So, if anyone would like to look and try, after going to the site, search for night, and night fall should pop up.

I would push enter, left mouse click, but cannot seem to play anything.

https://cymatics.fm/collections/store/products/gems-vol-10-rnb-melodies-collection#MainContent

 

Kimsan Song

kimsansong@...

If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA

Also, you may follow me on twitter:

https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng

 

 

-- 
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


pot player

Kerryn Gunness <k_gunness@...>
 

hi guys
 
does any of you use pot player?
for windows?
if so how accessible it is


Re: accessing an element on a website problem

Mike B.
 

Yo Dog,
 
Check this setting from the steps below:
From: Carlos via BlindTech
In
"Settings Center"
under the
"Web / HTML / PDFs"
category, there is a subcategory labeled
"Miscellaneous"
Under
"Miscellaneous"
there is a setting labeled
"Indicate Element Attribute"
Unchecking this setting will stop Jaws from saying
"Clickable"
Although I would not recommend this since there are times when you will miss
out on elements of webpages that may be useful and are clickable.
Carlos
If that setting is unchecked, check it, to get clickable back.

Take care and stay safe.  Mike.  Sent from my iBarstool.  Go Rams!
Main's Law:  For every action there is an equal and opposite government program.

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 10:43 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

Thanks Ron,

I cannot seem to hear the announcement of clickable though, and I’m trying to figure out how to turn it back on as I must’ve turned it off lol.

 

Kimsan Song

kimsansong@...

If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA

Also, you may follow me on twitter:

https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Ron Canazzi
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 9:55 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

 

Hi Kinsam,

Navigate to the line of text that reads as follows:
This pack includes royalty free Melody loops, MIDI, and stems for every melody.

On the line just below this text is a group of items labeled clickable.  There is no text associated with these 'clickable' items.  Press enter on these items and the samples will play.

Repeat the process for each group of clickable items below and other samples will play.

On 11/20/2020 8:47 PM, Kimsan via groups.io wrote:

Hi,

I’m using jaws 2020 and latest chrome.

If anyone has time, can someone navigate to this website and help me find the play button?

This site has soundpacks which are a collection of melodies etc. I’m trying to listen to some of the contents in one of the packs.

I cannot seem to locate the play button though.

So, if anyone would like to look and try, after going to the site, search for night, and night fall should pop up.

I would push enter, left mouse click, but cannot seem to play anything.

https://cymatics.fm/collections/store/products/gems-vol-10-rnb-melodies-collection#MainContent

 

Kimsan Song

kimsansong@...

If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA

Also, you may follow me on twitter:

https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng

 



-- 
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


Re: accessing an element on a website problem

Kimsan
 

Good morning Gene,

No-go here for me. It did not work nor echo anything about a clickable.

Hopefully, I can figure something out before the black Friday promotion ends.

 

Kimsan Song

kimsansong@...

If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA

Also, you may follow me on twitter:

https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Saturday, November 21, 2020 5:31 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

 

For now, try the following:

I would think that if you turn the announcement of clickable off, there would still be a line with no speech if you run across an unlabeled item that says clickable. 

 

Starting from the top of the page, search for the word loops.  You will be one line above the first clickable item.  Down arrow once and press enter.

Down arrow again and you will probably hear nothing.

Down arrowing again should place you on the name of the item you clicked to hear.

Down arrow again and you are on another clickable item.  Press enter.  Continue the same procedure to hear all the items.  There are around four or five.

 

It is very likely someone will send you instructions to turn on announcement of clickable items this morning or maybe as late as this afternoon.  If not, I'll send a discussion I found on the subject which may be more cumbersome to find the information in than just a set of instructions, but its there.

 

Gene

On 11/21/2020 12:43 AM, Kimsan via groups.io wrote:

Thanks Ron,

I cannot seem to hear the announcement of clickable though, and I’m trying to figure out how to turn it back on as I must’ve turned it off lol.

 

Kimsan Song

kimsansong@...

If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA

Also, you may follow me on twitter:

https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Ron Canazzi
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 9:55 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

 

Hi Kinsam,

Navigate to the line of text that reads as follows:
This pack includes royalty free Melody loops, MIDI, and stems for every melody.

On the line just below this text is a group of items labeled clickable.  There is no text associated with these 'clickable' items.  Press enter on these items and the samples will play.

Repeat the process for each group of clickable items below and other samples will play.

On 11/20/2020 8:47 PM, Kimsan via groups.io wrote:

Hi,

I’m using jaws 2020 and latest chrome.

If anyone has time, can someone navigate to this website and help me find the play button?

This site has soundpacks which are a collection of melodies etc. I’m trying to listen to some of the contents in one of the packs.

I cannot seem to locate the play button though.

So, if anyone would like to look and try, after going to the site, search for night, and night fall should pop up.

I would push enter, left mouse click, but cannot seem to play anything.

https://cymatics.fm/collections/store/products/gems-vol-10-rnb-melodies-collection#MainContent

 

Kimsan Song

kimsansong@...

If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA

Also, you may follow me on twitter:

https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng

 

 

-- 
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


Re: Where does one get portable?, was Re: does anyone know about OE classic?

Gene
 

-----Original Message-----
From: John Sanfilippo
Sent: Saturday, November 21, 2020 8:59 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] Where does one get portable?, was Re: does anyone know about OE classic?

Hi Folks, hopte this change I made is ok.

I've downloaded a portable version of Thunderbird, but held back installing in case it may be something of a trojan. Is there a dependable link to a proper version? I had no luck on Thunderbird.net.

Help appreciated.

John S


Where does one get portable?, was Re: does anyone know about OE classic?

John Sanfilippo
 

Hi Folks, hopte this change I made is ok. 

I've downloaded a portable version of Thunderbird, but held back installing in case it may be something of a trojan. Is there a dependable link to a proper version? I had no luck on Thunderbird.net.

Help appreciated.

John S


Re: accessing an element on a website problem

Gene
 

For now, try the following:

I would think that if you turn the announcement of clickable off, there would still be a line with no speech if you run across an unlabeled item that says clickable. 


Starting from the top of the page, search for the word loops.  You will be one line above the first clickable item.  Down arrow once and press enter.

Down arrow again and you will probably hear nothing.

Down arrowing again should place you on the name of the item you clicked to hear.

Down arrow again and you are on another clickable item.  Press enter.  Continue the same procedure to hear all the items.  There are around four or five.


It is very likely someone will send you instructions to turn on announcement of clickable items this morning or maybe as late as this afternoon.  If not, I'll send a discussion I found on the subject which may be more cumbersome to find the information in than just a set of instructions, but its there.


Gene

On 11/21/2020 12:43 AM, Kimsan via groups.io wrote:

Thanks Ron,

I cannot seem to hear the announcement of clickable though, and I’m trying to figure out how to turn it back on as I must’ve turned it off lol.

 

Kimsan Song

kimsansong@...

If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA

Also, you may follow me on twitter:

https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Ron Canazzi
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 9:55 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

 

Hi Kinsam,

Navigate to the line of text that reads as follows:
This pack includes royalty free Melody loops, MIDI, and stems for every melody.

On the line just below this text is a group of items labeled clickable.  There is no text associated with these 'clickable' items.  Press enter on these items and the samples will play.

Repeat the process for each group of clickable items below and other samples will play.

On 11/20/2020 8:47 PM, Kimsan via groups.io wrote:

Hi,

I’m using jaws 2020 and latest chrome.

If anyone has time, can someone navigate to this website and help me find the play button?

This site has soundpacks which are a collection of melodies etc. I’m trying to listen to some of the contents in one of the packs.

I cannot seem to locate the play button though.

So, if anyone would like to look and try, after going to the site, search for night, and night fall should pop up.

I would push enter, left mouse click, but cannot seem to play anything.

https://cymatics.fm/collections/store/products/gems-vol-10-rnb-melodies-collection#MainContent

 

Kimsan Song

kimsansong@...

If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA

Also, you may follow me on twitter:

https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng

 



-- 
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


Re: Rebooting into Safe Mode in Windows 10

Steve Matzura
 

Sorry, I can't do that for two reasons. One, I've lost access to the administrator account, which is why I need to go into Safe Mode in the first place, and two, fast startup is already off. Oh well. Back to the drawingboard.

On 11/21/2020 7:35 AM, Blaster wrote:
Steve, Go into the power options and turn off the fast boot checkbox,
that should slow things down enough for the f8 key option on post.

HTH,
Blaster


On 11/20/20, Steve Matzura <number6@noisynotes.com> wrote:
I am trying to do this. Of course, the old standby F8 method doesn't
work because the machine and SSD are just too fast, so I have to use the
recovery method, which puts you into a menu that goes away very quickly
if you don't respond fast enough, and of course, there's no
Narrator--yet. So, when this menu appears, I have to press something
that will get me into the Troubleshooting area, then I have to pick an
Advanced boot option, and finally, press F4, F5, or F6 to get into
either Safe Mode, Safe Mode with Networking, or Safe Mode with Command
Prompt. Presumably at this point I can start Narrator. What I need are
the key sequences to do this totally unassisted. If I'm too slow, the
system will just boot into Windows normally and I'll start over. I'm
game to do this until I get it right, because I have to. I created a
user account and did not give it administrator privilege, and I have no
idea of how to switch back to my former aqdministrator login to fix the
problem. Supposedly I can do this in Safe Mode somehow.


THanks in advance.


Re: Rebooting into Safe Mode in Windows 10

Blaster
 

Steve, Go into the power options and turn off the fast boot checkbox,
that should slow things down enough for the f8 key option on post.

HTH,
Blaster

On 11/20/20, Steve Matzura <number6@noisynotes.com> wrote:
I am trying to do this. Of course, the old standby F8 method doesn't
work because the machine and SSD are just too fast, so I have to use the
recovery method, which puts you into a menu that goes away very quickly
if you don't respond fast enough, and of course, there's no
Narrator--yet. So, when this menu appears, I have to press something
that will get me into the Troubleshooting area, then I have to pick an
Advanced boot option, and finally, press F4, F5, or F6 to get into
either Safe Mode, Safe Mode with Networking, or Safe Mode with Command
Prompt. Presumably at this point I can start Narrator. What I need are
the key sequences to do this totally unassisted. If I'm too slow, the
system will just boot into Windows normally and I'll start over. I'm
game to do this until I get it right, because I have to. I created a
user account and did not give it administrator privilege, and I have no
idea of how to switch back to my former aqdministrator login to fix the
problem. Supposedly I can do this in Safe Mode somehow.


THanks in advance.







Re: accessing an element on a website problem

Kimsan
 

Thanks Ron,

I cannot seem to hear the announcement of clickable though, and I’m trying to figure out how to turn it back on as I must’ve turned it off lol.

 

Kimsan Song

kimsansong@...

If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA

Also, you may follow me on twitter:

https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Ron Canazzi
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 9:55 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

 

Hi Kinsam,

Navigate to the line of text that reads as follows:
This pack includes royalty free Melody loops, MIDI, and stems for every melody.

On the line just below this text is a group of items labeled clickable.  There is no text associated with these 'clickable' items.  Press enter on these items and the samples will play.

Repeat the process for each group of clickable items below and other samples will play.

On 11/20/2020 8:47 PM, Kimsan via groups.io wrote:

Hi,

I’m using jaws 2020 and latest chrome.

If anyone has time, can someone navigate to this website and help me find the play button?

This site has soundpacks which are a collection of melodies etc. I’m trying to listen to some of the contents in one of the packs.

I cannot seem to locate the play button though.

So, if anyone would like to look and try, after going to the site, search for night, and night fall should pop up.

I would push enter, left mouse click, but cannot seem to play anything.

https://cymatics.fm/collections/store/products/gems-vol-10-rnb-melodies-collection#MainContent

 

Kimsan Song

kimsansong@...

If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA

Also, you may follow me on twitter:

https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng

 



-- 
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


Re: accessing an element on a website problem

Ron Canazzi
 

Hi Kinsam,

Navigate to the line of text that reads as follows:
This pack includes royalty free Melody loops, MIDI, and stems for every melody.

On the line just below this text is a group of items labeled clickable.  There is no text associated with these 'clickable' items.  Press enter on these items and the samples will play.

Repeat the process for each group of clickable items below and other samples will play.


On 11/20/2020 8:47 PM, Kimsan via groups.io wrote:

Hi,

I’m using jaws 2020 and latest chrome.

If anyone has time, can someone navigate to this website and help me find the play button?

This site has soundpacks which are a collection of melodies etc. I’m trying to listen to some of the contents in one of the packs.

I cannot seem to locate the play button though.

So, if anyone would like to look and try, after going to the site, search for night, and night fall should pop up.

I would push enter, left mouse click, but cannot seem to play anything.

https://cymatics.fm/collections/store/products/gems-vol-10-rnb-melodies-collection#MainContent

 

Kimsan Song

kimsansong@...

If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA

Also, you may follow me on twitter:

https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng

 


-- 
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


Re: accessing an element on a website problem

Kimsan
 

I might have, let me go see if I can remember how to turn it on. Feel free to post instructions.

Kimsan Song
kimsansong@icloud.com
If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA
Also, you may follow me on twitter:
https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 8:50 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

Did you turn JAWS announcing clickable items off? are you down arrowing in that part of the page? I don't think you will see the clickable items unless you down arrow.

Gene
-----Original Message-----
From: Kimsan via groups.io
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 10:47 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

Hmm, I'm using chrome, am I doing something wrong? I also tried on edge as well, nothing. It doesn't even say clickable for me, let alone play.
If you're able to let me know what setting needs to be changed that would be appreciated.
I'm using chrome 86.0.4. something.
Also, jaws 2020.

Kimsan Song
kimsansong@icloud.com
If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA
Also, you may follow me on twitter:
https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 8:00 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

I just tested with the new Eddge, which is a Chrome-based browser and it works with the clickable items as well. So does Chrome. But for some reason, the Brave browser doesn't.

Gene
-----Original Message-----
From: Gene
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 9:54 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

There isn't a play button as far as I can see. There are a number of items like nightfall, Weekend, and a few others that have items that say clickable above them. I couldn't get the clicable items to work using the Brave browser, which is a Chrome based browser. I didn't try with Chrome or Edge.
I did try with Firefox and pressing enter on the first of the two clicable items before each name caused a short ten or fifteen second sample to play.
I don't know if anything other than these clicable items are intended to be played. I couldn't get anything to play.

Also, I'm using NVDA. I don't know if that makes any difference. But it is important to have a browser that isn't Chrome based and a browser that is Chrome based on a machine. One may work better with screen-readers on this or that site and the other may work better on a different this or that site.

Gene
-----Original Message-----
From: Kimsan via groups.io
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 7:47 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem



Hi,

I’m using jaws 2020 and latest chrome.

If anyone has time, can someone navigate to this website and help me find the play button?

This site has soundpacks which are a collection of melodies etc. I’m trying to listen to some of the contents in one of the packs.

I cannot seem to locate the play button though.

So, if anyone would like to look and try, after going to the site, search for night, and night fall should pop up.

I would push enter, left mouse click, but cannot seem to play anything.

https://cymatics.fm/collections/store/products/gems-vol-10-rnb-melodies-collection#MainContent



Kimsan Song

kimsansong@icloud.com

If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA

Also, you may follow me on twitter:

https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng


Re: accessing an element on a website problem

Gene
 

Did you turn JAWS announcing clickable items off? are you down arrowing in that part of the page? I don't think you will see the clickable items unless you down arrow.

Gene

-----Original Message-----
From: Kimsan via groups.io
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 10:47 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

Hmm, I'm using chrome, am I doing something wrong? I also tried on edge as well, nothing. It doesn't even say clickable for me, let alone play.
If you're able to let me know what setting needs to be changed that would be appreciated.
I'm using chrome 86.0.4. something.
Also, jaws 2020.

Kimsan Song
kimsansong@icloud.com
If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA
Also, you may follow me on twitter:
https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 8:00 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

I just tested with the new Eddge, which is a Chrome-based browser and it works with the clickable items as well. So does Chrome. But for some reason, the Brave browser doesn't.

Gene
-----Original Message-----
From: Gene
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 9:54 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

There isn't a play button as far as I can see. There are a number of items like nightfall, Weekend, and a few others that have items that say clickable above them. I couldn't get the clicable items to work using the Brave browser, which is a Chrome based browser. I didn't try with Chrome or Edge.
I did try with Firefox and pressing enter on the first of the two clicable items before each name caused a short ten or fifteen second sample to play.
I don't know if anything other than these clicable items are intended to be played. I couldn't get anything to play.

Also, I'm using NVDA. I don't know if that makes any difference. But it is important to have a browser that isn't Chrome based and a browser that is Chrome based on a machine. One may work better with screen-readers on this or that site and the other may work better on a different this or that site.

Gene
-----Original Message-----
From: Kimsan via groups.io
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 7:47 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem



Hi,

I’m using jaws 2020 and latest chrome.

If anyone has time, can someone navigate to this website and help me find
the play button?

This site has soundpacks which are a collection of melodies etc. I’m trying
to listen to some of the contents in one of the packs.

I cannot seem to locate the play button though.

So, if anyone would like to look and try, after going to the site, search
for night, and night fall should pop up.

I would push enter, left mouse click, but cannot seem to play anything.

https://cymatics.fm/collections/store/products/gems-vol-10-rnb-melodies-collection#MainContent



Kimsan Song

kimsansong@icloud.com

If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube
artist channel at

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA

Also, you may follow me on twitter:

https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng


Re: accessing an element on a website problem

Kimsan
 

Hmm, I'm using chrome, am I doing something wrong? I also tried on edge as well, nothing. It doesn't even say clickable for me, let alone play.
If you're able to let me know what setting needs to be changed that would be appreciated.
I'm using chrome 86.0.4. something.
Also, jaws 2020.

Kimsan Song
kimsansong@icloud.com
If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA
Also, you may follow me on twitter:
https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 8:00 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

I just tested with the new Eddge, which is a Chrome-based browser and it works with the clickable items as well. So does Chrome. But for some reason, the Brave browser doesn't.

Gene
-----Original Message-----
From: Gene
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 9:54 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

There isn't a play button as far as I can see. There are a number of items like nightfall, Weekend, and a few others that have items that say clickable above them. I couldn't get the clicable items to work using the Brave browser, which is a Chrome based browser. I didn't try with Chrome or Edge.
I did try with Firefox and pressing enter on the first of the two clicable items before each name caused a short ten or fifteen second sample to play.
I don't know if anything other than these clicable items are intended to be played. I couldn't get anything to play.

Also, I'm using NVDA. I don't know if that makes any difference. But it is important to have a browser that isn't Chrome based and a browser that is Chrome based on a machine. One may work better with screen-readers on this or that site and the other may work better on a different this or that site.

Gene
-----Original Message-----
From: Kimsan via groups.io
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 7:47 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem



Hi,

I’m using jaws 2020 and latest chrome.

If anyone has time, can someone navigate to this website and help me find
the play button?

This site has soundpacks which are a collection of melodies etc. I’m trying
to listen to some of the contents in one of the packs.

I cannot seem to locate the play button though.

So, if anyone would like to look and try, after going to the site, search
for night, and night fall should pop up.

I would push enter, left mouse click, but cannot seem to play anything.

https://cymatics.fm/collections/store/products/gems-vol-10-rnb-melodies-collection#MainContent



Kimsan Song

kimsansong@icloud.com

If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube
artist channel at

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA

Also, you may follow me on twitter:

https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng


Re: Apple vs Windows?

Gene
 

To clarify, I don't say that people should leave menus behind.  Most programs still use them.  My concern is that for those who want to use Office programs, and get to various places in Windows 10, that knowing how to use ribbons may be important.  I don't know to what extent you can not use ribbons and find things you want in Word programs and Windows.  I suspect some, perhaps many people can use
Office and Windows 10 and largely keep away from ribbons.  I suspect many people would use ribbons in these areas. 


So I say it depends on how you use these programs and what you want to do in Windows.. 


I encourage people who have a need or desire to learn ribbons because I think that for most people, it won't be that hard and it may give people more confidence to learn other things on the basis that if they find that learning ribbons isn't the ordeal they are afraid it will be, they may gain confidence in their ability to learn other computer-related things such as programs they may be worried about learning. 


Gene

On 11/20/2020 7:12 PM, Monte Single wrote:

For the record,  the first message  I read about how to use ribbons was written and posted by Gene Asner.

I’m thinking that was about 10 years ago.

Gene has consistently encouraged  list members to move to the ribbons method of working  with m s products and leaving the old menus approach behind.

If I have misunderstood your posting,  my apologies.

 

Cheers,

 

Monte

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Norman
Sent: November 20, 2020 6:49 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Apple vs Windows?

 

I just came across this thread today, started a reply, discarded it, but now can't resist. While Brian's messages were maybe a bit out of line, i can't help but agree with the sentiment he expressed. Sadly though, It could have been worded a bit more diplomatically. My first reaction when i saw the thread had gotten combative was why do we have to go down this road again? It happens every month or so. The reaction now that he has left by a few list members though has been the most disturbing to me.

And with that having been said, i'm going to go on a bit of a rant about some people's ungratefulness, Sorry Jean.

Further back on this email thread ribbons were being discussed, some people like them and some do not. Brian in the spirit of helpfulness posted 3 different links to guides on how to navigate them from a blind perspective, I ask you, is that not considered helpful? What more can one do? We can say anything to try and help people but if said people refuse to read said material, there is nothing more we can do. Just because the thread degenerated into a bashfest because of undiplomatic statements from one side, and oversensitive reactions from the other shouldn't detract from the help that was already given.

And now that brian has left we get sulky comments like this.

Good riddence.

I agree. I’m not even sure why he’s here.

I agree.  He has been a troublemaker on every list he has infiltrated.  Once again, it should be pointed out that much of his arrogance and disrespect stems from the fact that he is totally sighted and has little patience for dealing with fellow blind list members who lack his advanced level of expertise.

 

Ungrateful, idiotic and untruthful statements like the ones above make me ashamed i have to be part of the blindness community. Yes i'm blind, and if i had a choice i would be sighted. And if i was i'd leave people like the ones who made those statements alone to figure out there own issues. Brian has been a long standing and helpful member of this comunity and i'm grateful that there are still sighted people willing to help us blind people develop our knowledge and indipendence. So since i'm blind, and don't have a choice in the matter i will accept that, try and gracefully accept help where needed and in turn help others where i can irrespective of if they're sighted or not.

 

 

In closing, i'll just make this statement . We all have equal oppurtunity on this earth, regardless of if we're sighted or not. Just keep this in mind, equal oppurtunity doesn't necessarily mean equal outcome.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

On 11/20/2020 6:19 PM, chris judge wrote:

I agree. I’m not even sure why he’s here.

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gerald Levy via groups.io
Sent: November 20, 2020 1:32 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Apple vs Windows?

 

 

I agree.  He has been a troublemaker on every list he has infiltrated.  Once again, it should be pointed out that much of his arrogance and disrespect stems from the fact that he is totally sighted and has little patience for dealing with fellow blind list members who lack his advanced level of expertise.

 

Gerald

 

 

On 11/20/2020 12:14 PM, chris judge wrote:

Good riddence.
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: November 20, 2020 12:57 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Apple vs Windows?
 
Brian has left the list.  He can dish it out, but what happens when he is
criticized?
 
Gene
-----Original Message-----
From: Rob Hudson
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 10:38 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Apple vs Windows?
 
You can give "wake up calls" without insults and snarkiness. As has been
demonstrated by your posts here and elsewhere, you have a distinct lack of
patience and very little tolerance. I understand that you are frustrated
that people don't know what you know, or wish to adapt. But the tone of your
posts is such that it sounds like: you are a stupid idiot refusing to see
that things change.
It's a free country (well, mostly) and you can express yourself however you
wish. But, I think Gene--and others as well--would prefer that you leave off
the personal insults.
 
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Vogel" <britechguy@...>
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 2020 08:20:17 -0800
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Apple vs Windows?
 
On Fri, Nov 20, 2020 at 11:10 AM, Gene wrote:
 
 
Your post is verging on personally abusive and such posts will not 
be allowed if continued in any regular or recurring pattern.
 
-
Gene, then I'll be happy to leave.  There seems to be this notion that 
all assistance has to "be nice."  Well, it doesn't, and very often, it 
shouldn't be.  We're dealing with adults here, and elsewhere, and I 
expect that adults know that effort will be necessary to learn any 
thing, and also know and accept the following:
 
It is impossible to help individuals who will not listen to advice 
unless they like that advice. Being a good assistant is not about 
making the person assisted "feel good," but about both asking the 
right (and sometimes hard) questions as well as giving the information 
necessary to achieve the desired result. Getting help is a two-way 
street, and those asking for help have work they must do, too, when 
asked. They also need to be ready to let go of what they'd like to do, 
and instead do what's called for.
 
It is not possible to help those who don't want to "do what's called for."
 
And, for the record, I'm not trying to "encourage people" in every 
instance, or even many instances.  I'm trying to get them to actually 
do something they should have already been doing, and supplying the 
exact information they need to do it, which I did here.
 
Giving a well deserved wake-up call is not abusive, it's necessary in 
many cases.  This is one of them.
 
--
 
Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041
 
If your joy is derived from what society thinks of you, you're always 
going to be disappointed.
 
~ Madonna
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 


Re: accessing an element on a website problem

Gene
 

I just tested with the new Eddge, which is a Chrome-based browser and it works with the clickable items as well. So does Chrome. But for some reason, the Brave browser doesn't.

Gene

-----Original Message-----
From: Gene
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 9:54 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem

There isn't a play button as far as I can see. There are a number of items
like nightfall, Weekend, and a few others that have items that say clickable
above them. I couldn't get the clicable items to work using the Brave
browser, which is a Chrome based browser. I didn't try with Chrome or Edge.
I did try with Firefox and pressing enter on the first of the two clicable
items before each name caused a short ten or fifteen second sample to play.
I don't know if anything other than these clicable items are intended to be
played. I couldn't get anything to play.

Also, I'm using NVDA. I don't know if that makes any difference. But it is
important to have a browser that isn't Chrome based and a browser that is
Chrome based on a machine. One may work better with screen-readers on this
or that site and the other may work better on a different this or that site.

Gene
-----Original Message-----
From: Kimsan via groups.io
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 7:47 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem



Hi,

I’m using jaws 2020 and latest chrome.

If anyone has time, can someone navigate to this website and help me find
the play button?

This site has soundpacks which are a collection of melodies etc. I’m trying
to listen to some of the contents in one of the packs.

I cannot seem to locate the play button though.

So, if anyone would like to look and try, after going to the site, search
for night, and night fall should pop up.

I would push enter, left mouse click, but cannot seem to play anything.

https://cymatics.fm/collections/store/products/gems-vol-10-rnb-melodies-collection#MainContent



Kimsan Song

kimsansong@icloud.com

If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube
artist channel at

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA

Also, you may follow me on twitter:

https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng


Re: accessing an element on a website problem

Gene
 

There isn't a play button as far as I can see. There are a number of items like nightfall, Weekend, and a few others that have items that say clickable above them. I couldn't get the clicable items to work using the Brave browser, which is a Chrome based browser. I didn't try with Chrome or Edge. I did try with Firefox and pressing enter on the first of the two clicable items before each name caused a short ten or fifteen second sample to play. I don't know if anything other than these clicable items are intended to be played. I couldn't get anything to play.

Also, I'm using NVDA. I don't know if that makes any difference. But it is important to have a browser that isn't Chrome based and a browser that is Chrome based on a machine. One may work better with screen-readers on this or that site and the other may work better on a different this or that site.

Gene

-----Original Message-----
From: Kimsan via groups.io
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 7:47 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] accessing an element on a website problem



Hi,

I’m using jaws 2020 and latest chrome.

If anyone has time, can someone navigate to this website and help me find the play button?

This site has soundpacks which are a collection of melodies etc. I’m trying to listen to some of the contents in one of the packs.

I cannot seem to locate the play button though.

So, if anyone would like to look and try, after going to the site, search for night, and night fall should pop up.

I would push enter, left mouse click, but cannot seem to play anything.

https://cymatics.fm/collections/store/products/gems-vol-10-rnb-melodies-collection#MainContent



Kimsan Song

kimsansong@icloud.com

If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA

Also, you may follow me on twitter:

https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng


accessing an element on a website problem

Kimsan
 

Hi,

I’m using jaws 2020 and latest chrome.

If anyone has time, can someone navigate to this website and help me find the play button?

This site has soundpacks which are a collection of melodies etc. I’m trying to listen to some of the contents in one of the packs.

I cannot seem to locate the play button though.

So, if anyone would like to look and try, after going to the site, search for night, and night fall should pop up.

I would push enter, left mouse click, but cannot seem to play anything.

https://cymatics.fm/collections/store/products/gems-vol-10-rnb-melodies-collection#MainContent

 

Kimsan Song

kimsansong@...

If you are into HipHop or R&B, I invite you to subscribe to my youtube artist channel at

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFzrNcgBfHguK-LnnJMMylA

Also, you may follow me on twitter:

https://twitter.com/kims4ns0ng

 


Re: Apple vs Windows?

Monte Single
 

For the record,  the first message  I read about how to use ribbons was written and posted by Gene Asner.

I’m thinking that was about 10 years ago.

Gene has consistently encouraged  list members to move to the ribbons method of working  with m s products and leaving the old menus approach behind.

If I have misunderstood your posting,  my apologies.

 

Cheers,

 

Monte

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Norman
Sent: November 20, 2020 6:49 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Apple vs Windows?

 

I just came across this thread today, started a reply, discarded it, but now can't resist. While Brian's messages were maybe a bit out of line, i can't help but agree with the sentiment he expressed. Sadly though, It could have been worded a bit more diplomatically. My first reaction when i saw the thread had gotten combative was why do we have to go down this road again? It happens every month or so. The reaction now that he has left by a few list members though has been the most disturbing to me.

And with that having been said, i'm going to go on a bit of a rant about some people's ungratefulness, Sorry Jean.

Further back on this email thread ribbons were being discussed, some people like them and some do not. Brian in the spirit of helpfulness posted 3 different links to guides on how to navigate them from a blind perspective, I ask you, is that not considered helpful? What more can one do? We can say anything to try and help people but if said people refuse to read said material, there is nothing more we can do. Just because the thread degenerated into a bashfest because of undiplomatic statements from one side, and oversensitive reactions from the other shouldn't detract from the help that was already given.

And now that brian has left we get sulky comments like this.

Good riddence.

I agree. I’m not even sure why he’s here.

I agree.  He has been a troublemaker on every list he has infiltrated.  Once again, it should be pointed out that much of his arrogance and disrespect stems from the fact that he is totally sighted and has little patience for dealing with fellow blind list members who lack his advanced level of expertise.

 

Ungrateful, idiotic and untruthful statements like the ones above make me ashamed i have to be part of the blindness community. Yes i'm blind, and if i had a choice i would be sighted. And if i was i'd leave people like the ones who made those statements alone to figure out there own issues. Brian has been a long standing and helpful member of this comunity and i'm grateful that there are still sighted people willing to help us blind people develop our knowledge and indipendence. So since i'm blind, and don't have a choice in the matter i will accept that, try and gracefully accept help where needed and in turn help others where i can irrespective of if they're sighted or not.

 

 

In closing, i'll just make this statement . We all have equal oppurtunity on this earth, regardless of if we're sighted or not. Just keep this in mind, equal oppurtunity doesn't necessarily mean equal outcome.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

On 11/20/2020 6:19 PM, chris judge wrote:

I agree. I’m not even sure why he’s here.

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gerald Levy via groups.io
Sent: November 20, 2020 1:32 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Apple vs Windows?

 

 

I agree.  He has been a troublemaker on every list he has infiltrated.  Once again, it should be pointed out that much of his arrogance and disrespect stems from the fact that he is totally sighted and has little patience for dealing with fellow blind list members who lack his advanced level of expertise.

 

Gerald

 

 

On 11/20/2020 12:14 PM, chris judge wrote:

Good riddence.
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: November 20, 2020 12:57 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Apple vs Windows?
 
Brian has left the list.  He can dish it out, but what happens when he is
criticized?
 
Gene
-----Original Message-----
From: Rob Hudson
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 10:38 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Apple vs Windows?
 
You can give "wake up calls" without insults and snarkiness. As has been
demonstrated by your posts here and elsewhere, you have a distinct lack of
patience and very little tolerance. I understand that you are frustrated
that people don't know what you know, or wish to adapt. But the tone of your
posts is such that it sounds like: you are a stupid idiot refusing to see
that things change.
It's a free country (well, mostly) and you can express yourself however you
wish. But, I think Gene--and others as well--would prefer that you leave off
the personal insults.
 
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Vogel" <britechguy@...>
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Date: Fri, 20 Nov 2020 08:20:17 -0800
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Apple vs Windows?
 
On Fri, Nov 20, 2020 at 11:10 AM, Gene wrote:
 
 
Your post is verging on personally abusive and such posts will not 
be allowed if continued in any regular or recurring pattern.
 
-
Gene, then I'll be happy to leave.  There seems to be this notion that 
all assistance has to "be nice."  Well, it doesn't, and very often, it 
shouldn't be.  We're dealing with adults here, and elsewhere, and I 
expect that adults know that effort will be necessary to learn any 
thing, and also know and accept the following:
 
It is impossible to help individuals who will not listen to advice 
unless they like that advice. Being a good assistant is not about 
making the person assisted "feel good," but about both asking the 
right (and sometimes hard) questions as well as giving the information 
necessary to achieve the desired result. Getting help is a two-way 
street, and those asking for help have work they must do, too, when 
asked. They also need to be ready to let go of what they'd like to do, 
and instead do what's called for.
 
It is not possible to help those who don't want to "do what's called for."
 
And, for the record, I'm not trying to "encourage people" in every 
instance, or even many instances.  I'm trying to get them to actually 
do something they should have already been doing, and supplying the 
exact information they need to do it, which I did here.
 
Giving a well deserved wake-up call is not abusive, it's necessary in 
many cases.  This is one of them.
 
--
 
Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 2004, Build 19041
 
If your joy is derived from what society thinks of you, you're always 
going to be disappointed.
 
~ Madonna
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

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