Date   

Re: Envision AI versus Supersense?

Loy
 

Seeing AI works well for me. I also have Envision and I have tried
SuperSence for a 7 day trial. With my limited use I don't see much
difference. Envision is much cheaper than Super Sense and Seeing AI is Free.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Troy Burnham" <troyburnham34@gmail.com>
To: <main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Sent: Thursday, May 6, 2021 9:16 PM
Subject: [TechTalk] Envision AI versus Supersense?


Hi all,

If anyone is familiar with the 2 apps in the subject line I'd like to
hear your comments. It looks to me like they may both do about the same
thing and I'd like to see if there's any advantages of one versus the
other before possibly deciding to use one or the other. I'm aware that
at least Invision has a 14-day trial and I had that reset the other day
because I installed the app on my phone a while back and either through
me doing something or just by being installed the trial started and ran
out before I was ready to evaluate it, but I can't tell if Supersense
has a trial period or not. I may've ruined the trial period on it as
well for the same reason, just opening it to see how it works and then
figuring that the trial period wouldn't continue until I opened it
again. I know, that was the wrong assumption.

From a podcast I listened to about supersense it sounds like it would
be the easier of the 2 apps to use but I'm not sure.

Thanks.

Troy


Envision AI versus Supersense?

Troy Burnham
 

Hi all,

If anyone is familiar with the 2 apps in the subject line I'd like to hear your comments. It looks to me like they may both do about the same thing and I'd like to see if there's any advantages of one versus the other before possibly deciding to use one or the other. I'm aware that at least Invision has a 14-day trial and I had that reset the other day because I installed the app on my phone a while back and either through me doing something or just by being installed the trial started and ran out before I was ready to evaluate it, but I can't tell if Supersense has a trial period or not. I may've ruined the trial period on it as well for the same reason, just opening it to see how it works and then figuring that the trial period wouldn't continue until I opened it again. I know, that was the wrong assumption.

From a podcast I listened to about supersense it sounds like it would be the easier of the 2 apps to use but I'm not sure.

Thanks.

Troy


Re: Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

James Bentley
 

The experimental Japanese robotic guide dog also got put down.  It couldn’t handle stairs.

 

James B 

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gerald Levy via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, May 6, 2021 5:30 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

 

 

Well, the NYPD's robotic dog didn't work out and had to be put down.  So don't count on a robotic guide dog any time soon.

 

Gerald

 

 

On 5/6/2021 5:39 PM, Pamela Dominguez wrote:

The only kind of guide dog I would ever have would be a robotic one.  Pam.

-----Original Message----- From: Carolyn Arnold
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 5:09 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

Probably there would be a little less maintenance with robotic guide dog.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Pamela Dominguez
Sent: Thursday, May 6, 2021 2:57 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

I guess that would be good for all the people who have smart phones.  But it still wouldn’t be good for the rest of us.  Pam.

From: Victor <mailto:victorelawrence@...>
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 11:34 AM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io <mailto:main@techtalk.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

If I were wealthy, I might purchase this device just to play with it and provide feedback to the developers. In the meantime, why can’t someone just develop existing smart phone apps to do the same thing? Why can’t we just place our smart phones in a wearable lanyard with the phone's camera facing away from our bodies to accomplish the same things? Supersense and other similar apps could accomplish the same things if these apps are developed a little more. If you want this device, go out and purchase it. As for me, I’m not going to run out and purchase this device just because it’s the latest thing that technology developers think is going to be great. They are probably wrong.

I think there was a recently published article about robotic seeing eye dogs. Honestly, I think such a device might be more useful than this device. Again, I have never wanted a seeing eye dog. However, a robotic seeing Eye dog might be useful.

Just my thoughts,

Victor



On May 6, 2021, at 7:43 AM, chris judge <chrisjudge1967@...> wrote:





I’m definitely interested. New tech is always exciting. I wouldn’t pre-order, at least not yet, but if it can do what they claim I may add it to my tech tool kit.



Chris Judge

<https://www.freedomscientific.com/Training/Certification>



From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nimer Jaber
Sent: May 6, 2021 11:37 AM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device



Hello Dave,



This device is mounted to the chest for precisely the reason you mention, the issue that people with glasses or with arm bands and such end up moving about, thus making detecting obstacles more difficult. The chest tends to be relatively proportional with the direction the body is moving in.



They also state that Strap will detect cracks in the sidewalk, and assist users in travelling in a straight line. Is it trailing? Sort of, but no. Guide dog users don't trail either, as you know, and use different clues while traveling to get to where they wish to go.



I do have reservations, I don't think that this device, in its first iteration, will be a great cane replacement, but I do think the developers are worth supporting, and I do hope lots of people buy it to provide the devs feedback, and to help this kind of a product move forward. One concern I have is regarding detection of, for instance, doorways where the door is closed, but this can be a challenge, to different degrees and in different ways, with both a cane and a dog. The cane requires trailing which may be a bit difficult if there is, for instance, lots of outdoor displays or furniture, not to mention a bit noisy, and the dog may or may not want to indicate a particular doorway, and may confuse windows with doors.



Each mobility device has its pros and cons, but I do think that a product like this is worth taking notice of, and at least trying and providing meaningful feedback for.



On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 7:23 AM Dave <dlh007@... <mailto:dlh007@...> > wrote:

Devices like this have been made before.  I recall one such device that
was built into a pair of glasses.  Think they were called Sonar
Glasses.  The user needed to move their Head side to side back and forth
as well as up and down, to have the Beam cover the front, as the person
was walking.


Get to a set of Stairs, and the device would Beep a series of notes like
going up or down a scale.

Now, as far as I am concerned, if someone wants to purchase this type of
devise, go ahead.  If you think it will help you, by all means, go for it.


I can think of one aspect of using a Cane that might be  a problem using
this Strap Device.


I would be curious to try something like this, but at first glance, I
can't see how it could do as good of job as my Cane. But, again, don't
let my thoughts frighten you away.

How would a person Trail, as they are walking along?


Let's say I have one of those situations where I am walking on a walking
area made of pavement, which is blended into the street. On the left,
there is a White line that helps Sighted folks from walking out into the
street.  And on the right is a Seam, or very narrow Crack where the
pavement meets the Cement of a Store Front parking area.


With a Cane I can feel the Texture differences between the pavement and
the Cement, or I might be able to detect the Seam or Crack.  Not sure
how those Sonar device would help in this situation.


And like with the Sonar Glasses of years past, does the operator need to
continuously twist their body from side to side to have the sonar beams
cover what's on the left and right?  That could be an interesting Boogie
Woogie move for someone to do while they are walking.


Personally, I have used a Cane for years, and I did have a guide Dog
for  several years.  I found the Dog was in general, better than using a
Cane, especially in deep Snow and packed Ice conditions.


But, the up keep and care of the Dog, and the reactions to the Dog
others would exhibit were down sides for me.  And when my Dog was
retired, I decided to return to using a Cane.


I have good cane skills so going back was not an issue, unless it Snowed
four or five inches over night, and I now had to wait for others to walk
on the walk ways to make a path I could follow with a Cane.


However, if anyone has this device, or had something like it in the
past, I would be curious to hear of your experiences with it.



Grumpy Dave














Re: Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

Nimer Jaber
 

Hello Mich,

A cane or a dog won't necessarily keep you from falling off a platform, but they will give you the information you need to make a commonsense decision. They do say that the Strap device will be able to provide feedback as to whether it is a shorter or a deeper step, and the sensors will detect even minoot changes of elevation, for instance from sidewalk to grass.

If you don't like vibrations though, this may not be for you.

On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 4:19 PM Mich Verrier <michv@...> wrote:

Hi all after looking around on the strap.tech websight and looking at there faq and other things I would be interested in trying this out but I wouldn’t really pay 500 for it. I am a Seeing Eye dog user and some of the things that I would like to know is will this keep you from as others have said falling in to holes, off traine platforms, or other things where a dog is trained to do? Also the idea that it uses haptic feedback and not audio or voice feed back is kind of interesting as well since I have that feture on my I phone 8 turned off since I found it distracting and annoying. I mutch prefer audio feedback and would struggle with the different vibrations and knowing what they meen. I am not really a fan of that kind of feedback as it is. These are just my inishel thoughts after giving the websight a quick look. From Mich.

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nimer Jaber
Sent: May 6, 2021 7:15 PM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

Hello John,

 

No, it can't tell you about doors, but it will tell you about obstacles, and would work to tell you that you're walking, for instance, through a door. The best mobility tool for finding a door quickly is a dog, when they choose to find the door, that is. You can do so with a cane, but often that requires a lot of trailing and exploration. So you could do the same with strap, but I would probably carry an ID cane or something similar for situations where I do want more tactile feedback of my surroundings. Which isn't very often by the way, and before anyone asks, I do the same thing as a dog user as well.

 

Thanks.

 

On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 3:32 PM John Holcomb II <jhii926@...> wrote:

hmmm.

Interesting.

I absolutely love android for this reason (not that I don’t use iOS), because of how much haptic I can get.

So it could tell me where doors are that kinda thing?

Great. Now  if only it could tell me when  somebody is talking to me in the store, that would be even better!

Then I could communicate on the best way to talk to me so I could conduct my business.

John

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nimer Jaber
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 6:26 PM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

Which is another reason why this device can help you, John, as it doesn't rely on hearing. You would still probably require assistance crossing streets, but would not be as dependent on your hearing for echo location because of the way it works through haptics.

 

On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 8:25 AM John Holcomb II <jhii926@...> wrote:

Then you got people like me who hearing isn’t good enough to be able to walk down a street or anything else on my own.

Not safely, anyway.

Because I  can’t localize sound  or tell how far away cars and other things are with the hearing aids I use.

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nimer Jaber
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 3:17 AM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

This post is my opinion, and is not affiliated with Strap or any other entity. All opinions in this message are my own.

 

Gene,

 

People said the same thing that you're saying about horses, too. And yet, we are now driving cars.

 

Guide dogs already take away much of what the cane gives you, and dog users are quite content being dog users. With a dog, blind people go around obstacles, they don't interact with every obstacle in their path.

 

Does it count when a blind person disparages the cane and says that we need more innovation in the space to get rid of the bloody thing? Because I am one of those blind people.

 

Does it count that I want to be able to travel unencumbered with both hands free?

 

Does it count if I want to not worry about whether someone trips over my cane and breaks it? Or if the tip flies off the cane?

 

Does it matter if I don't want to worry about what happens to my upper body because that trusty cane doesn't protect it while I'm walking? Because believe me, running into scaffolding bloody hurts, and yes, I've done it.

 

Does it matter if I want to be able to actually walk in a straight line? Because, short of tapping against a wall or grass line, there isn't a way to do it with a cane.

 

Does it matter if I wish to traverse through a crowded downtown area, or any crowded environment without running into many things?

 

Does it matter if I want to be inconspicuous, and not be asked whether I, a poor blind man, require assistance to wipe my ass? Because that is essentially what happens to every single blind person I know. I am not approached about my work. I am not approached about my appearance. I am not approached about my shoes. I am not approached about anything except my blindness and someone wanting to help me because they think I am making a mistake trying to cross a street.

 

So, sorry, but we definitely need a cane replacement, in my view, and any blind person disagreeing is, frankly, a complete and utter fool. And, I would ask blind people to support the effort instead of shitting on it, because developers should be encouraged to innovate, not be discouraged by stupid posts like the one I've just read.

 

Does that mean that Strap will, indeed, replace the cane? I don't know, probably not. But it's a much better attempt than we've seen so far, with others trying to reinvent the cane by making it heavier and adding sensors to it.

 

So, I would say, support the effort. Stand by and watch, if you wish. But don't get in the way of what is possibly the most progress we've seen in a long time. We have cars that zoom on the roads autonomously. We have planes that can take off and land themselves. We have trains that can do the same, with minimal to no human interaction. We have probes going into deep space sending back pictures of Mars. And yet, the best the blind people can do, is fight to use their canes, and say they're proud of their canes.

 

I say again, if you don't or can't help, and you don't support the effort, with the nicest and most respectful intent possible, get the hell out of the way, sit down and shut up, and don't stop innovation and progress.

 

And with that, I will no longer engage in this thread, because I can see that more stupidity will be posted, and more people will come out proud to be carrying a stick.

 

On Wed, May 5, 2021 at 11:57 PM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

Isn’t it interesting how the cane is not respected and disparaged because blind people use it?  I don’t see people trying to eliminate cars because unassisted movement is a right and is superior.

 

I’d like to see how expensive this device is.  I’d like to see how long it runs on a charge.  I’d like to see if it gives me information about my nearby environment such as where a doorway is to a building or where there is grass to my left and where that grass is interrupted by a driveway, which may be necessary for me to find with my cane to know where I turn to move toward a building and the counting of driveways and walkways may be necessary for me to know when I’m turning at the right place. 

 

Device after device has been made and they have none of them been widely adopted.  Maybe there is a reason.

 

Blindness is considered a tragedy and the ways blind people do things are often disparaged, guilt by association.  Some ways blind people do things are neutral, some inferior, some superior.  Will it be replaced at some point by something superior?  Who knows.  but its persistence and wide use should give those who chaff at the bit to eliminate it pause.

 

As G.K. Chesterton said:

“Don't ever take a fence down until you know the reason it was put up.”

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 1:39 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

Hello everyone,

 

Three years in the making, STRAP is an innovative, wearable device that fits over the chest and is designed to detect any type of obstacle. STRAP’s vast array of sensors work by sending real-time information that detects obstacles at your head, chest, and below your waist - including bumps, holes, and steps, then notifying you with haptic language vibrations. Designed for all ages and shipped globally later this year.

 

At STRAP Technologies we believe autonomy and independence are human rights; not luxuries. Our goal is to be the first replacement of the white cane, giving the visually impaired a long overdue hands free experience.

 

Use code BlindTech strap.tech, for 50% off the current total price of a STRAP device. Preorder today at this discounted price of $250 and pay only $50 at this time to reserve your STRAP. Once STRAP is shipped to you, you will be billed the remaining $200. This offer is just available with this Blind Tech Guys Code.

 

The Blind Tech Guys are pleased to offer you the above exclusive code and we are delighted to share this with our ever-growing community, so if you are keen to try this product, we encourage you to pre-order it and keep an eye out for a demo of the product to hit your ears sometime soon.

 

Warm regards,

 

Marco Curralejo

 


 

--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.


Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.

 

Thank you, and have a great day!


 

--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.


Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.

 

Thank you, and have a great day!


 

--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.


Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.

 

Thank you, and have a great day!



--
Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.

Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.

Thank you, and have a great day!


Re: Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

Mich Verrier
 

Hi all after looking around on the strap.tech websight and looking at there faq and other things I would be interested in trying this out but I wouldn’t really pay 500 for it. I am a Seeing Eye dog user and some of the things that I would like to know is will this keep you from as others have said falling in to holes, off traine platforms, or other things where a dog is trained to do? Also the idea that it uses haptic feedback and not audio or voice feed back is kind of interesting as well since I have that feture on my I phone 8 turned off since I found it distracting and annoying. I mutch prefer audio feedback and would struggle with the different vibrations and knowing what they meen. I am not really a fan of that kind of feedback as it is. These are just my inishel thoughts after giving the websight a quick look. From Mich.

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nimer Jaber
Sent: May 6, 2021 7:15 PM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

Hello John,

 

No, it can't tell you about doors, but it will tell you about obstacles, and would work to tell you that you're walking, for instance, through a door. The best mobility tool for finding a door quickly is a dog, when they choose to find the door, that is. You can do so with a cane, but often that requires a lot of trailing and exploration. So you could do the same with strap, but I would probably carry an ID cane or something similar for situations where I do want more tactile feedback of my surroundings. Which isn't very often by the way, and before anyone asks, I do the same thing as a dog user as well.

 

Thanks.

 

On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 3:32 PM John Holcomb II <jhii926@...> wrote:

hmmm.

Interesting.

I absolutely love android for this reason (not that I don’t use iOS), because of how much haptic I can get.

So it could tell me where doors are that kinda thing?

Great. Now  if only it could tell me when  somebody is talking to me in the store, that would be even better!

Then I could communicate on the best way to talk to me so I could conduct my business.

John

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nimer Jaber
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 6:26 PM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

Which is another reason why this device can help you, John, as it doesn't rely on hearing. You would still probably require assistance crossing streets, but would not be as dependent on your hearing for echo location because of the way it works through haptics.

 

On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 8:25 AM John Holcomb II <jhii926@...> wrote:

Then you got people like me who hearing isn’t good enough to be able to walk down a street or anything else on my own.

Not safely, anyway.

Because I  can’t localize sound  or tell how far away cars and other things are with the hearing aids I use.

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nimer Jaber
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 3:17 AM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

This post is my opinion, and is not affiliated with Strap or any other entity. All opinions in this message are my own.

 

Gene,

 

People said the same thing that you're saying about horses, too. And yet, we are now driving cars.

 

Guide dogs already take away much of what the cane gives you, and dog users are quite content being dog users. With a dog, blind people go around obstacles, they don't interact with every obstacle in their path.

 

Does it count when a blind person disparages the cane and says that we need more innovation in the space to get rid of the bloody thing? Because I am one of those blind people.

 

Does it count that I want to be able to travel unencumbered with both hands free?

 

Does it count if I want to not worry about whether someone trips over my cane and breaks it? Or if the tip flies off the cane?

 

Does it matter if I don't want to worry about what happens to my upper body because that trusty cane doesn't protect it while I'm walking? Because believe me, running into scaffolding bloody hurts, and yes, I've done it.

 

Does it matter if I want to be able to actually walk in a straight line? Because, short of tapping against a wall or grass line, there isn't a way to do it with a cane.

 

Does it matter if I wish to traverse through a crowded downtown area, or any crowded environment without running into many things?

 

Does it matter if I want to be inconspicuous, and not be asked whether I, a poor blind man, require assistance to wipe my ass? Because that is essentially what happens to every single blind person I know. I am not approached about my work. I am not approached about my appearance. I am not approached about my shoes. I am not approached about anything except my blindness and someone wanting to help me because they think I am making a mistake trying to cross a street.

 

So, sorry, but we definitely need a cane replacement, in my view, and any blind person disagreeing is, frankly, a complete and utter fool. And, I would ask blind people to support the effort instead of shitting on it, because developers should be encouraged to innovate, not be discouraged by stupid posts like the one I've just read.

 

Does that mean that Strap will, indeed, replace the cane? I don't know, probably not. But it's a much better attempt than we've seen so far, with others trying to reinvent the cane by making it heavier and adding sensors to it.

 

So, I would say, support the effort. Stand by and watch, if you wish. But don't get in the way of what is possibly the most progress we've seen in a long time. We have cars that zoom on the roads autonomously. We have planes that can take off and land themselves. We have trains that can do the same, with minimal to no human interaction. We have probes going into deep space sending back pictures of Mars. And yet, the best the blind people can do, is fight to use their canes, and say they're proud of their canes.

 

I say again, if you don't or can't help, and you don't support the effort, with the nicest and most respectful intent possible, get the hell out of the way, sit down and shut up, and don't stop innovation and progress.

 

And with that, I will no longer engage in this thread, because I can see that more stupidity will be posted, and more people will come out proud to be carrying a stick.

 

On Wed, May 5, 2021 at 11:57 PM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

Isn’t it interesting how the cane is not respected and disparaged because blind people use it?  I don’t see people trying to eliminate cars because unassisted movement is a right and is superior.

 

I’d like to see how expensive this device is.  I’d like to see how long it runs on a charge.  I’d like to see if it gives me information about my nearby environment such as where a doorway is to a building or where there is grass to my left and where that grass is interrupted by a driveway, which may be necessary for me to find with my cane to know where I turn to move toward a building and the counting of driveways and walkways may be necessary for me to know when I’m turning at the right place. 

 

Device after device has been made and they have none of them been widely adopted.  Maybe there is a reason.

 

Blindness is considered a tragedy and the ways blind people do things are often disparaged, guilt by association.  Some ways blind people do things are neutral, some inferior, some superior.  Will it be replaced at some point by something superior?  Who knows.  but its persistence and wide use should give those who chaff at the bit to eliminate it pause.

 

As G.K. Chesterton said:

“Don't ever take a fence down until you know the reason it was put up.”

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 1:39 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

Hello everyone,

 

Three years in the making, STRAP is an innovative, wearable device that fits over the chest and is designed to detect any type of obstacle. STRAP’s vast array of sensors work by sending real-time information that detects obstacles at your head, chest, and below your waist - including bumps, holes, and steps, then notifying you with haptic language vibrations. Designed for all ages and shipped globally later this year.

 

At STRAP Technologies we believe autonomy and independence are human rights; not luxuries. Our goal is to be the first replacement of the white cane, giving the visually impaired a long overdue hands free experience.

 

Use code BlindTech strap.tech, for 50% off the current total price of a STRAP device. Preorder today at this discounted price of $250 and pay only $50 at this time to reserve your STRAP. Once STRAP is shipped to you, you will be billed the remaining $200. This offer is just available with this Blind Tech Guys Code.

 

The Blind Tech Guys are pleased to offer you the above exclusive code and we are delighted to share this with our ever-growing community, so if you are keen to try this product, we encourage you to pre-order it and keep an eye out for a demo of the product to hit your ears sometime soon.

 

Warm regards,

 

Marco Curralejo

 


 

--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.


Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.

 

Thank you, and have a great day!


 

--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.


Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.

 

Thank you, and have a great day!


 

--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.


Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.

 

Thank you, and have a great day!


Re: Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

Nimer Jaber
 

Hello John,

No, it can't tell you about doors, but it will tell you about obstacles, and would work to tell you that you're walking, for instance, through a door. The best mobility tool for finding a door quickly is a dog, when they choose to find the door, that is. You can do so with a cane, but often that requires a lot of trailing and exploration. So you could do the same with strap, but I would probably carry an ID cane or something similar for situations where I do want more tactile feedback of my surroundings. Which isn't very often by the way, and before anyone asks, I do the same thing as a dog user as well.

Thanks.

On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 3:32 PM John Holcomb II <jhii926@...> wrote:

hmmm.

Interesting.

I absolutely love android for this reason (not that I don’t use iOS), because of how much haptic I can get.

So it could tell me where doors are that kinda thing?

Great. Now  if only it could tell me when  somebody is talking to me in the store, that would be even better!

Then I could communicate on the best way to talk to me so I could conduct my business.

John

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nimer Jaber
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 6:26 PM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

Which is another reason why this device can help you, John, as it doesn't rely on hearing. You would still probably require assistance crossing streets, but would not be as dependent on your hearing for echo location because of the way it works through haptics.

 

On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 8:25 AM John Holcomb II <jhii926@...> wrote:

Then you got people like me who hearing isn’t good enough to be able to walk down a street or anything else on my own.

Not safely, anyway.

Because I  can’t localize sound  or tell how far away cars and other things are with the hearing aids I use.

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nimer Jaber
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 3:17 AM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

This post is my opinion, and is not affiliated with Strap or any other entity. All opinions in this message are my own.

 

Gene,

 

People said the same thing that you're saying about horses, too. And yet, we are now driving cars.

 

Guide dogs already take away much of what the cane gives you, and dog users are quite content being dog users. With a dog, blind people go around obstacles, they don't interact with every obstacle in their path.

 

Does it count when a blind person disparages the cane and says that we need more innovation in the space to get rid of the bloody thing? Because I am one of those blind people.

 

Does it count that I want to be able to travel unencumbered with both hands free?

 

Does it count if I want to not worry about whether someone trips over my cane and breaks it? Or if the tip flies off the cane?

 

Does it matter if I don't want to worry about what happens to my upper body because that trusty cane doesn't protect it while I'm walking? Because believe me, running into scaffolding bloody hurts, and yes, I've done it.

 

Does it matter if I want to be able to actually walk in a straight line? Because, short of tapping against a wall or grass line, there isn't a way to do it with a cane.

 

Does it matter if I wish to traverse through a crowded downtown area, or any crowded environment without running into many things?

 

Does it matter if I want to be inconspicuous, and not be asked whether I, a poor blind man, require assistance to wipe my ass? Because that is essentially what happens to every single blind person I know. I am not approached about my work. I am not approached about my appearance. I am not approached about my shoes. I am not approached about anything except my blindness and someone wanting to help me because they think I am making a mistake trying to cross a street.

 

So, sorry, but we definitely need a cane replacement, in my view, and any blind person disagreeing is, frankly, a complete and utter fool. And, I would ask blind people to support the effort instead of shitting on it, because developers should be encouraged to innovate, not be discouraged by stupid posts like the one I've just read.

 

Does that mean that Strap will, indeed, replace the cane? I don't know, probably not. But it's a much better attempt than we've seen so far, with others trying to reinvent the cane by making it heavier and adding sensors to it.

 

So, I would say, support the effort. Stand by and watch, if you wish. But don't get in the way of what is possibly the most progress we've seen in a long time. We have cars that zoom on the roads autonomously. We have planes that can take off and land themselves. We have trains that can do the same, with minimal to no human interaction. We have probes going into deep space sending back pictures of Mars. And yet, the best the blind people can do, is fight to use their canes, and say they're proud of their canes.

 

I say again, if you don't or can't help, and you don't support the effort, with the nicest and most respectful intent possible, get the hell out of the way, sit down and shut up, and don't stop innovation and progress.

 

And with that, I will no longer engage in this thread, because I can see that more stupidity will be posted, and more people will come out proud to be carrying a stick.

 

On Wed, May 5, 2021 at 11:57 PM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

Isn’t it interesting how the cane is not respected and disparaged because blind people use it?  I don’t see people trying to eliminate cars because unassisted movement is a right and is superior.

 

I’d like to see how expensive this device is.  I’d like to see how long it runs on a charge.  I’d like to see if it gives me information about my nearby environment such as where a doorway is to a building or where there is grass to my left and where that grass is interrupted by a driveway, which may be necessary for me to find with my cane to know where I turn to move toward a building and the counting of driveways and walkways may be necessary for me to know when I’m turning at the right place. 

 

Device after device has been made and they have none of them been widely adopted.  Maybe there is a reason.

 

Blindness is considered a tragedy and the ways blind people do things are often disparaged, guilt by association.  Some ways blind people do things are neutral, some inferior, some superior.  Will it be replaced at some point by something superior?  Who knows.  but its persistence and wide use should give those who chaff at the bit to eliminate it pause.

 

As G.K. Chesterton said:

“Don't ever take a fence down until you know the reason it was put up.”

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 1:39 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

Hello everyone,

 

Three years in the making, STRAP is an innovative, wearable device that fits over the chest and is designed to detect any type of obstacle. STRAP’s vast array of sensors work by sending real-time information that detects obstacles at your head, chest, and below your waist - including bumps, holes, and steps, then notifying you with haptic language vibrations. Designed for all ages and shipped globally later this year.

 

At STRAP Technologies we believe autonomy and independence are human rights; not luxuries. Our goal is to be the first replacement of the white cane, giving the visually impaired a long overdue hands free experience.

 

Use code BlindTech strap.tech, for 50% off the current total price of a STRAP device. Preorder today at this discounted price of $250 and pay only $50 at this time to reserve your STRAP. Once STRAP is shipped to you, you will be billed the remaining $200. This offer is just available with this Blind Tech Guys Code.

 

The Blind Tech Guys are pleased to offer you the above exclusive code and we are delighted to share this with our ever-growing community, so if you are keen to try this product, we encourage you to pre-order it and keep an eye out for a demo of the product to hit your ears sometime soon.

 

Warm regards,

 

Marco Curralejo

 


 

--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.


Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.

 

Thank you, and have a great day!


 

--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.


Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.

 

Thank you, and have a great day!



--
Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.

Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.

Thank you, and have a great day!


Re: Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

chris judge
 

Until I can train one of my kittycats I'll be doing the cane thing as well. I tried guide dogs in the past, not for me.

Chris Judge

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Pamela Dominguez
Sent: May 6, 2021 6:40 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

The only kind of guide dog I would ever have would be a robotic one. Pam.

-----Original Message-----
From: Carolyn Arnold
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 5:09 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

Probably there would be a little less maintenance with robotic guide dog.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Pamela Dominguez
Sent: Thursday, May 6, 2021 2:57 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

I guess that would be good for all the people who have smart phones. But it still wouldn’t be good for the rest of us. Pam.

From: Victor <mailto:victorelawrence@gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 11:34 AM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io <mailto:main@techtalk.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

If I were wealthy, I might purchase this device just to play with it and provide feedback to the developers. In the meantime, why can’t someone just develop existing smart phone apps to do the same thing? Why can’t we just place our smart phones in a wearable lanyard with the phone's camera facing away from our bodies to accomplish the same things? Supersense and other similar apps could accomplish the same things if these apps are developed a little more. If you want this device, go out and purchase it. As for me, I’m not going to run out and purchase this device just because it’s the latest thing that technology developers think is going to be great. They are probably wrong.

I think there was a recently published article about robotic seeing eye dogs. Honestly, I think such a device might be more useful than this device.
Again, I have never wanted a seeing eye dog. However, a robotic seeing Eye dog might be useful.

Just my thoughts,

Victor



On May 6, 2021, at 7:43 AM, chris judge <chrisjudge1967@gmail.com> wrote:





I’m definitely interested. New tech is always exciting. I wouldn’t pre-order, at least not yet, but if it can do what they claim I may add it to my tech tool kit.



Chris Judge

<https://www.freedomscientific.com/Training/Certification>



From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nimer Jaber
Sent: May 6, 2021 11:37 AM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device



Hello Dave,



This device is mounted to the chest for precisely the reason you mention,
the issue that people with glasses or with arm bands and such end up moving
about, thus making detecting obstacles more difficult. The chest tends to be
relatively proportional with the direction the body is moving in.



They also state that Strap will detect cracks in the sidewalk, and assist
users in travelling in a straight line. Is it trailing? Sort of, but no.
Guide dog users don't trail either, as you know, and use different clues
while traveling to get to where they wish to go.



I do have reservations, I don't think that this device, in its first
iteration, will be a great cane replacement, but I do think the developers
are worth supporting, and I do hope lots of people buy it to provide the
devs feedback, and to help this kind of a product move forward. One concern
I have is regarding detection of, for instance, doorways where the door is
closed, but this can be a challenge, to different degrees and in different
ways, with both a cane and a dog. The cane requires trailing which may be a
bit difficult if there is, for instance, lots of outdoor displays or
furniture, not to mention a bit noisy, and the dog may or may not want to
indicate a particular doorway, and may confuse windows with doors.



Each mobility device has its pros and cons, but I do think that a product
like this is worth taking notice of, and at least trying and providing
meaningful feedback for.



On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 7:23 AM Dave <dlh007@centurylink.net
<mailto:dlh007@centurylink.net> > wrote:

Devices like this have been made before. I recall one such device that
was built into a pair of glasses. Think they were called Sonar
Glasses. The user needed to move their Head side to side back and forth
as well as up and down, to have the Beam cover the front, as the person
was walking.


Get to a set of Stairs, and the device would Beep a series of notes like
going up or down a scale.

Now, as far as I am concerned, if someone wants to purchase this type of
devise, go ahead. If you think it will help you, by all means, go for it.


I can think of one aspect of using a Cane that might be a problem using
this Strap Device.


I would be curious to try something like this, but at first glance, I
can't see how it could do as good of job as my Cane. But, again, don't
let my thoughts frighten you away.

How would a person Trail, as they are walking along?


Let's say I have one of those situations where I am walking on a walking
area made of pavement, which is blended into the street. On the left,
there is a White line that helps Sighted folks from walking out into the
street. And on the right is a Seam, or very narrow Crack where the
pavement meets the Cement of a Store Front parking area.


With a Cane I can feel the Texture differences between the pavement and
the Cement, or I might be able to detect the Seam or Crack. Not sure
how those Sonar device would help in this situation.


And like with the Sonar Glasses of years past, does the operator need to
continuously twist their body from side to side to have the sonar beams
cover what's on the left and right? That could be an interesting Boogie
Woogie move for someone to do while they are walking.


Personally, I have used a Cane for years, and I did have a guide Dog
for several years. I found the Dog was in general, better than using a
Cane, especially in deep Snow and packed Ice conditions.


But, the up keep and care of the Dog, and the reactions to the Dog
others would exhibit were down sides for me. And when my Dog was
retired, I decided to return to using a Cane.


I have good cane skills so going back was not an issue, unless it Snowed
four or five inches over night, and I now had to wait for others to walk
on the walk ways to make a path I could follow with a Cane.


However, if anyone has this device, or had something like it in the
past, I would be curious to hear of your experiences with it.



Grumpy Dave














--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.


Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for
Windows, visit nvaccess.org <http://www.nvda-project.org>

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970)
(393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.



Thank you, and have a great day!




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Re: Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

John Holcomb II
 

hmmm.

Interesting.

I absolutely love android for this reason (not that I don’t use iOS), because of how much haptic I can get.

So it could tell me where doors are that kinda thing?

Great. Now  if only it could tell me when  somebody is talking to me in the store, that would be even better!

Then I could communicate on the best way to talk to me so I could conduct my business.

John

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nimer Jaber
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 6:26 PM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

Which is another reason why this device can help you, John, as it doesn't rely on hearing. You would still probably require assistance crossing streets, but would not be as dependent on your hearing for echo location because of the way it works through haptics.

 

On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 8:25 AM John Holcomb II <jhii926@...> wrote:

Then you got people like me who hearing isn’t good enough to be able to walk down a street or anything else on my own.

Not safely, anyway.

Because I  can’t localize sound  or tell how far away cars and other things are with the hearing aids I use.

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nimer Jaber
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 3:17 AM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

This post is my opinion, and is not affiliated with Strap or any other entity. All opinions in this message are my own.

 

Gene,

 

People said the same thing that you're saying about horses, too. And yet, we are now driving cars.

 

Guide dogs already take away much of what the cane gives you, and dog users are quite content being dog users. With a dog, blind people go around obstacles, they don't interact with every obstacle in their path.

 

Does it count when a blind person disparages the cane and says that we need more innovation in the space to get rid of the bloody thing? Because I am one of those blind people.

 

Does it count that I want to be able to travel unencumbered with both hands free?

 

Does it count if I want to not worry about whether someone trips over my cane and breaks it? Or if the tip flies off the cane?

 

Does it matter if I don't want to worry about what happens to my upper body because that trusty cane doesn't protect it while I'm walking? Because believe me, running into scaffolding bloody hurts, and yes, I've done it.

 

Does it matter if I want to be able to actually walk in a straight line? Because, short of tapping against a wall or grass line, there isn't a way to do it with a cane.

 

Does it matter if I wish to traverse through a crowded downtown area, or any crowded environment without running into many things?

 

Does it matter if I want to be inconspicuous, and not be asked whether I, a poor blind man, require assistance to wipe my ass? Because that is essentially what happens to every single blind person I know. I am not approached about my work. I am not approached about my appearance. I am not approached about my shoes. I am not approached about anything except my blindness and someone wanting to help me because they think I am making a mistake trying to cross a street.

 

So, sorry, but we definitely need a cane replacement, in my view, and any blind person disagreeing is, frankly, a complete and utter fool. And, I would ask blind people to support the effort instead of shitting on it, because developers should be encouraged to innovate, not be discouraged by stupid posts like the one I've just read.

 

Does that mean that Strap will, indeed, replace the cane? I don't know, probably not. But it's a much better attempt than we've seen so far, with others trying to reinvent the cane by making it heavier and adding sensors to it.

 

So, I would say, support the effort. Stand by and watch, if you wish. But don't get in the way of what is possibly the most progress we've seen in a long time. We have cars that zoom on the roads autonomously. We have planes that can take off and land themselves. We have trains that can do the same, with minimal to no human interaction. We have probes going into deep space sending back pictures of Mars. And yet, the best the blind people can do, is fight to use their canes, and say they're proud of their canes.

 

I say again, if you don't or can't help, and you don't support the effort, with the nicest and most respectful intent possible, get the hell out of the way, sit down and shut up, and don't stop innovation and progress.

 

And with that, I will no longer engage in this thread, because I can see that more stupidity will be posted, and more people will come out proud to be carrying a stick.

 

On Wed, May 5, 2021 at 11:57 PM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

Isn’t it interesting how the cane is not respected and disparaged because blind people use it?  I don’t see people trying to eliminate cars because unassisted movement is a right and is superior.

 

I’d like to see how expensive this device is.  I’d like to see how long it runs on a charge.  I’d like to see if it gives me information about my nearby environment such as where a doorway is to a building or where there is grass to my left and where that grass is interrupted by a driveway, which may be necessary for me to find with my cane to know where I turn to move toward a building and the counting of driveways and walkways may be necessary for me to know when I’m turning at the right place. 

 

Device after device has been made and they have none of them been widely adopted.  Maybe there is a reason.

 

Blindness is considered a tragedy and the ways blind people do things are often disparaged, guilt by association.  Some ways blind people do things are neutral, some inferior, some superior.  Will it be replaced at some point by something superior?  Who knows.  but its persistence and wide use should give those who chaff at the bit to eliminate it pause.

 

As G.K. Chesterton said:

“Don't ever take a fence down until you know the reason it was put up.”

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 1:39 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

Hello everyone,

 

Three years in the making, STRAP is an innovative, wearable device that fits over the chest and is designed to detect any type of obstacle. STRAP’s vast array of sensors work by sending real-time information that detects obstacles at your head, chest, and below your waist - including bumps, holes, and steps, then notifying you with haptic language vibrations. Designed for all ages and shipped globally later this year.

 

At STRAP Technologies we believe autonomy and independence are human rights; not luxuries. Our goal is to be the first replacement of the white cane, giving the visually impaired a long overdue hands free experience.

 

Use code BlindTech strap.tech, for 50% off the current total price of a STRAP device. Preorder today at this discounted price of $250 and pay only $50 at this time to reserve your STRAP. Once STRAP is shipped to you, you will be billed the remaining $200. This offer is just available with this Blind Tech Guys Code.

 

The Blind Tech Guys are pleased to offer you the above exclusive code and we are delighted to share this with our ever-growing community, so if you are keen to try this product, we encourage you to pre-order it and keep an eye out for a demo of the product to hit your ears sometime soon.

 

Warm regards,

 

Marco Curralejo

 


 

--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.


Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.

 

Thank you, and have a great day!


 

--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.


Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.

 

Thank you, and have a great day!


Re: Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

Gerald Levy
 


Well, the NYPD's robotic dog didn't work out and had to be put down.  So don't count on a robotic guide dog any time soon.


Gerald



On 5/6/2021 5:39 PM, Pamela Dominguez wrote:
The only kind of guide dog I would ever have would be a robotic one.  Pam.

-----Original Message----- From: Carolyn Arnold
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 5:09 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

Probably there would be a little less maintenance with robotic guide dog.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Pamela Dominguez
Sent: Thursday, May 6, 2021 2:57 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

I guess that would be good for all the people who have smart phones.  But it still wouldn’t be good for the rest of us.  Pam.

From: Victor <mailto:victorelawrence@...>
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 11:34 AM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io <mailto:main@techtalk.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

If I were wealthy, I might purchase this device just to play with it and provide feedback to the developers. In the meantime, why can’t someone just develop existing smart phone apps to do the same thing? Why can’t we just place our smart phones in a wearable lanyard with the phone's camera facing away from our bodies to accomplish the same things? Supersense and other similar apps could accomplish the same things if these apps are developed a little more. If you want this device, go out and purchase it. As for me, I’m not going to run out and purchase this device just because it’s the latest thing that technology developers think is going to be great. They are probably wrong.

I think there was a recently published article about robotic seeing eye dogs. Honestly, I think such a device might be more useful than this device. Again, I have never wanted a seeing eye dog. However, a robotic seeing Eye dog might be useful.

Just my thoughts,

Victor



On May 6, 2021, at 7:43 AM, chris judge <chrisjudge1967@...> wrote:





I’m definitely interested. New tech is always exciting. I wouldn’t pre-order, at least not yet, but if it can do what they claim I may add it to my tech tool kit.



Chris Judge

<https://www.freedomscientific.com/Training/Certification>



From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nimer Jaber
Sent: May 6, 2021 11:37 AM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device



Hello Dave,



This device is mounted to the chest for precisely the reason you mention, the issue that people with glasses or with arm bands and such end up moving about, thus making detecting obstacles more difficult. The chest tends to be relatively proportional with the direction the body is moving in.



They also state that Strap will detect cracks in the sidewalk, and assist users in travelling in a straight line. Is it trailing? Sort of, but no. Guide dog users don't trail either, as you know, and use different clues while traveling to get to where they wish to go.



I do have reservations, I don't think that this device, in its first iteration, will be a great cane replacement, but I do think the developers are worth supporting, and I do hope lots of people buy it to provide the devs feedback, and to help this kind of a product move forward. One concern I have is regarding detection of, for instance, doorways where the door is closed, but this can be a challenge, to different degrees and in different ways, with both a cane and a dog. The cane requires trailing which may be a bit difficult if there is, for instance, lots of outdoor displays or furniture, not to mention a bit noisy, and the dog may or may not want to indicate a particular doorway, and may confuse windows with doors.



Each mobility device has its pros and cons, but I do think that a product like this is worth taking notice of, and at least trying and providing meaningful feedback for.



On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 7:23 AM Dave <dlh007@... <mailto:dlh007@...> > wrote:

Devices like this have been made before.  I recall one such device that
was built into a pair of glasses.  Think they were called Sonar
Glasses.  The user needed to move their Head side to side back and forth
as well as up and down, to have the Beam cover the front, as the person
was walking.


Get to a set of Stairs, and the device would Beep a series of notes like
going up or down a scale.

Now, as far as I am concerned, if someone wants to purchase this type of
devise, go ahead.  If you think it will help you, by all means, go for it.


I can think of one aspect of using a Cane that might be  a problem using
this Strap Device.


I would be curious to try something like this, but at first glance, I
can't see how it could do as good of job as my Cane. But, again, don't
let my thoughts frighten you away.

How would a person Trail, as they are walking along?


Let's say I have one of those situations where I am walking on a walking
area made of pavement, which is blended into the street. On the left,
there is a White line that helps Sighted folks from walking out into the
street.  And on the right is a Seam, or very narrow Crack where the
pavement meets the Cement of a Store Front parking area.


With a Cane I can feel the Texture differences between the pavement and
the Cement, or I might be able to detect the Seam or Crack.  Not sure
how those Sonar device would help in this situation.


And like with the Sonar Glasses of years past, does the operator need to
continuously twist their body from side to side to have the sonar beams
cover what's on the left and right?  That could be an interesting Boogie
Woogie move for someone to do while they are walking.


Personally, I have used a Cane for years, and I did have a guide Dog
for  several years.  I found the Dog was in general, better than using a
Cane, especially in deep Snow and packed Ice conditions.


But, the up keep and care of the Dog, and the reactions to the Dog
others would exhibit were down sides for me.  And when my Dog was
retired, I decided to return to using a Cane.


I have good cane skills so going back was not an issue, unless it Snowed
four or five inches over night, and I now had to wait for others to walk
on the walk ways to make a path I could follow with a Cane.


However, if anyone has this device, or had something like it in the
past, I would be curious to hear of your experiences with it.



Grumpy Dave















Re: Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

Nimer Jaber
 

Which is another reason why this device can help you, John, as it doesn't rely on hearing. You would still probably require assistance crossing streets, but would not be as dependent on your hearing for echo location because of the way it works through haptics.


On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 8:25 AM John Holcomb II <jhii926@...> wrote:

Then you got people like me who hearing isn’t good enough to be able to walk down a street or anything else on my own.

Not safely, anyway.

Because I  can’t localize sound  or tell how far away cars and other things are with the hearing aids I use.

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nimer Jaber
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 3:17 AM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

This post is my opinion, and is not affiliated with Strap or any other entity. All opinions in this message are my own.

 

Gene,

 

People said the same thing that you're saying about horses, too. And yet, we are now driving cars.

 

Guide dogs already take away much of what the cane gives you, and dog users are quite content being dog users. With a dog, blind people go around obstacles, they don't interact with every obstacle in their path.

 

Does it count when a blind person disparages the cane and says that we need more innovation in the space to get rid of the bloody thing? Because I am one of those blind people.

 

Does it count that I want to be able to travel unencumbered with both hands free?

 

Does it count if I want to not worry about whether someone trips over my cane and breaks it? Or if the tip flies off the cane?

 

Does it matter if I don't want to worry about what happens to my upper body because that trusty cane doesn't protect it while I'm walking? Because believe me, running into scaffolding bloody hurts, and yes, I've done it.

 

Does it matter if I want to be able to actually walk in a straight line? Because, short of tapping against a wall or grass line, there isn't a way to do it with a cane.

 

Does it matter if I wish to traverse through a crowded downtown area, or any crowded environment without running into many things?

 

Does it matter if I want to be inconspicuous, and not be asked whether I, a poor blind man, require assistance to wipe my ass? Because that is essentially what happens to every single blind person I know. I am not approached about my work. I am not approached about my appearance. I am not approached about my shoes. I am not approached about anything except my blindness and someone wanting to help me because they think I am making a mistake trying to cross a street.

 

So, sorry, but we definitely need a cane replacement, in my view, and any blind person disagreeing is, frankly, a complete and utter fool. And, I would ask blind people to support the effort instead of shitting on it, because developers should be encouraged to innovate, not be discouraged by stupid posts like the one I've just read.

 

Does that mean that Strap will, indeed, replace the cane? I don't know, probably not. But it's a much better attempt than we've seen so far, with others trying to reinvent the cane by making it heavier and adding sensors to it.

 

So, I would say, support the effort. Stand by and watch, if you wish. But don't get in the way of what is possibly the most progress we've seen in a long time. We have cars that zoom on the roads autonomously. We have planes that can take off and land themselves. We have trains that can do the same, with minimal to no human interaction. We have probes going into deep space sending back pictures of Mars. And yet, the best the blind people can do, is fight to use their canes, and say they're proud of their canes.

 

I say again, if you don't or can't help, and you don't support the effort, with the nicest and most respectful intent possible, get the hell out of the way, sit down and shut up, and don't stop innovation and progress.

 

And with that, I will no longer engage in this thread, because I can see that more stupidity will be posted, and more people will come out proud to be carrying a stick.

 

On Wed, May 5, 2021 at 11:57 PM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

Isn’t it interesting how the cane is not respected and disparaged because blind people use it?  I don’t see people trying to eliminate cars because unassisted movement is a right and is superior.

 

I’d like to see how expensive this device is.  I’d like to see how long it runs on a charge.  I’d like to see if it gives me information about my nearby environment such as where a doorway is to a building or where there is grass to my left and where that grass is interrupted by a driveway, which may be necessary for me to find with my cane to know where I turn to move toward a building and the counting of driveways and walkways may be necessary for me to know when I’m turning at the right place. 

 

Device after device has been made and they have none of them been widely adopted.  Maybe there is a reason.

 

Blindness is considered a tragedy and the ways blind people do things are often disparaged, guilt by association.  Some ways blind people do things are neutral, some inferior, some superior.  Will it be replaced at some point by something superior?  Who knows.  but its persistence and wide use should give those who chaff at the bit to eliminate it pause.

 

As G.K. Chesterton said:

“Don't ever take a fence down until you know the reason it was put up.”

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 1:39 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

Hello everyone,

 

Three years in the making, STRAP is an innovative, wearable device that fits over the chest and is designed to detect any type of obstacle. STRAP’s vast array of sensors work by sending real-time information that detects obstacles at your head, chest, and below your waist - including bumps, holes, and steps, then notifying you with haptic language vibrations. Designed for all ages and shipped globally later this year.

 

At STRAP Technologies we believe autonomy and independence are human rights; not luxuries. Our goal is to be the first replacement of the white cane, giving the visually impaired a long overdue hands free experience.

 

Use code BlindTech strap.tech, for 50% off the current total price of a STRAP device. Preorder today at this discounted price of $250 and pay only $50 at this time to reserve your STRAP. Once STRAP is shipped to you, you will be billed the remaining $200. This offer is just available with this Blind Tech Guys Code.

 

The Blind Tech Guys are pleased to offer you the above exclusive code and we are delighted to share this with our ever-growing community, so if you are keen to try this product, we encourage you to pre-order it and keep an eye out for a demo of the product to hit your ears sometime soon.

 

Warm regards,

 

Marco Curralejo

 


 

--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.


Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.

 

Thank you, and have a great day!



--
Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.

Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.

Thank you, and have a great day!


Re: Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

Nimer Jaber
 

Hello,

The reason that smartphones aren't used is because smartphones don't have the sensors required, and smartphones don't have the amount of cameras required to achieve the same level of precision from the front and sides of the body that the Strap device offers. It also wouldn't be great should you choose to use your phone while out and about. I do use my phone for something similar, using the vOICe app, and get soundscapes of what is in the image, which helps in obstacle avoidance and crossing streets and such. Before anyone asks, yes, you can cross streets with just a cane, and I do it all the time, but a cane won't help you stay in the crosswalk without veering, particularly on very wide roads, and it won't help you realize that there is a turn lane and an island that you must cross to first before crossing the rest of the road. A cane also doesn't see things as far, and when you walk quickly, as I do, every bit of extra reaction time is a great thing.

On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 1:50 PM Victor <victorelawrence@...> wrote:
That's true.  But in the longrun, I think a smart phone will be  more  useful.  Especially  if  this  device  isn't  popular  and  they  stop  making  it.

Victor


On May 6, 2021, at 11:57 AM, Pamela Dominguez <pammygirl99@...> wrote:


I guess that would be good for all the people who have smart phones.  But it still wouldn’t be good for the rest of us.  Pam.
 
From: Victor
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 11:34 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device
 
If I were wealthy, I might purchase this device just to play with it and provide feedback to the developers. In the meantime, why can’t someone just develop existing smart phone apps to do the same thing? Why can’t we just place our smart phones in a wearable lanyard with the phone's camera facing away from our bodies to accomplish the same things? Supersense and other similar apps could accomplish the same things if these apps are developed a little more. If you want this device, go out and purchase it. As for me, I’m not going to run out and purchase this device just because it’s the latest thing that technology developers think is going to be great. They are probably wrong.
 
I think there was a recently published article about robotic seeing eye dogs. Honestly, I think such a device might be more useful than this device. Again, I have never wanted a seeing eye dog. However, a robotic seeing Eye dog might be useful.
 
Just my thoughts,
 
Victor
 

On May 6, 2021, at 7:43 AM, chris judge <chrisjudge1967@...> wrote:



I’m definitely interested. New tech is always exciting. I wouldn’t pre-order, at least not yet, but if it can do what they claim I may add it to my tech tool kit.

 

Chris Judge

JAWS Certified, 2021

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nimer Jaber
Sent: May 6, 2021 11:37 AM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

 

Hello Dave,

 

This device is mounted to the chest for precisely the reason you mention, the issue that people with glasses or with arm bands and such end up moving about, thus making detecting obstacles more difficult. The chest tends to be relatively proportional with the direction the body is moving in.

 

They also state that Strap will detect cracks in the sidewalk, and assist users in travelling in a straight line. Is it trailing? Sort of, but no. Guide dog users don't trail either, as you know, and use different clues while traveling to get to where they wish to go.

 

I do have reservations, I don't think that this device, in its first iteration, will be a great cane replacement, but I do think the developers are worth supporting, and I do hope lots of people buy it to provide the devs feedback, and to help this kind of a product move forward. One concern I have is regarding detection of, for instance, doorways where the door is closed, but this can be a challenge, to different degrees and in different ways, with both a cane and a dog. The cane requires trailing which may be a bit difficult if there is, for instance, lots of outdoor displays or furniture, not to mention a bit noisy, and the dog may or may not want to indicate a particular doorway, and may confuse windows with doors.

 

Each mobility device has its pros and cons, but I do think that a product like this is worth taking notice of, and at least trying and providing meaningful feedback for.

 

On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 7:23 AM Dave <dlh007@...> wrote:

Devices like this have been made before.  I recall one such device that
was built into a pair of glasses.  Think they were called Sonar
Glasses.  The user needed to move their Head side to side back and forth
as well as up and down, to have the Beam cover the front, as the person
was walking.


Get to a set of Stairs, and the device would Beep a series of notes like
going up or down a scale.

Now, as far as I am concerned, if someone wants to purchase this type of
devise, go ahead.  If you think it will help you, by all means, go for it.


I can think of one aspect of using a Cane that might be  a problem using
this Strap Device.


I would be curious to try something like this, but at first glance, I
can't see how it could do as good of job as my Cane. But, again, don't
let my thoughts frighten you away.

How would a person Trail, as they are walking along?


Let's say I have one of those situations where I am walking on a walking
area made of pavement, which is blended into the street. On the left,
there is a White line that helps Sighted folks from walking out into the
street.  And on the right is a Seam, or very narrow Crack where the
pavement meets the Cement of a Store Front parking area.


With a Cane I can feel the Texture differences between the pavement and
the Cement, or I might be able to detect the Seam or Crack.  Not sure
how those Sonar device would help in this situation.


And like with the Sonar Glasses of years past, does the operator need to
continuously twist their body from side to side to have the sonar beams
cover what's on the left and right?  That could be an interesting Boogie
Woogie move for someone to do while they are walking.


Personally, I have used a Cane for years, and I did have a guide Dog
for  several years.  I found the Dog was in general, better than using a
Cane, especially in deep Snow and packed Ice conditions.


But, the up keep and care of the Dog, and the reactions to the Dog
others would exhibit were down sides for me.  And when my Dog was
retired, I decided to return to using a Cane.


I have good cane skills so going back was not an issue, unless it Snowed
four or five inches over night, and I now had to wait for others to walk
on the walk ways to make a path I could follow with a Cane.


However, if anyone has this device, or had something like it in the
past, I would be curious to hear of your experiences with it.



Grumpy Dave








 

--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.


Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.

 

Thank you, and have a great day!


Virus-free. www.avg.com



--
Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.

Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.

Thank you, and have a great day!


Re: Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

Pamela Dominguez
 

The only kind of guide dog I would ever have would be a robotic one. Pam.

-----Original Message-----
From: Carolyn Arnold
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 5:09 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

Probably there would be a little less maintenance with robotic guide dog.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Pamela Dominguez
Sent: Thursday, May 6, 2021 2:57 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

I guess that would be good for all the people who have smart phones. But it still wouldn’t be good for the rest of us. Pam.

From: Victor <mailto:victorelawrence@gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 11:34 AM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io <mailto:main@techtalk.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

If I were wealthy, I might purchase this device just to play with it and provide feedback to the developers. In the meantime, why can’t someone just develop existing smart phone apps to do the same thing? Why can’t we just place our smart phones in a wearable lanyard with the phone's camera facing away from our bodies to accomplish the same things? Supersense and other similar apps could accomplish the same things if these apps are developed a little more. If you want this device, go out and purchase it. As for me, I’m not going to run out and purchase this device just because it’s the latest thing that technology developers think is going to be great. They are probably wrong.

I think there was a recently published article about robotic seeing eye dogs. Honestly, I think such a device might be more useful than this device. Again, I have never wanted a seeing eye dog. However, a robotic seeing Eye dog might be useful.

Just my thoughts,

Victor



On May 6, 2021, at 7:43 AM, chris judge <chrisjudge1967@gmail.com> wrote:





I’m definitely interested. New tech is always exciting. I wouldn’t pre-order, at least not yet, but if it can do what they claim I may add it to my tech tool kit.



Chris Judge

<https://www.freedomscientific.com/Training/Certification>



From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nimer Jaber
Sent: May 6, 2021 11:37 AM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device



Hello Dave,



This device is mounted to the chest for precisely the reason you mention, the issue that people with glasses or with arm bands and such end up moving about, thus making detecting obstacles more difficult. The chest tends to be relatively proportional with the direction the body is moving in.



They also state that Strap will detect cracks in the sidewalk, and assist users in travelling in a straight line. Is it trailing? Sort of, but no. Guide dog users don't trail either, as you know, and use different clues while traveling to get to where they wish to go.



I do have reservations, I don't think that this device, in its first iteration, will be a great cane replacement, but I do think the developers are worth supporting, and I do hope lots of people buy it to provide the devs feedback, and to help this kind of a product move forward. One concern I have is regarding detection of, for instance, doorways where the door is closed, but this can be a challenge, to different degrees and in different ways, with both a cane and a dog. The cane requires trailing which may be a bit difficult if there is, for instance, lots of outdoor displays or furniture, not to mention a bit noisy, and the dog may or may not want to indicate a particular doorway, and may confuse windows with doors.



Each mobility device has its pros and cons, but I do think that a product like this is worth taking notice of, and at least trying and providing meaningful feedback for.



On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 7:23 AM Dave <dlh007@centurylink.net <mailto:dlh007@centurylink.net> > wrote:

Devices like this have been made before. I recall one such device that
was built into a pair of glasses. Think they were called Sonar
Glasses. The user needed to move their Head side to side back and forth
as well as up and down, to have the Beam cover the front, as the person
was walking.


Get to a set of Stairs, and the device would Beep a series of notes like
going up or down a scale.

Now, as far as I am concerned, if someone wants to purchase this type of
devise, go ahead. If you think it will help you, by all means, go for it.


I can think of one aspect of using a Cane that might be a problem using
this Strap Device.


I would be curious to try something like this, but at first glance, I
can't see how it could do as good of job as my Cane. But, again, don't
let my thoughts frighten you away.

How would a person Trail, as they are walking along?


Let's say I have one of those situations where I am walking on a walking
area made of pavement, which is blended into the street. On the left,
there is a White line that helps Sighted folks from walking out into the
street. And on the right is a Seam, or very narrow Crack where the
pavement meets the Cement of a Store Front parking area.


With a Cane I can feel the Texture differences between the pavement and
the Cement, or I might be able to detect the Seam or Crack. Not sure
how those Sonar device would help in this situation.


And like with the Sonar Glasses of years past, does the operator need to
continuously twist their body from side to side to have the sonar beams
cover what's on the left and right? That could be an interesting Boogie
Woogie move for someone to do while they are walking.


Personally, I have used a Cane for years, and I did have a guide Dog
for several years. I found the Dog was in general, better than using a
Cane, especially in deep Snow and packed Ice conditions.


But, the up keep and care of the Dog, and the reactions to the Dog
others would exhibit were down sides for me. And when my Dog was
retired, I decided to return to using a Cane.


I have good cane skills so going back was not an issue, unless it Snowed
four or five inches over night, and I now had to wait for others to walk
on the walk ways to make a path I could follow with a Cane.


However, if anyone has this device, or had something like it in the
past, I would be curious to hear of your experiences with it.



Grumpy Dave














--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
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please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
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Re: Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

Carolyn Arnold
 

Probably there would be a little less maintenance with robotic guide dog.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Pamela Dominguez
Sent: Thursday, May 6, 2021 2:57 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

I guess that would be good for all the people who have smart phones. But it still wouldn’t be good for the rest of us. Pam.

From: Victor <mailto:victorelawrence@gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 11:34 AM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io <mailto:main@techtalk.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

If I were wealthy, I might purchase this device just to play with it and provide feedback to the developers. In the meantime, why can’t someone just develop existing smart phone apps to do the same thing? Why can’t we just place our smart phones in a wearable lanyard with the phone's camera facing away from our bodies to accomplish the same things? Supersense and other similar apps could accomplish the same things if these apps are developed a little more. If you want this device, go out and purchase it. As for me, I’m not going to run out and purchase this device just because it’s the latest thing that technology developers think is going to be great. They are probably wrong.

I think there was a recently published article about robotic seeing eye dogs. Honestly, I think such a device might be more useful than this device. Again, I have never wanted a seeing eye dog. However, a robotic seeing Eye dog might be useful.

Just my thoughts,

Victor



On May 6, 2021, at 7:43 AM, chris judge <chrisjudge1967@gmail.com> wrote:





I’m definitely interested. New tech is always exciting. I wouldn’t pre-order, at least not yet, but if it can do what they claim I may add it to my tech tool kit.



Chris Judge

<https://www.freedomscientific.com/Training/Certification>



From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nimer Jaber
Sent: May 6, 2021 11:37 AM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device



Hello Dave,



This device is mounted to the chest for precisely the reason you mention, the issue that people with glasses or with arm bands and such end up moving about, thus making detecting obstacles more difficult. The chest tends to be relatively proportional with the direction the body is moving in.



They also state that Strap will detect cracks in the sidewalk, and assist users in travelling in a straight line. Is it trailing? Sort of, but no. Guide dog users don't trail either, as you know, and use different clues while traveling to get to where they wish to go.



I do have reservations, I don't think that this device, in its first iteration, will be a great cane replacement, but I do think the developers are worth supporting, and I do hope lots of people buy it to provide the devs feedback, and to help this kind of a product move forward. One concern I have is regarding detection of, for instance, doorways where the door is closed, but this can be a challenge, to different degrees and in different ways, with both a cane and a dog. The cane requires trailing which may be a bit difficult if there is, for instance, lots of outdoor displays or furniture, not to mention a bit noisy, and the dog may or may not want to indicate a particular doorway, and may confuse windows with doors.



Each mobility device has its pros and cons, but I do think that a product like this is worth taking notice of, and at least trying and providing meaningful feedback for.



On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 7:23 AM Dave <dlh007@centurylink.net <mailto:dlh007@centurylink.net> > wrote:

Devices like this have been made before. I recall one such device that
was built into a pair of glasses. Think they were called Sonar
Glasses. The user needed to move their Head side to side back and forth
as well as up and down, to have the Beam cover the front, as the person
was walking.


Get to a set of Stairs, and the device would Beep a series of notes like
going up or down a scale.

Now, as far as I am concerned, if someone wants to purchase this type of
devise, go ahead. If you think it will help you, by all means, go for it.


I can think of one aspect of using a Cane that might be a problem using
this Strap Device.


I would be curious to try something like this, but at first glance, I
can't see how it could do as good of job as my Cane. But, again, don't
let my thoughts frighten you away.

How would a person Trail, as they are walking along?


Let's say I have one of those situations where I am walking on a walking
area made of pavement, which is blended into the street. On the left,
there is a White line that helps Sighted folks from walking out into the
street. And on the right is a Seam, or very narrow Crack where the
pavement meets the Cement of a Store Front parking area.


With a Cane I can feel the Texture differences between the pavement and
the Cement, or I might be able to detect the Seam or Crack. Not sure
how those Sonar device would help in this situation.


And like with the Sonar Glasses of years past, does the operator need to
continuously twist their body from side to side to have the sonar beams
cover what's on the left and right? That could be an interesting Boogie
Woogie move for someone to do while they are walking.


Personally, I have used a Cane for years, and I did have a guide Dog
for several years. I found the Dog was in general, better than using a
Cane, especially in deep Snow and packed Ice conditions.


But, the up keep and care of the Dog, and the reactions to the Dog
others would exhibit were down sides for me. And when my Dog was
retired, I decided to return to using a Cane.


I have good cane skills so going back was not an issue, unless it Snowed
four or five inches over night, and I now had to wait for others to walk
on the walk ways to make a path I could follow with a Cane.


However, if anyone has this device, or had something like it in the
past, I would be curious to hear of your experiences with it.



Grumpy Dave














--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.


Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org <http://www.nvda-project.org>

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.



Thank you, and have a great day!




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Re: Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

Carolyn Arnold
 

Me too, Pam, same height, have confronted more than one tree branch.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Pamela Dominguez
Sent: Thursday, May 6, 2021 2:54 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

I never knew short people didn’t have to worry about overhanging stuff like tree branches. I am five foot two and I have run into plenty of overhanging stuff like that. Pam.

From: Gerald Levy via groups.io <mailto:bwaylimited=verizon.net@groups.io>
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 11:31 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount




So what you are saying is that this device would be most helpful for tall people and less helpful for those of us who are short and don't have to worry about overhanging objects, like tree branches, is that right?




Gerald








On 5/6/2021 10:46 AM, Nimer Jaber wrote:


Hello Dave,

This is one thing that Strap will assist with, is obstacles at head height. I don't particularly enjoy branches and such either.

On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 7:42 AM Dave <dlh007@centurylink.net <mailto:dlh007@centurylink.net> > wrote:


I am a Tall man, and I find that most Tree Branches that are over Walk ways are often cut to a height of about 6 ft. Bushes and tree limbs are something I meet more than I would like. On regular routes I walk, I will go out very early in the morning and Clip off those low hanging limbs when no one is looking.




Can't do this every where, but I at least cleared those areas where I walk regularly.




Grumpy Dave

On 5/6/2021 1:06 AM, Gene wrote:


A competent cane user knows how to swing a cane. That is one of the first things he/she is taught and a good instructor emphasizes correct technique. It becomes pretty much automatic, varied at times if necessary.

There have been devices for decades that alert blind people to obstacles above the level a cane covers. I haven’t looked into them so I don’t know if this device does any better. While I would like such coverage, I have had so little problem with such higher obstacles that I haven’t pursued the option. But I have no objedction to such a device. I objectt to trying to replace the cane and to trying to make you not look blind. Also, I didn’t mention that automobile drivers may be more careful if they see a cane or a dog. I would feel safer crossing a street identified as a blind person.

Also, I might be safer. Mhy brother tells the story about one evening when my brothers’ family and I were out to dinner. Some gang members looked as though they might come over to rob us. When they saw my cane, the head of the group signaled not to do so. So I may be safer from crime if people know I’m blind.

Gene
-----Original Message-----
From: Marco Curralejo <mailto:marco.curr@gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 2:55 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount


I’m sorry, but I completely disagree.



A cane will only cover you from your belly button down and you’d better hope that you are swinging the right way, otherwise it doesn’t even do that.



If we have no innovation, this means that we are happy to just continue as we have done with an aid which has been around for over 100 years.



Imagine if we took the same approach with all other innovations in society, no phones, no new treatments, no advancements in any technology, no cars, no eftpos or other similar machines. For the sake of your argument, let’s remove anything that has been innovative since the cane has been a part of our lives and go back to the way it all was before that, because having some forward thinking and innovation doesn’t matter to you.



As I said before, do I think that this will replace the cane? No. What I’m saying is that we need to move forward from what we currently have and not just thumb our noses at a company that is trying to move things forward in a different way.



Finally, I go through at least 3 or 4 canes per year, so $250 is quite reasonable for my opinion. Should those who pay over $5000 for a braille display or other products not do so because of cost? Your argument on cost is ridiculous, in my opinion. Perhaps your one of these individuals that goes through a cane every five years. Who knows.



Marco



From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io> mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Thursday, May 6, 2021 5:46 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount



And I just thought of another reason that this device is a bad idea. It is safer to be seen and known to be a blind person. Perhaps you will get assistance more easily when you want it such as when crossing a street with turning arrows and a lot of high speed traffic. [Perhaps you will have an easier time getting directions. When I walk into a store, if service people see the cane, they will offer help. How will they know I am blind as easily and as quickly if it isn’t made clear by a cane or a dog? If you don’t have a cane, people won’t know you are blind. This strikes me as an attempt to hide a person’s blindness. I don’t want to hide it. I am what I am and it shouldn’t be hidden.



Gene

-----Original Message-----

From: Gene <mailto:gsasner@gmail.com>

Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 2:39 AM

To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount



The car and horse analogy doesn’t apply. The advantages are obvious of a car. What advantage does the cane replacement company offer? Only one, that you can travel hands free. I don’t consider that worht spending 250 dollars for.



You yourself say that a dog gives you less information about your environment. People may be satisfied with that and that’s their choice but I really doubt that you are going to find many competent cane users who will substitute a 250 dollar device for a thirty-five dollar device when the 35 dollar device gives them more information. and people who use a dog may have reasons they are willing to accept less information. There are reasons people prefer dogs. But this is not a discussion about replacing dogs with this device. The device is offered as a replacement for the cane. I doubt many competent cane users will pay 250 dollars for a device that probably gives them less information.



I have no trouble carrying what I want to carry with one hand using a cane. I use larger bags. Others may prefer a back pack.



As far as things like the cane breaking or a tip falling off, I’ve been traveling with canes for about fifty years and such things have almost never happened. And you have no basis to assume that this device will be as reliable. What if you forget to charge it. Is the battery user replaceable? If not, how much will it cost to replace it?



And any prudent blind person who doesn’t use a dog should be a skilled cane user anyway so that in case of trouble with the device, he/she can switch to a low tech device that works very well while the problem is corrected. I have an emergency cane. Having two canes costs me perhaps sixty dollars. People aren’t going to have two of these devices when they cost 250 dollars.



As I said, I don’t object to a device that informs me about obstacles above the lefvel of the cane. I do object to the attitude that the cane should be replaced and likely by something inferior.



Gene

-----Original Message-----

From: Nimer Jaber <mailto:nimerjaber1@gmail.com>

Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 2:16 AM

To: main@techtalk.groups.io <mailto:main@techtalk.groups.io>

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount



This post is my opinion, and is not affiliated with Strap or any other entity. All opinions in this message are my own.



Gene,



People said the same thing that you're saying about horses, too. And yet, we are now driving cars.



Guide dogs already take away much of what the cane gives you, and dog users are quite content being dog users. With a dog, blind people go around obstacles, they don't interact with every obstacle in their path.



Does it count when a blind person disparages the cane and says that we need more innovation in the space to get rid of the bloody thing? Because I am one of those blind people.



Does it count that I want to be able to travel unencumbered with both hands free?



Does it count if I want to not worry about whether someone trips over my cane and breaks it? Or if the tip flies off the cane?



Does it matter if I don't want to worry about what happens to my upper body because that trusty cane doesn't protect it while I'm walking? Because believe me, running into scaffolding bloody hurts, and yes, I've done it.



Does it matter if I want to be able to actually walk in a straight line? Because, short of tapping against a wall or grass line, there isn't a way to do it with a cane.



Does it matter if I wish to traverse through a crowded downtown area, or any crowded environment without running into many things?



Does it matter if I want to be inconspicuous, and not be asked whether I, a poor blind man, require assistance to wipe my ass? Because that is essentially what happens to every single blind person I know. I am not approached about my work. I am not approached about my appearance. I am not approached about my shoes. I am not approached about anything except my blindness and someone wanting to help me because they think I am making a mistake trying to cross a street.



So, sorry, but we definitely need a cane replacement, in my view, and any blind person disagreeing is, frankly, a complete and utter fool. And, I would ask blind people to support the effort instead of shitting on it, because developers should be encouraged to innovate, not be discouraged by stupid posts like the one I've just read.



Does that mean that Strap will, indeed, replace the cane? I don't know, probably not. But it's a much better attempt than we've seen so far, with others trying to reinvent the cane by making it heavier and adding sensors to it.



So, I would say, support the effort. Stand by and watch, if you wish. But don't get in the way of what is possibly the most progress we've seen in a long time. We have cars that zoom on the roads autonomously. We have planes that can take off and land themselves. We have trains that can do the same, with minimal to no human interaction. We have probes going into deep space sending back pictures of Mars. And yet, the best the blind people can do, is fight to use their canes, and say they're proud of their canes.



I say again, if you don't or can't help, and you don't support the effort, with the nicest and most respectful intent possible, get the hell out of the way, sit down and shut up, and don't stop innovation and progress.



And with that, I will no longer engage in this thread, because I can see that more stupidity will be posted, and more people will come out proud to be carrying a stick.



On Wed, May 5, 2021 at 11:57 PM Gene <gsasner@gmail.com <mailto:gsasner@gmail.com> > wrote:

Isn’t it interesting how the cane is not respected and disparaged because blind people use it? I don’t see people trying to eliminate cars because unassisted movement is a right and is superior.



I’d like to see how expensive this device is. I’d like to see how long it runs on a charge. I’d like to see if it gives me information about my nearby environment such as where a doorway is to a building or where there is grass to my left and where that grass is interrupted by a driveway, which may be necessary for me to find with my cane to know where I turn to move toward a building and the counting of driveways and walkways may be necessary for me to know when I’m turning at the right place.



Device after device has been made and they have none of them been widely adopted. Maybe there is a reason.



Blindness is considered a tragedy and the ways blind people do things are often disparaged, guilt by association. Some ways blind people do things are neutral, some inferior, some superior. Will it be replaced at some point by something superior? Who knows. but its persistence and wide use should give those who chaff at the bit to eliminate it pause.



As G.K. Chesterton said:

“Don't ever take a fence down until you know the reason it was put up.”



Gene

-----Original Message-----

From: Marco Curralejo <mailto:marco.curr@gmail.com>

Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 1:39 AM

To: TechTalk@groups.io <mailto:TechTalk@groups.io>

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount



Hello everyone,



Three years in the making, STRAP is an innovative, wearable device that fits over the chest and is designed to detect any type of obstacle. STRAP’s vast array of sensors work by sending real-time information that detects obstacles at your head, chest, and below your waist - including bumps, holes, and steps, then notifying you with haptic language vibrations. Designed for all ages and shipped globally later this year.



At STRAP Technologies we believe autonomy and independence are human rights; not luxuries. Our goal is to be the first replacement of the white cane, giving the visually impaired a long overdue hands free experience.



Use code BlindTech strap.tech, for 50% off the current total price of a STRAP device. Preorder today at this discounted price of $250 and pay only $50 at this time to reserve your STRAP. Once STRAP is shipped to you, you will be billed the remaining $200. This offer is just available with this Blind Tech Guys Code.



The Blind Tech Guys <https://www.blindtechguys.com/> are pleased to offer you the above exclusive code and we are delighted to share this with our ever-growing community, so if you are keen to try this product, we encourage you to pre-order it and keep an eye out for a demo of the product to hit your ears sometime soon.



Warm regards,



Marco Curralejo







--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.


Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org <http://www.nvda-project.org>

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.



Thank you, and have a great day!



--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.

Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org <http://www.nvda-project.org>

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.

Thank you, and have a great day!



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Re: Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

Victor
 

That's true.  But in the longrun, I think a smart phone will be  more  useful.  Especially  if  this  device  isn't  popular  and  they  stop  making  it.

Victor


On May 6, 2021, at 11:57 AM, Pamela Dominguez <pammygirl99@...> wrote:


I guess that would be good for all the people who have smart phones.  But it still wouldn’t be good for the rest of us.  Pam.
 
From: Victor
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 11:34 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device
 
If I were wealthy, I might purchase this device just to play with it and provide feedback to the developers. In the meantime, why can’t someone just develop existing smart phone apps to do the same thing? Why can’t we just place our smart phones in a wearable lanyard with the phone's camera facing away from our bodies to accomplish the same things? Supersense and other similar apps could accomplish the same things if these apps are developed a little more. If you want this device, go out and purchase it. As for me, I’m not going to run out and purchase this device just because it’s the latest thing that technology developers think is going to be great. They are probably wrong.
 
I think there was a recently published article about robotic seeing eye dogs. Honestly, I think such a device might be more useful than this device. Again, I have never wanted a seeing eye dog. However, a robotic seeing Eye dog might be useful.
 
Just my thoughts,
 
Victor
 

On May 6, 2021, at 7:43 AM, chris judge <chrisjudge1967@...> wrote:



I’m definitely interested. New tech is always exciting. I wouldn’t pre-order, at least not yet, but if it can do what they claim I may add it to my tech tool kit.

 

Chris Judge

JAWS Certified, 2021

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nimer Jaber
Sent: May 6, 2021 11:37 AM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

 

Hello Dave,

 

This device is mounted to the chest for precisely the reason you mention, the issue that people with glasses or with arm bands and such end up moving about, thus making detecting obstacles more difficult. The chest tends to be relatively proportional with the direction the body is moving in.

 

They also state that Strap will detect cracks in the sidewalk, and assist users in travelling in a straight line. Is it trailing? Sort of, but no. Guide dog users don't trail either, as you know, and use different clues while traveling to get to where they wish to go.

 

I do have reservations, I don't think that this device, in its first iteration, will be a great cane replacement, but I do think the developers are worth supporting, and I do hope lots of people buy it to provide the devs feedback, and to help this kind of a product move forward. One concern I have is regarding detection of, for instance, doorways where the door is closed, but this can be a challenge, to different degrees and in different ways, with both a cane and a dog. The cane requires trailing which may be a bit difficult if there is, for instance, lots of outdoor displays or furniture, not to mention a bit noisy, and the dog may or may not want to indicate a particular doorway, and may confuse windows with doors.

 

Each mobility device has its pros and cons, but I do think that a product like this is worth taking notice of, and at least trying and providing meaningful feedback for.

 

On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 7:23 AM Dave <dlh007@...> wrote:

Devices like this have been made before.  I recall one such device that
was built into a pair of glasses.  Think they were called Sonar
Glasses.  The user needed to move their Head side to side back and forth
as well as up and down, to have the Beam cover the front, as the person
was walking.


Get to a set of Stairs, and the device would Beep a series of notes like
going up or down a scale.

Now, as far as I am concerned, if someone wants to purchase this type of
devise, go ahead.  If you think it will help you, by all means, go for it.


I can think of one aspect of using a Cane that might be  a problem using
this Strap Device.


I would be curious to try something like this, but at first glance, I
can't see how it could do as good of job as my Cane. But, again, don't
let my thoughts frighten you away.

How would a person Trail, as they are walking along?


Let's say I have one of those situations where I am walking on a walking
area made of pavement, which is blended into the street. On the left,
there is a White line that helps Sighted folks from walking out into the
street.  And on the right is a Seam, or very narrow Crack where the
pavement meets the Cement of a Store Front parking area.


With a Cane I can feel the Texture differences between the pavement and
the Cement, or I might be able to detect the Seam or Crack.  Not sure
how those Sonar device would help in this situation.


And like with the Sonar Glasses of years past, does the operator need to
continuously twist their body from side to side to have the sonar beams
cover what's on the left and right?  That could be an interesting Boogie
Woogie move for someone to do while they are walking.


Personally, I have used a Cane for years, and I did have a guide Dog
for  several years.  I found the Dog was in general, better than using a
Cane, especially in deep Snow and packed Ice conditions.


But, the up keep and care of the Dog, and the reactions to the Dog
others would exhibit were down sides for me.  And when my Dog was
retired, I decided to return to using a Cane.


I have good cane skills so going back was not an issue, unless it Snowed
four or five inches over night, and I now had to wait for others to walk
on the walk ways to make a path I could follow with a Cane.


However, if anyone has this device, or had something like it in the
past, I would be curious to hear of your experiences with it.



Grumpy Dave








 

--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.


Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

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Re: Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

Dave
 

Great Comment Victor. 

I too use my Cane as a Tool to get around, and not as something that identifies me as someone blind. 

Some might, but to me, it is just a tool to use to get from Point A to Point B. 

Grumpy Dave

On 5/6/2021 11:03 AM, Victor wrote:
I've never thought of the cane as a symbol of my independence.  I've always used it because I need it.  It's like wearing shoes.

Victor


On May 6, 2021, at 9:54 AM, Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:


In that case, I would be far more willing to pay 200 dollars for a device that warnsmeof such things than 750 dollars for a device that does a lot of other things if a much cheaper device could be made that works well.  But how many good cane users do you think will be willing to spend 750 dollars for this device?  Those who aren’t good cane users may. 
 
If I had such a device, just as automobiles have spare tires, I wouldn’t go out without a folding cane with me for emergencies.  It just isn’t prudent.  And reasonable cane skills should not be discouraged to be developed, whether people use them or not.  You don’t stop walking when you get a car.  You shouldn’t put yourself in the position of not being able to function if the device stops unexpectedly. 
 
And, as I said, one reason I had such a strong reaction to the device initially is how it is being advertised to us.  This is not the way to advertise such a device and have it be properly considered by a lot of people.  Hype or not, this sounds like the same kind of hype we’ve heard for years.  Less hype and more concrete information in releases made to the public and on the web site might help its reception considerably.  And I saw nothing on the web site where these various podcasts are linked to.  The web site has a FAQ but it is not nearly adequate because it doesn’t deal at all with the kinds of questions being asked here.  And they should have material on Youtube.
 
And even the way the discount is being offered is in a high pressure manner.  Intended or not, that will breed distrust as well.  This is a quote from the offer:
Hurry, this is a limited-time offer with time running out! Once 1,000 STRAP devices are sold, this special pricing will end.
Save $250 Today!
 
This offer is the first text on the home page after the navigation links.  It does not engender confidence in the company.  You don’t introduce a product on the web site of the company in this way. 
 
Those who want the product to succeed should contact the developers and discuss these things.  they are making very bad mistakes in their approach which will alienate a lot of people or make a lot of people far more skeptical than if the product were presented in the proper way.
 
Gene
-----Original Message-----
From: Dave
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 9:42 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount
 

I am a Tall man, and I find that most Tree Branches that are over Walk ways are often cut to a height of about 6 ft.  Bushes and tree limbs are something I meet more than I would like.  On regular routes I walk, I will go out very early in the morning and Clip off those low hanging limbs when no one is looking. 

 

Can't do this every where, but I at least cleared those areas where I walk regularly. 

 
 
Grumpy Dave
 
On 5/6/2021 1:06 AM, Gene wrote:
A competent cane user knows how to swing a cane.  That is one of the first things he/she is taught and a good instructor emphasizes correct technique.  It becomes pretty much automatic, varied at times if necessary. 
 
There have been devices for decades that alert blind people to obstacles above the level a cane covers.  I haven’t looked into them so I don’t know if this device does any better.  While I would like such coverage, I have had so little problem with such higher obstacles that I haven’t pursued the option.  But I have no objedction to such a device.  I objectt to trying to replace the cane and to trying to make you not look blind.  Also, I didn’t mention that automobile drivers may be more careful if they see a cane or a dog.  I would feel safer crossing a street identified as a blind person.
 
Also, I might be safer.  Mhy brother tells the story about one evening when my brothers’ family and I were out to dinner.  Some gang members looked as though they might come over to rob us.  When they saw my cane, the head of the group signaled not to do so.  So I may be safer from crime if people know I’m blind. 
 
Gene
-----Original Message-----
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 2:55 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount
 

I’m sorry, but I completely disagree.

 

A cane will only cover you from your belly button down and you’d better hope that you are swinging the right way, otherwise it doesn’t even do that.

 

If we have no innovation, this means that we are happy to just continue as we have done with an aid which has been around for over 100 years.

 

Imagine if we took the same approach with all other innovations in society, no phones, no new treatments, no advancements in any technology, no cars, no eftpos or other similar machines. For the sake of your argument, let’s remove anything that has been innovative since the cane has been a part of our lives and go back to the way it all was before that, because having some forward thinking and innovation doesn’t matter to you.

 

As I said before, do I think that this will replace the cane? No. What I’m saying is that we need to move forward from what we currently have and not just thumb our noses at a company that is trying to move things forward in a different way.

 

Finally, I go through at least 3 or 4 canes per year, so $250 is quite reasonable for my opinion. Should those who pay over $5000 for a braille display or other products not do so because of cost? Your argument on cost is ridiculous, in my opinion. Perhaps your one of these individuals that goes through a cane every five years. Who knows.

 

Marco

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Thursday, May 6, 2021 5:46 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

And I just thought of another reason that this device is a bad idea.  It is safer to be seen and known to be a blind person.  Perhaps you will get assistance more easily when you want it such as when crossing a street with turning arrows and a lot of high speed traffic.  [Perhaps you will have an easier time getting directions.  When I walk into a store, if service people see the cane, they will offer help.  How will they know I am blind as easily and as quickly if it isn’t made clear by a cane or a dog?  If you don’t have a cane, people won’t know you are blind.  This strikes me as an attempt to hide a person’s blindness.  I don’t want to hide it.  I am what I am and it shouldn’t be hidden.

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

From: Gene

Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 2:39 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

The car and horse analogy doesn’t apply.  The advantages are obvious of a car.  What advantage does the cane replacement company offer?  Only one, that you can travel hands free.  I don’t consider that worht spending 250 dollars for. 

 

You yourself say that a dog gives you less information about your environment.  People may be satisfied with that and that’s their choice but I really doubt that you are going to find many competent cane users who will substitute a 250 dollar device for a thirty-five dollar device when the 35 dollar device gives them more information.  and people who use a dog may have reasons they are willing to accept less information.  There are reasons people prefer dogs.  But this is not a discussion about replacing dogs with this device.  The device is offered as a replacement for the cane.  I doubt many competent cane users will pay 250 dollars for a device that probably gives them less information. 

 

I have no trouble carrying what I want to carry with one hand using a cane.  I use larger bags.  Others may prefer a back pack.  

 

As far as things like the cane breaking or a tip falling off, I’ve been traveling with canes for about fifty years and such things have almost never happened.  And you have no basis to assume that this device will be as reliable.  What if you forget to charge it.  Is the battery user replaceable?  If not, how much will it cost to replace it? 

 

And any prudent blind person who doesn’t use a dog should be a skilled cane user anyway so that in case of trouble with the device, he/she can switch to a low tech device that works very well while the problem is corrected.  I have an emergency cane.  Having two canes costs me perhaps sixty dollars.  People aren’t going to have two of these devices when they cost 250 dollars. 

 

As I said, I don’t object to a device that informs me about obstacles above the lefvel of the cane.  I do object to the attitude that the cane should be replaced and likely by something inferior. 

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

From: Nimer Jaber

Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 2:16 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

This post is my opinion, and is not affiliated with Strap or any other entity. All opinions in this message are my own.

 

Gene,

 

People said the same thing that you're saying about horses, too. And yet, we are now driving cars.

 

Guide dogs already take away much of what the cane gives you, and dog users are quite content being dog users. With a dog, blind people go around obstacles, they don't interact with every obstacle in their path.

 

Does it count when a blind person disparages the cane and says that we need more innovation in the space to get rid of the bloody thing? Because I am one of those blind people.

 

Does it count that I want to be able to travel unencumbered with both hands free?

 

Does it count if I want to not worry about whether someone trips over my cane and breaks it? Or if the tip flies off the cane?

 

Does it matter if I don't want to worry about what happens to my upper body because that trusty cane doesn't protect it while I'm walking? Because believe me, running into scaffolding bloody hurts, and yes, I've done it.

 

Does it matter if I want to be able to actually walk in a straight line? Because, short of tapping against a wall or grass line, there isn't a way to do it with a cane.

 

Does it matter if I wish to traverse through a crowded downtown area, or any crowded environment without running into many things?

 

Does it matter if I want to be inconspicuous, and not be asked whether I, a poor blind man, require assistance to wipe my ass? Because that is essentially what happens to every single blind person I know. I am not approached about my work. I am not approached about my appearance. I am not approached about my shoes. I am not approached about anything except my blindness and someone wanting to help me because they think I am making a mistake trying to cross a street.

 

So, sorry, but we definitely need a cane replacement, in my view, and any blind person disagreeing is, frankly, a complete and utter fool. And, I would ask blind people to support the effort instead of shitting on it, because developers should be encouraged to innovate, not be discouraged by stupid posts like the one I've just read.

 

Does that mean that Strap will, indeed, replace the cane? I don't know, probably not. But it's a much better attempt than we've seen so far, with others trying to reinvent the cane by making it heavier and adding sensors to it.

 

So, I would say, support the effort. Stand by and watch, if you wish. But don't get in the way of what is possibly the most progress we've seen in a long time. We have cars that zoom on the roads autonomously. We have planes that can take off and land themselves. We have trains that can do the same, with minimal to no human interaction. We have probes going into deep space sending back pictures of Mars. And yet, the best the blind people can do, is fight to use their canes, and say they're proud of their canes.

 

I say again, if you don't or can't help, and you don't support the effort, with the nicest and most respectful intent possible, get the hell out of the way, sit down and shut up, and don't stop innovation and progress.

 

And with that, I will no longer engage in this thread, because I can see that more stupidity will be posted, and more people will come out proud to be carrying a stick.

 

On Wed, May 5, 2021 at 11:57 PM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

Isn’t it interesting how the cane is not respected and disparaged because blind people use it?  I don’t see people trying to eliminate cars because unassisted movement is a right and is superior.

 

I’d like to see how expensive this device is.  I’d like to see how long it runs on a charge.  I’d like to see if it gives me information about my nearby environment such as where a doorway is to a building or where there is grass to my left and where that grass is interrupted by a driveway, which may be necessary for me to find with my cane to know where I turn to move toward a building and the counting of driveways and walkways may be necessary for me to know when I’m turning at the right place. 

 

Device after device has been made and they have none of them been widely adopted.  Maybe there is a reason.

 

Blindness is considered a tragedy and the ways blind people do things are often disparaged, guilt by association.  Some ways blind people do things are neutral, some inferior, some superior.  Will it be replaced at some point by something superior?  Who knows.  but its persistence and wide use should give those who chaff at the bit to eliminate it pause.

 

As G.K. Chesterton said:

“Don't ever take a fence down until you know the reason it was put up.”

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 1:39 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

Hello everyone,

 

Three years in the making, STRAP is an innovative, wearable device that fits over the chest and is designed to detect any type of obstacle. STRAP’s vast array of sensors work by sending real-time information that detects obstacles at your head, chest, and below your waist - including bumps, holes, and steps, then notifying you with haptic language vibrations. Designed for all ages and shipped globally later this year.

 

At STRAP Technologies we believe autonomy and independence are human rights; not luxuries. Our goal is to be the first replacement of the white cane, giving the visually impaired a long overdue hands free experience.

 

Use code BlindTech strap.tech, for 50% off the current total price of a STRAP device. Preorder today at this discounted price of $250 and pay only $50 at this time to reserve your STRAP. Once STRAP is shipped to you, you will be billed the remaining $200. This offer is just available with this Blind Tech Guys Code.

 

The Blind Tech Guys are pleased to offer you the above exclusive code and we are delighted to share this with our ever-growing community, so if you are keen to try this product, we encourage you to pre-order it and keep an eye out for a demo of the product to hit your ears sometime soon.

 

Warm regards,

 

Marco Curralejo

 

 

 

--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.


Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.

 

Thank you, and have a great day!


Re: Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

Pamela Dominguez
 

I guess that would be good for all the people who have smart phones.  But it still wouldn’t be good for the rest of us.  Pam.
 

From: Victor
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 11:34 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device
 
If I were wealthy, I might purchase this device just to play with it and provide feedback to the developers. In the meantime, why can’t someone just develop existing smart phone apps to do the same thing? Why can’t we just place our smart phones in a wearable lanyard with the phone's camera facing away from our bodies to accomplish the same things? Supersense and other similar apps could accomplish the same things if these apps are developed a little more. If you want this device, go out and purchase it. As for me, I’m not going to run out and purchase this device just because it’s the latest thing that technology developers think is going to be great. They are probably wrong.
 
I think there was a recently published article about robotic seeing eye dogs. Honestly, I think such a device might be more useful than this device. Again, I have never wanted a seeing eye dog. However, a robotic seeing Eye dog might be useful.
 
Just my thoughts,
 
Victor
 

On May 6, 2021, at 7:43 AM, chris judge <chrisjudge1967@...> wrote:



I’m definitely interested. New tech is always exciting. I wouldn’t pre-order, at least not yet, but if it can do what they claim I may add it to my tech tool kit.

 

Chris Judge

JAWS Certified, 2021

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nimer Jaber
Sent: May 6, 2021 11:37 AM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Device

 

Hello Dave,

 

This device is mounted to the chest for precisely the reason you mention, the issue that people with glasses or with arm bands and such end up moving about, thus making detecting obstacles more difficult. The chest tends to be relatively proportional with the direction the body is moving in.

 

They also state that Strap will detect cracks in the sidewalk, and assist users in travelling in a straight line. Is it trailing? Sort of, but no. Guide dog users don't trail either, as you know, and use different clues while traveling to get to where they wish to go.

 

I do have reservations, I don't think that this device, in its first iteration, will be a great cane replacement, but I do think the developers are worth supporting, and I do hope lots of people buy it to provide the devs feedback, and to help this kind of a product move forward. One concern I have is regarding detection of, for instance, doorways where the door is closed, but this can be a challenge, to different degrees and in different ways, with both a cane and a dog. The cane requires trailing which may be a bit difficult if there is, for instance, lots of outdoor displays or furniture, not to mention a bit noisy, and the dog may or may not want to indicate a particular doorway, and may confuse windows with doors.

 

Each mobility device has its pros and cons, but I do think that a product like this is worth taking notice of, and at least trying and providing meaningful feedback for.

 

On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 7:23 AM Dave <dlh007@...> wrote:

Devices like this have been made before.  I recall one such device that
was built into a pair of glasses.  Think they were called Sonar
Glasses.  The user needed to move their Head side to side back and forth
as well as up and down, to have the Beam cover the front, as the person
was walking.


Get to a set of Stairs, and the device would Beep a series of notes like
going up or down a scale.

Now, as far as I am concerned, if someone wants to purchase this type of
devise, go ahead.  If you think it will help you, by all means, go for it.


I can think of one aspect of using a Cane that might be  a problem using
this Strap Device.


I would be curious to try something like this, but at first glance, I
can't see how it could do as good of job as my Cane. But, again, don't
let my thoughts frighten you away.

How would a person Trail, as they are walking along?


Let's say I have one of those situations where I am walking on a walking
area made of pavement, which is blended into the street. On the left,
there is a White line that helps Sighted folks from walking out into the
street.  And on the right is a Seam, or very narrow Crack where the
pavement meets the Cement of a Store Front parking area.


With a Cane I can feel the Texture differences between the pavement and
the Cement, or I might be able to detect the Seam or Crack.  Not sure
how those Sonar device would help in this situation.


And like with the Sonar Glasses of years past, does the operator need to
continuously twist their body from side to side to have the sonar beams
cover what's on the left and right?  That could be an interesting Boogie
Woogie move for someone to do while they are walking.


Personally, I have used a Cane for years, and I did have a guide Dog
for  several years.  I found the Dog was in general, better than using a
Cane, especially in deep Snow and packed Ice conditions.


But, the up keep and care of the Dog, and the reactions to the Dog
others would exhibit were down sides for me.  And when my Dog was
retired, I decided to return to using a Cane.


I have good cane skills so going back was not an issue, unless it Snowed
four or five inches over night, and I now had to wait for others to walk
on the walk ways to make a path I could follow with a Cane.


However, if anyone has this device, or had something like it in the
past, I would be curious to hear of your experiences with it.



Grumpy Dave








 

--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.


Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.

 

Thank you, and have a great day!


Virus-free. www.avg.com


Re: Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

Mich Verrier
 

Yes I am 5 foot 6 and have ran into tree brantchis my self.  But about the product at discussion I will lissen to the podcast but agree with others on this thred that we have seen these kinds of prodotypes before and that seems to be all they are you hear about them and then flash they are gone and never move past prodo type stage. From Mich.

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Pamela Dominguez
Sent: May 6, 2021 2:54 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

I never knew short people didn’t have to worry about overhanging stuff like tree branches.  I am five foot two and I have run into plenty of overhanging stuff like that.  Pam.

 

Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 11:31 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

 

So what you are saying is that this device would be most helpful for tall people and less helpful for those of us who are short and don't have to worry about overhanging objects, like tree branches, is that right?

 

Gerald

 

 

On 5/6/2021 10:46 AM, Nimer Jaber wrote:

Hello Dave,

 

This is one thing that Strap will assist with, is obstacles at head height. I don't particularly enjoy branches and such either.

 

On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 7:42 AM Dave <dlh007@...> wrote:

I am a Tall man, and I find that most Tree Branches that are over Walk ways are often cut to a height of about 6 ft.  Bushes and tree limbs are something I meet more than I would like.  On regular routes I walk, I will go out very early in the morning and Clip off those low hanging limbs when no one is looking. 

 

Can't do this every where, but I at least cleared those areas where I walk regularly. 

 

 

Grumpy Dave

 

On 5/6/2021 1:06 AM, Gene wrote:

A competent cane user knows how to swing a cane.  That is one of the first things he/she is taught and a good instructor emphasizes correct technique.  It becomes pretty much automatic, varied at times if necessary. 

 

There have been devices for decades that alert blind people to obstacles above the level a cane covers.  I haven’t looked into them so I don’t know if this device does any better.  While I would like such coverage, I have had so little problem with such higher obstacles that I haven’t pursued the option.  But I have no objedction to such a device.  I objectt to trying to replace the cane and to trying to make you not look blind.  Also, I didn’t mention that automobile drivers may be more careful if they see a cane or a dog.  I would feel safer crossing a street identified as a blind person.

 

Also, I might be safer.  Mhy brother tells the story about one evening when my brothers’ family and I were out to dinner.  Some gang members looked as though they might come over to rob us.  When they saw my cane, the head of the group signaled not to do so.  So I may be safer from crime if people know I’m blind. 

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 2:55 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

I’m sorry, but I completely disagree.

 

A cane will only cover you from your belly button down and you’d better hope that you are swinging the right way, otherwise it doesn’t even do that.

 

If we have no innovation, this means that we are happy to just continue as we have done with an aid which has been around for over 100 years.

 

Imagine if we took the same approach with all other innovations in society, no phones, no new treatments, no advancements in any technology, no cars, no eftpos or other similar machines. For the sake of your argument, let’s remove anything that has been innovative since the cane has been a part of our lives and go back to the way it all was before that, because having some forward thinking and innovation doesn’t matter to you.

 

As I said before, do I think that this will replace the cane? No. What I’m saying is that we need to move forward from what we currently have and not just thumb our noses at a company that is trying to move things forward in a different way.

 

Finally, I go through at least 3 or 4 canes per year, so $250 is quite reasonable for my opinion. Should those who pay over $5000 for a braille display or other products not do so because of cost? Your argument on cost is ridiculous, in my opinion. Perhaps your one of these individuals that goes through a cane every five years. Who knows.

 

Marco

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Thursday, May 6, 2021 5:46 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

And I just thought of another reason that this device is a bad idea.  It is safer to be seen and known to be a blind person.  Perhaps you will get assistance more easily when you want it such as when crossing a street with turning arrows and a lot of high speed traffic.  [Perhaps you will have an easier time getting directions.  When I walk into a store, if service people see the cane, they will offer help.  How will they know I am blind as easily and as quickly if it isn’t made clear by a cane or a dog?  If you don’t have a cane, people won’t know you are blind.  This strikes me as an attempt to hide a person’s blindness.  I don’t want to hide it.  I am what I am and it shouldn’t be hidden.

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

From: Gene

Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 2:39 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

The car and horse analogy doesn’t apply.  The advantages are obvious of a car.  What advantage does the cane replacement company offer?  Only one, that you can travel hands free.  I don’t consider that worht spending 250 dollars for. 

 

You yourself say that a dog gives you less information about your environment.  People may be satisfied with that and that’s their choice but I really doubt that you are going to find many competent cane users who will substitute a 250 dollar device for a thirty-five dollar device when the 35 dollar device gives them more information.  and people who use a dog may have reasons they are willing to accept less information.  There are reasons people prefer dogs.  But this is not a discussion about replacing dogs with this device.  The device is offered as a replacement for the cane.  I doubt many competent cane users will pay 250 dollars for a device that probably gives them less information. 

 

I have no trouble carrying what I want to carry with one hand using a cane.  I use larger bags.  Others may prefer a back pack.  

 

As far as things like the cane breaking or a tip falling off, I’ve been traveling with canes for about fifty years and such things have almost never happened.  And you have no basis to assume that this device will be as reliable.  What if you forget to charge it.  Is the battery user replaceable?  If not, how much will it cost to replace it? 

 

And any prudent blind person who doesn’t use a dog should be a skilled cane user anyway so that in case of trouble with the device, he/she can switch to a low tech device that works very well while the problem is corrected.  I have an emergency cane.  Having two canes costs me perhaps sixty dollars.  People aren’t going to have two of these devices when they cost 250 dollars. 

 

As I said, I don’t object to a device that informs me about obstacles above the lefvel of the cane.  I do object to the attitude that the cane should be replaced and likely by something inferior. 

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 2:16 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

This post is my opinion, and is not affiliated with Strap or any other entity. All opinions in this message are my own.

 

Gene,

 

People said the same thing that you're saying about horses, too. And yet, we are now driving cars.

 

Guide dogs already take away much of what the cane gives you, and dog users are quite content being dog users. With a dog, blind people go around obstacles, they don't interact with every obstacle in their path.

 

Does it count when a blind person disparages the cane and says that we need more innovation in the space to get rid of the bloody thing? Because I am one of those blind people.

 

Does it count that I want to be able to travel unencumbered with both hands free?

 

Does it count if I want to not worry about whether someone trips over my cane and breaks it? Or if the tip flies off the cane?

 

Does it matter if I don't want to worry about what happens to my upper body because that trusty cane doesn't protect it while I'm walking? Because believe me, running into scaffolding bloody hurts, and yes, I've done it.

 

Does it matter if I want to be able to actually walk in a straight line? Because, short of tapping against a wall or grass line, there isn't a way to do it with a cane.

 

Does it matter if I wish to traverse through a crowded downtown area, or any crowded environment without running into many things?

 

Does it matter if I want to be inconspicuous, and not be asked whether I, a poor blind man, require assistance to wipe my ass? Because that is essentially what happens to every single blind person I know. I am not approached about my work. I am not approached about my appearance. I am not approached about my shoes. I am not approached about anything except my blindness and someone wanting to help me because they think I am making a mistake trying to cross a street.

 

So, sorry, but we definitely need a cane replacement, in my view, and any blind person disagreeing is, frankly, a complete and utter fool. And, I would ask blind people to support the effort instead of shitting on it, because developers should be encouraged to innovate, not be discouraged by stupid posts like the one I've just read.

 

Does that mean that Strap will, indeed, replace the cane? I don't know, probably not. But it's a much better attempt than we've seen so far, with others trying to reinvent the cane by making it heavier and adding sensors to it.

 

So, I would say, support the effort. Stand by and watch, if you wish. But don't get in the way of what is possibly the most progress we've seen in a long time. We have cars that zoom on the roads autonomously. We have planes that can take off and land themselves. We have trains that can do the same, with minimal to no human interaction. We have probes going into deep space sending back pictures of Mars. And yet, the best the blind people can do, is fight to use their canes, and say they're proud of their canes.

 

I say again, if you don't or can't help, and you don't support the effort, with the nicest and most respectful intent possible, get the hell out of the way, sit down and shut up, and don't stop innovation and progress.

 

And with that, I will no longer engage in this thread, because I can see that more stupidity will be posted, and more people will come out proud to be carrying a stick.

 

On Wed, May 5, 2021 at 11:57 PM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

Isn’t it interesting how the cane is not respected and disparaged because blind people use it?  I don’t see people trying to eliminate cars because unassisted movement is a right and is superior.

 

I’d like to see how expensive this device is.  I’d like to see how long it runs on a charge.  I’d like to see if it gives me information about my nearby environment such as where a doorway is to a building or where there is grass to my left and where that grass is interrupted by a driveway, which may be necessary for me to find with my cane to know where I turn to move toward a building and the counting of driveways and walkways may be necessary for me to know when I’m turning at the right place. 

 

Device after device has been made and they have none of them been widely adopted.  Maybe there is a reason.

 

Blindness is considered a tragedy and the ways blind people do things are often disparaged, guilt by association.  Some ways blind people do things are neutral, some inferior, some superior.  Will it be replaced at some point by something superior?  Who knows.  but its persistence and wide use should give those who chaff at the bit to eliminate it pause.

 

As G.K. Chesterton said:

“Don't ever take a fence down until you know the reason it was put up.”

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 1:39 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

Hello everyone,

 

Three years in the making, STRAP is an innovative, wearable device that fits over the chest and is designed to detect any type of obstacle. STRAP’s vast array of sensors work by sending real-time information that detects obstacles at your head, chest, and below your waist - including bumps, holes, and steps, then notifying you with haptic language vibrations. Designed for all ages and shipped globally later this year.

 

At STRAP Technologies we believe autonomy and independence are human rights; not luxuries. Our goal is to be the first replacement of the white cane, giving the visually impaired a long overdue hands free experience.

 

Use code BlindTech strap.tech, for 50% off the current total price of a STRAP device. Preorder today at this discounted price of $250 and pay only $50 at this time to reserve your STRAP. Once STRAP is shipped to you, you will be billed the remaining $200. This offer is just available with this Blind Tech Guys Code.

 

The Blind Tech Guys are pleased to offer you the above exclusive code and we are delighted to share this with our ever-growing community, so if you are keen to try this product, we encourage you to pre-order it and keep an eye out for a demo of the product to hit your ears sometime soon.

 

Warm regards,

 

Marco Curralejo

 

 

 

--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.


Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.

 

Thank you, and have a great day!

 

 

--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.


Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.

 

Thank you, and have a great day!

 

Virus-free. www.avg.com


Re: Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

Pamela Dominguez
 

I never knew short people didn’t have to worry about overhanging stuff like tree branches.  I am five foot two and I have run into plenty of overhanging stuff like that.  Pam.
 

Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 11:31 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount
 

 

So what you are saying is that this device would be most helpful for tall people and less helpful for those of us who are short and don't have to worry about overhanging objects, like tree branches, is that right?


Gerald



On 5/6/2021 10:46 AM, Nimer Jaber wrote:
Hello Dave,
 
This is one thing that Strap will assist with, is obstacles at head height. I don't particularly enjoy branches and such either.
 
On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 7:42 AM Dave <dlh007@...> wrote:

I am a Tall man, and I find that most Tree Branches that are over Walk ways are often cut to a height of about 6 ft.  Bushes and tree limbs are something I meet more than I would like.  On regular routes I walk, I will go out very early in the morning and Clip off those low hanging limbs when no one is looking. 

 

Can't do this every where, but I at least cleared those areas where I walk regularly. 

 
 
Grumpy Dave
 
On 5/6/2021 1:06 AM, Gene wrote:
A competent cane user knows how to swing a cane.  That is one of the first things he/she is taught and a good instructor emphasizes correct technique.  It becomes pretty much automatic, varied at times if necessary. 
 
There have been devices for decades that alert blind people to obstacles above the level a cane covers.  I haven’t looked into them so I don’t know if this device does any better.  While I would like such coverage, I have had so little problem with such higher obstacles that I haven’t pursued the option.  But I have no objedction to such a device.  I objectt to trying to replace the cane and to trying to make you not look blind.  Also, I didn’t mention that automobile drivers may be more careful if they see a cane or a dog.  I would feel safer crossing a street identified as a blind person.
 
Also, I might be safer.  Mhy brother tells the story about one evening when my brothers’ family and I were out to dinner.  Some gang members looked as though they might come over to rob us.  When they saw my cane, the head of the group signaled not to do so.  So I may be safer from crime if people know I’m blind. 
 
Gene
-----Original Message-----
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 2:55 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount
 

I’m sorry, but I completely disagree.

 

A cane will only cover you from your belly button down and you’d better hope that you are swinging the right way, otherwise it doesn’t even do that.

 

If we have no innovation, this means that we are happy to just continue as we have done with an aid which has been around for over 100 years.

 

Imagine if we took the same approach with all other innovations in society, no phones, no new treatments, no advancements in any technology, no cars, no eftpos or other similar machines. For the sake of your argument, let’s remove anything that has been innovative since the cane has been a part of our lives and go back to the way it all was before that, because having some forward thinking and innovation doesn’t matter to you.

 

As I said before, do I think that this will replace the cane? No. What I’m saying is that we need to move forward from what we currently have and not just thumb our noses at a company that is trying to move things forward in a different way.

 

Finally, I go through at least 3 or 4 canes per year, so $250 is quite reasonable for my opinion. Should those who pay over $5000 for a braille display or other products not do so because of cost? Your argument on cost is ridiculous, in my opinion. Perhaps your one of these individuals that goes through a cane every five years. Who knows.

 

Marco

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Thursday, May 6, 2021 5:46 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

And I just thought of another reason that this device is a bad idea.  It is safer to be seen and known to be a blind person.  Perhaps you will get assistance more easily when you want it such as when crossing a street with turning arrows and a lot of high speed traffic.  [Perhaps you will have an easier time getting directions.  When I walk into a store, if service people see the cane, they will offer help.  How will they know I am blind as easily and as quickly if it isn’t made clear by a cane or a dog?  If you don’t have a cane, people won’t know you are blind.  This strikes me as an attempt to hide a person’s blindness.  I don’t want to hide it.  I am what I am and it shouldn’t be hidden.

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

From: Gene

Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 2:39 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

The car and horse analogy doesn’t apply.  The advantages are obvious of a car.  What advantage does the cane replacement company offer?  Only one, that you can travel hands free.  I don’t consider that worht spending 250 dollars for. 

 

You yourself say that a dog gives you less information about your environment.  People may be satisfied with that and that’s their choice but I really doubt that you are going to find many competent cane users who will substitute a 250 dollar device for a thirty-five dollar device when the 35 dollar device gives them more information.  and people who use a dog may have reasons they are willing to accept less information.  There are reasons people prefer dogs.  But this is not a discussion about replacing dogs with this device.  The device is offered as a replacement for the cane.  I doubt many competent cane users will pay 250 dollars for a device that probably gives them less information. 

 

I have no trouble carrying what I want to carry with one hand using a cane.  I use larger bags.  Others may prefer a back pack.  

 

As far as things like the cane breaking or a tip falling off, I’ve been traveling with canes for about fifty years and such things have almost never happened.  And you have no basis to assume that this device will be as reliable.  What if you forget to charge it.  Is the battery user replaceable?  If not, how much will it cost to replace it? 

 

And any prudent blind person who doesn’t use a dog should be a skilled cane user anyway so that in case of trouble with the device, he/she can switch to a low tech device that works very well while the problem is corrected.  I have an emergency cane.  Having two canes costs me perhaps sixty dollars.  People aren’t going to have two of these devices when they cost 250 dollars. 

 

As I said, I don’t object to a device that informs me about obstacles above the lefvel of the cane.  I do object to the attitude that the cane should be replaced and likely by something inferior. 

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

From: Nimer Jaber

Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 2:16 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

This post is my opinion, and is not affiliated with Strap or any other entity. All opinions in this message are my own.

 

Gene,

 

People said the same thing that you're saying about horses, too. And yet, we are now driving cars.

 

Guide dogs already take away much of what the cane gives you, and dog users are quite content being dog users. With a dog, blind people go around obstacles, they don't interact with every obstacle in their path.

 

Does it count when a blind person disparages the cane and says that we need more innovation in the space to get rid of the bloody thing? Because I am one of those blind people.

 

Does it count that I want to be able to travel unencumbered with both hands free?

 

Does it count if I want to not worry about whether someone trips over my cane and breaks it? Or if the tip flies off the cane?

 

Does it matter if I don't want to worry about what happens to my upper body because that trusty cane doesn't protect it while I'm walking? Because believe me, running into scaffolding bloody hurts, and yes, I've done it.

 

Does it matter if I want to be able to actually walk in a straight line? Because, short of tapping against a wall or grass line, there isn't a way to do it with a cane.

 

Does it matter if I wish to traverse through a crowded downtown area, or any crowded environment without running into many things?

 

Does it matter if I want to be inconspicuous, and not be asked whether I, a poor blind man, require assistance to wipe my ass? Because that is essentially what happens to every single blind person I know. I am not approached about my work. I am not approached about my appearance. I am not approached about my shoes. I am not approached about anything except my blindness and someone wanting to help me because they think I am making a mistake trying to cross a street.

 

So, sorry, but we definitely need a cane replacement, in my view, and any blind person disagreeing is, frankly, a complete and utter fool. And, I would ask blind people to support the effort instead of shitting on it, because developers should be encouraged to innovate, not be discouraged by stupid posts like the one I've just read.

 

Does that mean that Strap will, indeed, replace the cane? I don't know, probably not. But it's a much better attempt than we've seen so far, with others trying to reinvent the cane by making it heavier and adding sensors to it.

 

So, I would say, support the effort. Stand by and watch, if you wish. But don't get in the way of what is possibly the most progress we've seen in a long time. We have cars that zoom on the roads autonomously. We have planes that can take off and land themselves. We have trains that can do the same, with minimal to no human interaction. We have probes going into deep space sending back pictures of Mars. And yet, the best the blind people can do, is fight to use their canes, and say they're proud of their canes.

 

I say again, if you don't or can't help, and you don't support the effort, with the nicest and most respectful intent possible, get the hell out of the way, sit down and shut up, and don't stop innovation and progress.

 

And with that, I will no longer engage in this thread, because I can see that more stupidity will be posted, and more people will come out proud to be carrying a stick.

 

On Wed, May 5, 2021 at 11:57 PM Gene <gsasner@...> wrote:

Isn’t it interesting how the cane is not respected and disparaged because blind people use it?  I don’t see people trying to eliminate cars because unassisted movement is a right and is superior.

 

I’d like to see how expensive this device is.  I’d like to see how long it runs on a charge.  I’d like to see if it gives me information about my nearby environment such as where a doorway is to a building or where there is grass to my left and where that grass is interrupted by a driveway, which may be necessary for me to find with my cane to know where I turn to move toward a building and the counting of driveways and walkways may be necessary for me to know when I’m turning at the right place. 

 

Device after device has been made and they have none of them been widely adopted.  Maybe there is a reason.

 

Blindness is considered a tragedy and the ways blind people do things are often disparaged, guilt by association.  Some ways blind people do things are neutral, some inferior, some superior.  Will it be replaced at some point by something superior?  Who knows.  but its persistence and wide use should give those who chaff at the bit to eliminate it pause.

 

As G.K. Chesterton said:

“Don't ever take a fence down until you know the reason it was put up.”

 

Gene

-----Original Message-----

Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2021 1:39 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

 

Hello everyone,

 

Three years in the making, STRAP is an innovative, wearable device that fits over the chest and is designed to detect any type of obstacle. STRAP’s vast array of sensors work by sending real-time information that detects obstacles at your head, chest, and below your waist - including bumps, holes, and steps, then notifying you with haptic language vibrations. Designed for all ages and shipped globally later this year.

 

At STRAP Technologies we believe autonomy and independence are human rights; not luxuries. Our goal is to be the first replacement of the white cane, giving the visually impaired a long overdue hands free experience.

 

Use code BlindTech strap.tech, for 50% off the current total price of a STRAP device. Preorder today at this discounted price of $250 and pay only $50 at this time to reserve your STRAP. Once STRAP is shipped to you, you will be billed the remaining $200. This offer is just available with this Blind Tech Guys Code.

 

The Blind Tech Guys are pleased to offer you the above exclusive code and we are delighted to share this with our ever-growing community, so if you are keen to try this product, we encourage you to pre-order it and keep an eye out for a demo of the product to hit your ears sometime soon.

 

Warm regards,

 

Marco Curralejo

 

 

 

--

Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.


Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.

 

Thank you, and have a great day!

 
 
--
Best,

Nimer Jaber

The message above is intended for the recipient to whom it was
addressed. If you believe that you are not the intended recipient,
please notify me via reply email and destroy all copies of this
correspondence. Action taken as a result of this email or its contents
by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) may result in civil or
criminal charges. I have checked this email and all corresponding
attachments for security threats.

Registered Linux User 529141.
http://counter.li.org/

To find out about a free, open-source, and versatile screen reader for Windows, visit nvaccess.org

You can follow @nimerjaber on Twitter for the latest technology news.

To contact me, you can reply to this email or you may call me at (970) (393-4481) and I will do my best to respond to you promptly.
 
Thank you, and have a great day!

Virus-free. www.avg.com


Re: Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

Rick Alfaro
 

Thanks Joe, a well thought out and balanced message. We may agree or not agree with their approach but we should applaud and encourage innovation IMHO. I certainly don't think it is some kind of scam. Personally, I don't think it will ever replace the cane but would certainly consider it another enhancement from what I've read so far and I wish them luck with it. I may even try it myself some day if it becomes a little more affordable but don't think it will replace my cane. Perhaps I'd change my opinion if I ever give it a try.





Warmest regards

Rick Alfaro

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <main@TechTalk.groups.io> On Behalf Of Joe Orozco
Sent: Thursday, May 6, 2021 7:44 AM
To: main@techtalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

Love the thought-provoking discussion! I'm not opposed to innovation.
Yet, having participated in several user testing groups where the hope was to improve navigation for the blind, I see years later that none of them endured beyond the prototype. I won't pretend to be intelligent enough to understand why that is, but there is something to be said for old methods like cane or dog that are fundamental for any future technology to be successful. A guide dog user cannot, in my opinion, be truly successful if they are not a strong cane user. I would assume an individual would not fully excel with innovative technology if they could not navigate successfully with a dog. So maybe the aim should not be to replace proven methods, but rather, enhance them. It would go a long way in earning the trust of the blind community and better help the developers understand what the actual pain points might be for the blind traveler. I do applaud the forward thinking. I see nothing wrong with pushing the envelope.

Joe


On 5/6/21, val and david paul <valanddavidp@gmail.com> wrote:
Well said Gene!

On 06/05/2021 08:46, Gene wrote:
And I just thought of another reason that this device is a bad idea.
It is safer to be seen and known to be a blind person. Perhaps you
will get assistance more easily when you want it such as when
crossing a street with turning arrows and a lot of high speed traffic.
[Perhaps you will have an easier time getting directions. When I
walk into a store, if service people see the cane, they will offer help.
How will they know I am blind as easily and as quickly if it isn’t
made clear by a cane or a dog? If you don’t have a cane, people
won’t know you are blind. This strikes me as an attempt to hide a
person’s blindness. I don’t want to hide it. I am what I am and it
shouldn’t be hidden.
Gene
-----Original Message-----
*From:* Gene <mailto:gsasner@gmail.com>
*Sent:* Thursday, May 06, 2021 2:39 AM
*To:* main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount The car and
horse analogy doesn’t apply. The advantages are obvious of a car.
What advantage does the cane replacement company offer?
Only one, that you can travel hands free. I don’t consider that
worht spending 250 dollars for.
You yourself say that a dog gives you less information about your
environment. People may be satisfied with that and that’s their
choice but I really doubt that you are going to find many competent
cane users who will substitute a 250 dollar device for a thirty-five
dollar device when the 35 dollar device gives them more information.
and people who use a dog may have reasons they are willing to accept
less information. There are reasons people prefer dogs. But this is
not a discussion about replacing dogs with this device. The device
is offered as a replacement for the cane. I doubt many competent
cane users will pay 250 dollars for a device that probably gives them
less information.
I have no trouble carrying what I want to carry with one hand using a
cane. I use larger bags. Others may prefer a back pack.
As far as things like the cane breaking or a tip falling off, I’ve
been traveling with canes for about fifty years and such things have
almost never happened. And you have no basis to assume that this
device will be as reliable. What if you forget to charge it. Is the
battery user replaceable? If not, how much will it cost to replace it?
And any prudent blind person who doesn’t use a dog should be a
skilled cane user anyway so that in case of trouble with the device,
he/she can switch to a low tech device that works very well while the
problem is corrected. I have an emergency cane. Having two canes
costs me perhaps sixty dollars. People aren’t going to have two of
these devices when they cost 250 dollars.
As I said, I don’t object to a device that informs me about obstacles
above the lefvel of the cane. I do object to the attitude that the
cane should be replaced and likely by something inferior.
Gene
-----Original Message-----
*From:* Nimer Jaber <mailto:nimerjaber1@gmail.com>
*Sent:* Thursday, May 06, 2021 2:16 AM
*To:* main@techtalk.groups.io <mailto:main@techtalk.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount This post is
my opinion, and is not affiliated with Strap or any other entity. All
opinions in this message are my own.
Gene,
People said the same thing that you're saying about horses, too. And
yet, we are now driving cars.
Guide dogs already take away much of what the cane gives you, and dog
users are quite content being dog users. With a dog, blind people go
around obstacles, they don't interact with every obstacle in their path.
Does it count when a blind person disparages the cane and says that
we need more innovation in the space to get rid of the bloody thing?
Because I am one of those blind people.
Does it count that I want to be able to travel unencumbered with both
hands free?
Does it count if I want to not worry about whether someone trips over
my cane and breaks it? Or if the tip flies off the cane?
Does it matter if I don't want to worry about what happens to my
upper body because that trusty cane doesn't protect it while I'm walking?
Because believe me, running into scaffolding bloody hurts, and yes,
I've done it.
Does it matter if I want to be able to actually walk in a straight
line? Because, short of tapping against a wall or grass line, there
isn't a way to do it with a cane.
Does it matter if I wish to traverse through a crowded downtown area,
or any crowded environment without running into many things?
Does it matter if I want to be inconspicuous, and not be asked
whether I, a poor blind man, require assistance to wipe my ass?
Because that is essentially what happens to every single blind person
I know. I am not approached about my work. I am not approached about my appearance.
I am not approached about my shoes. I am not approached about
anything except my blindness and someone wanting to help me because
they think I am making a mistake trying to cross a street.
So, sorry, but we definitely need a cane replacement, in my view, and
any blind person disagreeing is, frankly, a complete and utter fool.
And, I would ask blind people to support the effort instead of
shitting on it, because developers should be encouraged to innovate,
not be discouraged by stupid posts like the one I've just read.
Does that mean that Strap will, indeed, replace the cane? I don't
know, probably not. But it's a much better attempt than we've seen so
far, with others trying to reinvent the cane by making it heavier and
adding sensors to it.
So, I would say, support the effort. Stand by and watch, if you wish.
But don't get in the way of what is possibly the most progress we've
seen in a long time. We have cars that zoom on the roads autonomously.
We have planes that can take off and land themselves. We have trains
that can do the same, with minimal to no human interaction. We have
probes going into deep space sending back pictures of Mars. And yet,
the best the blind people can do, is fight to use their canes, and
say they're proud of their canes.
I say again, if you don't or can't help, and you don't support the
effort, with the nicest and most respectful intent possible, get the
hell out of the way, sit down and shut up, and don't stop innovation
and progress.
And with that, I will no longer engage in this thread, because I can
see that more stupidity will be posted, and more people will come out
proud to be carrying a stick.
On Wed, May 5, 2021 at 11:57 PM Gene <gsasner@gmail.com
<mailto:gsasner@gmail.com>> wrote:

Isn’t it interesting how the cane is not respected and disparaged
because blind people use it? I don’t see people trying to
eliminate cars because unassisted movement is a right and is
superior.
I’d like to see how expensive this device is. I’d like to see how
long it runs on a charge. I’d like to see if it gives me
information about my nearby environment such as where a doorway is
to a building or where there is grass to my left and where that
grass is interrupted by a driveway, which may be necessary for me
to find with my cane to know where I turn to move toward a
building and the counting of driveways and walkways may be
necessary for me to know when I’m turning at the right place.
Device after device has been made and they have none of them been
widely adopted. Maybe there is a reason.
Blindness is considered a tragedy and the ways blind people do
things are often disparaged, guilt by association. Some ways
blind people do things are neutral, some inferior, some superior.
Will it be replaced at some point by something superior? Who
knows. but its persistence and wide use should give those who
chaff at the bit to eliminate it pause.
As G.K. Chesterton said:
“Don't ever take a fence down until you know the reason it was put
up.”
Gene
-----Original Message-----
*From:* Marco Curralejo <mailto:marco.curr@gmail.com>
*Sent:* Thursday, May 06, 2021 1:39 AM
*To:* TechTalk@groups.io <mailto:TechTalk@groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [TechTalk] Blind Tech Guys Strap Discount

Hello everyone,

Three years in the making, STRAP is an innovative, wearable device
that fits over the chest and is designed to detect any type of
obstacle. STRAP’s vast array of sensors work by sending real-time
information that detects obstacles at your head, chest, and below
your waist - including bumps, holes, and steps, then notifying you
with haptic language vibrations. Designed for all ages and shipped
globally later this year.

At STRAP Technologies we believe autonomy and independence are
human rights; not luxuries. Our goal is to be the first
replacement of the white cane, giving the visually impaired a long
overdue hands free experience.

Use code BlindTech strap.tech, for 50% off the current total price
of a STRAP device. Preorder today at this discounted price of $250
and pay only $50 at this time to reserve your STRAP. Once STRAP is
shipped to you, you will be billed the remaining $200. This offer
is just available with this Blind Tech Guys Code.

The Blind Tech Guys <https://www.blindtechguys.com/>are pleased to
offer you the above exclusive code and we are delighted to share
this with our ever-growing community, so if you are keen to try
this product, we encourage you to pre-order it and keep an eye out
for a demo of the product to hit your ears sometime soon.

Warm regards,

Marco Curralejo

--
Best,

Nimer Jaber

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