talking tv sets, a different idea


Joe Giovanelli
 

Hello,

It is certainly true that voice guidance in TV sets is helpful, but there is another option.

There is a radio especially designed to guide blind people in locating and listening to TV on-the-air programs. This DTV radio is made by Oehm Electronics and costs $185. It is menu or command driven. One neat feature is the ability to tell the user how strong a signal is. This is useful when orienting the antenna. If the received signal falls below a critical level, the user will know that the reception of that station will be marginal at best.

This radio does not read what's on the air program information.

It seems to me to be a viable alternative to more expensive TV solutions.

Joe Giovanelli, W2PVY


Gene
 

If you want to receive over air signals, this is a good option.  I haven't followed accessibility of televisions for years but this radio allows the user to scan completely independently when getting the local list of stations and their frequencies into the radio. I also find the strength indicator to be valuable.  there are certain difficult stations to receive where this feature can greatly improve reception.  And even on easier stations to receive, it may help since different stations are received better with different antenna orientations. 
 
Gene 

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 8:21 AM
Subject: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

Hello,

It is certainly true that voice guidance in TV sets is helpful, but there is another option.

There is a radio especially designed to guide blind people in locating and listening to TV on-the-air programs. This DTV radio is made by Oehm Electronics and costs $185. It is menu or command driven. One neat feature is the ability to tell the user how strong a signal is. This is useful when orienting the antenna. If the received signal falls below a critical level, the user will know that the reception of that station will be marginal at best.

This radio does not read what's on the air program information.

It seems to me to be a viable alternative to more expensive TV solutions.

Joe Giovanelli, W2PVY



Gerald Levy
 

This "accessible"TV radio seems grossly overpriced for what it offers. For $185, you should at least expect some level of speech output. Basically, all this box does is scan over-the -air stations into memory and provides audible feedback to assist with antenna orientation , and that's about it. You still cannot identify which channel you are tuned to, and it offers no advantage if you use a cable box. I realize that this is a custom-made product, but it really isn't that much more accessible than a small-screen, basic mass-market digital TV that sells for $80 or less. And it is totally useless for other sighted family members in your household because it lacks a screen. Too bad OEHM Electronics does not offer a small, Walkman-style TV radio, which would certainly have more widespread consumer appeal.

Gerald

-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Giovanelli
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:21 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

Hello,

It is certainly true that voice guidance in TV sets is helpful, but there is another option.

There is a radio especially designed to guide blind people in locating and listening to TV on-the-air programs. This DTV radio is made by Oehm Electronics and costs $185. It is menu or command driven. One neat feature is the ability to tell the user how strong a signal is. This is useful when orienting the antenna. If the received signal falls below a critical level, the user will know that the reception of that station will be marginal at best.

This radio does not read what's on the air program information.

It seems to me to be a viable alternative to more expensive TV solutions.

Joe Giovanelli, W2PVY


Gene
 

You don't need speech output.  the manual clearly explains how to perform functions without speech.  And you are overgeneralizing.  Not every higher priced item is a ripoff and circumstances should be considered.  This is not some large company with a large production.  it is a one man operation, building radios in small numbers when ordered or only enough in advance to fill a small number of anticipated orders in advance.  The radios are worth every penny.  You can't necessarily just add speech to something if it is not built in already at little or no cost.  The chip used to operate the radio has no speech ability and it is not necessary. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:59 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea


This "accessible"TV radio seems grossly overpriced for what it offers.
For $185, you should at least expect some level of speech output.
Basically, all this box does is scan over-the -air stations into memory and
provides audible feedback to assist with antenna orientation , and that's
about it.  You still cannot identify which channel you are tuned to, and it
offers no advantage if you use a cable box.  I realize that this is a
custom-made product, but it really isn't that much more accessible than a
small-screen, basic mass-market digital TV that sells for $80 or less.   And
it is totally useless for other sighted family members in your household
because it lacks a screen.  Too bad OEHM Electronics does not offer a small,
Walkman-style TV radio, which would certainly have more widespread consumer
appeal.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Giovanelli
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:21 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

Hello,

It is certainly true that voice guidance in TV sets is helpful, but there is
another option.

There is a radio especially designed to guide blind people in locating and
listening to TV on-the-air programs. This DTV radio is made by Oehm
Electronics and costs $185. It is menu or command driven. One neat feature
is the ability to tell the user how strong a signal is. This is useful when
orienting the antenna. If the received signal falls below a critical level,
the user will know that the reception of that station will be marginal at
best.

This radio does not read what's on the air program information.

It seems to me to be a viable alternative to more expensive TV solutions.

Joe Giovanelli, W2PVY

 




Gerald Levy
 

 
Again, what advantage does a $185 custom-built TV radio offer over a standard $80 digirtal TV?  None that I can see.  The fact that some guy personally builds these gadgets himself in his basement still does not justify its high cost.  Can this TV radio be operated without the remote?  If not, what are you supposed to do if you lose or break the remote?  And what recourse do you have if the TV radio itself craps out?  Bring it to a local electronics repair shop?  I don’t think so.  Oehm Electronics doesn’t even have a web site where you can learn about its products or obtain customer support.  You have to call their long distance phone number and hope that Mr. Oehm isn’t on vacation or else is otherwise unavailable. 
  
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 11:37 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
You don't need speech output.  the manual clearly explains how to perform functions without speech.  And you are overgeneralizing.  Not every higher priced item is a ripoff and circumstances should be considered.  This is not some large company with a large production.  it is a one man operation, building radios in small numbers when ordered or only enough in advance to fill a small number of anticipated orders in advance.  The radios are worth every penny.  You can't necessarily just add speech to something if it is not built in already at little or no cost.  The chip used to operate the radio has no speech ability and it is not necessary. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:59 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 

This "accessible"TV radio seems grossly overpriced for what it offers.
For $185, you should at least expect some level of speech output.
Basically, all this box does is scan over-the -air stations into memory and
provides audible feedback to assist with antenna orientation , and that's
about it.  You still cannot identify which channel you are tuned to, and it
offers no advantage if you use a cable box.  I realize that this is a
custom-made product, but it really isn't that much more accessible than a
small-screen, basic mass-market digital TV that sells for $80 or less.   And
it is totally useless for other sighted family members in your household
because it lacks a screen.  Too bad OEHM Electronics does not offer a small,
Walkman-style TV radio, which would certainly have more widespread consumer
appeal.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Giovanelli
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:21 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

Hello,

It is certainly true that voice guidance in TV sets is helpful, but there is
another option.

There is a radio especially designed to guide blind people in locating and
listening to TV on-the-air programs. This DTV radio is made by Oehm
Electronics and costs $185. It is menu or command driven. One neat feature
is the ability to tell the user how strong a signal is. This is useful when
orienting the antenna. If the received signal falls below a critical level,
the user will know that the reception of that station will be marginal at
best.

This radio does not read what's on the air program information.

It seems to me to be a viable alternative to more expensive TV solutions.

Joe Giovanelli, W2PVY

 




Gene
 

I don't have a digital television.  I don't know if any of them have speech or what that speech allows you to do.  The radio does two important things that televisions well may not do and I really don't think a cheap lowest of the line television would. 
 
The radio lets you scan for stations independently.  You don't have to see a menu in order to scan or get sighted help to learn an inaccessible sequence.  You have to scan with every new digital television so it can find stations in your area and allow you to get to them by entering the correct channel number.  The radio is designed to allow completely independent scanning.
 
The signal strength indicator is a valuable feature.  There are some stations that come in poorly when your antenna is in a certain position and others that come in well.  By checking the strength indicator when you are on a station you want to watch, you can see if you can improve reception by trying different antenna positions.  There is no other good way to find the strongest signal for a wide variety of stations.  I'm sure sighted people have some sort of indicator.  When dealing with digital signals, a blind person has no way of determining the best signal aside from an audio indicator other than by a trial and error system seeing if this or that station has signal interruptions and playing with the antenna to try to prevent them. 
 
Unless there are televisions that have these features, and I doubt there are, the radio will remain for me a much preferred method of reception. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 12:25 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

 
Again, what advantage does a $185 custom-built TV radio offer over a standard $80 digirtal TV?  None that I can see.  The fact that some guy personally builds these gadgets himself in his basement still does not justify its high cost.  Can this TV radio be operated without the remote?  If not, what are you supposed to do if you lose or break the remote?  And what recourse do you have if the TV radio itself craps out?  Bring it to a local electronics repair shop?  I don’t think so.  Oehm Electronics doesn’t even have a web site where you can learn about its products or obtain customer support.  You have to call their long distance phone number and hope that Mr. Oehm isn’t on vacation or else is otherwise unavailable. 
  
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 11:37 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
You don't need speech output.  the manual clearly explains how to perform functions without speech.  And you are overgeneralizing.  Not every higher priced item is a ripoff and circumstances should be considered.  This is not some large company with a large production.  it is a one man operation, building radios in small numbers when ordered or only enough in advance to fill a small number of anticipated orders in advance.  The radios are worth every penny.  You can't necessarily just add speech to something if it is not built in already at little or no cost.  The chip used to operate the radio has no speech ability and it is not necessary. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:59 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 

This "accessible"TV radio seems grossly overpriced for what it offers.
For $185, you should at least expect some level of speech output.
Basically, all this box does is scan over-the -air stations into memory and
provides audible feedback to assist with antenna orientation , and that's
about it.  You still cannot identify which channel you are tuned to, and it
offers no advantage if you use a cable box.  I realize that this is a
custom-made product, but it really isn't that much more accessible than a
small-screen, basic mass-market digital TV that sells for $80 or less.   And
it is totally useless for other sighted family members in your household
because it lacks a screen.  Too bad OEHM Electronics does not offer a small,
Walkman-style TV radio, which would certainly have more widespread consumer
appeal.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Giovanelli
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:21 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

Hello,

It is certainly true that voice guidance in TV sets is helpful, but there is
another option.

There is a radio especially designed to guide blind people in locating and
listening to TV on-the-air programs. This DTV radio is made by Oehm
Electronics and costs $185. It is menu or command driven. One neat feature
is the ability to tell the user how strong a signal is. This is useful when
orienting the antenna. If the received signal falls below a critical level,
the user will know that the reception of that station will be marginal at
best.

This radio does not read what's on the air program information.

It seems to me to be a viable alternative to more expensive TV solutions.

Joe Giovanelli, W2PVY

 




Gerald Levy
 

 
All digital TV’s automatically scan for receivable channels as soon as you plug them in.  This is a one-time procedure that does not need to be repeated unless the TV is moved to a different location.  Even an audible signal strength indicator is of dubious value because with digital TB, it’s all or nothing; there is no such thing as a weak signal as there was with analog TV.  You either get perfect sound and picture or nothing at all.  So if you tune to a channel and hear no sound, it means that the signal is too weak to be received by the antenna, and so it needs to be reoriented.  But this brings up the biggest problem with digital TV in the first place.  Every time you change channels, you usually have to reorient the antenna to get a receivable signal, if you can even get one at all.  This can be a real nuisance, and is the main reason why most cable TV customers are reluctant to “”cut the cord”.  In the old days of analog TV, many consumers installed elaborate rooftop antennas with rotators to optimize reception.  In most large cities, this is no longer possible because most apartment building owners now prohibit the installation of rooftop antennas.  So if you cannot get decent reception with an indoor antenna,you’re out of luck, and no amount of antenna tweaking will make muchdifference, which is just what the cable companies want. 
 
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 1:57 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
I don't have a digital television.  I don't know if any of them have speech or what that speech allows you to do.  The radio does two important things that televisions well may not do and I really don't think a cheap lowest of the line television would. 
 
The radio lets you scan for stations independently.  You don't have to see a menu in order to scan or get sighted help to learn an inaccessible sequence.  You have to scan with every new digital television so it can find stations in your area and allow you to get to them by entering the correct channel number.  The radio is designed to allow completely independent scanning.
 
The signal strength indicator is a valuable feature.  There are some stations that come in poorly when your antenna is in a certain position and others that come in well.  By checking the strength indicator when you are on a station you want to watch, you can see if you can improve reception by trying different antenna positions.  There is no other good way to find the strongest signal for a wide variety of stations.  I'm sure sighted people have some sort of indicator.  When dealing with digital signals, a blind person has no way of determining the best signal aside from an audio indicator other than by a trial and error system seeing if this or that station has signal interruptions and playing with the antenna to try to prevent them. 
 
Unless there are televisions that have these features, and I doubt there are, the radio will remain for me a much preferred method of reception. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 12:25 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
 
Again, what advantage does a $185 custom-built TV radio offer over a standard $80 digirtal TV?  None that I can see.  The fact that some guy personally builds these gadgets himself in his basement still does not justify its high cost.  Can this TV radio be operated without the remote?  If not, what are you supposed to do if you lose or break the remote?  And what recourse do you have if the TV radio itself craps out?  Bring it to a local electronics repair shop?  I don’t think so.  Oehm Electronics doesn’t even have a web site where you can learn about its products or obtain customer support.  You have to call their long distance phone number and hope that Mr. Oehm isn’t on vacation or else is otherwise unavailable. 
  
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 11:37 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
You don't need speech output.  the manual clearly explains how to perform functions without speech.  And you are overgeneralizing.  Not every higher priced item is a ripoff and circumstances should be considered.  This is not some large company with a large production.  it is a one man operation, building radios in small numbers when ordered or only enough in advance to fill a small number of anticipated orders in advance.  The radios are worth every penny.  You can't necessarily just add speech to something if it is not built in already at little or no cost.  The chip used to operate the radio has no speech ability and it is not necessary. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:59 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 

This "accessible"TV radio seems grossly overpriced for what it offers.
For $185, you should at least expect some level of speech output.
Basically, all this box does is scan over-the -air stations into memory and
provides audible feedback to assist with antenna orientation , and that's
about it.  You still cannot identify which channel you are tuned to, and it
offers no advantage if you use a cable box.  I realize that this is a
custom-made product, but it really isn't that much more accessible than a
small-screen, basic mass-market digital TV that sells for $80 or less.   And
it is totally useless for other sighted family members in your household
because it lacks a screen.  Too bad OEHM Electronics does not offer a small,
Walkman-style TV radio, which would certainly have more widespread consumer
appeal.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Giovanelli
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:21 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

Hello,

It is certainly true that voice guidance in TV sets is helpful, but there is
another option.

There is a radio especially designed to guide blind people in locating and
listening to TV on-the-air programs. This DTV radio is made by Oehm
Electronics and costs $185. It is menu or command driven. One neat feature
is the ability to tell the user how strong a signal is. This is useful when
orienting the antenna. If the received signal falls below a critical level,
the user will know that the reception of that station will be marginal at
best.

This radio does not read what's on the air program information.

It seems to me to be a viable alternative to more expensive TV solutions.

Joe Giovanelli, W2PVY

 




Gene
 

What are you basing your information on?  I have never heard that before nor was it true when I purchased a converter box.  I got my radio a while after I had the converter box and it uses standard components used to receive digital television signals and it won't do so either.  I doubt that any digital over air television or converter box scans automatically when plugged in. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 1:59 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

 
All digital TV’s automatically scan for receivable channels as soon as you plug them in.  This is a one-time procedure that does not need to be repeated unless the TV is moved to a different location.  Even an audible signal strength indicator is of dubious value because with digital TB, it’s all or nothing; there is no such thing as a weak signal as there was with analog TV.  You either get perfect sound and picture or nothing at all.  So if you tune to a channel and hear no sound, it means that the signal is too weak to be received by the antenna, and so it needs to be reoriented.  But this brings up the biggest problem with digital TV in the first place.  Every time you change channels, you usually have to reorient the antenna to get a receivable signal, if you can even get one at all.  This can be a real nuisance, and is the main reason why most cable TV customers are reluctant to “”cut the cord”.  In the old days of analog TV, many consumers installed elaborate rooftop antennas with rotators to optimize reception.  In most large cities, this is no longer possible because most apartment building owners now prohibit the installation of rooftop antennas.  So if you cannot get decent reception with an indoor antenna,you’re out of luck, and no amount of antenna tweaking will make muchdifference, which is just what the cable companies want. 
 
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 1:57 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
I don't have a digital television.  I don't know if any of them have speech or what that speech allows you to do.  The radio does two important things that televisions well may not do and I really don't think a cheap lowest of the line television would. 
 
The radio lets you scan for stations independently.  You don't have to see a menu in order to scan or get sighted help to learn an inaccessible sequence.  You have to scan with every new digital television so it can find stations in your area and allow you to get to them by entering the correct channel number.  The radio is designed to allow completely independent scanning.
 
The signal strength indicator is a valuable feature.  There are some stations that come in poorly when your antenna is in a certain position and others that come in well.  By checking the strength indicator when you are on a station you want to watch, you can see if you can improve reception by trying different antenna positions.  There is no other good way to find the strongest signal for a wide variety of stations.  I'm sure sighted people have some sort of indicator.  When dealing with digital signals, a blind person has no way of determining the best signal aside from an audio indicator other than by a trial and error system seeing if this or that station has signal interruptions and playing with the antenna to try to prevent them. 
 
Unless there are televisions that have these features, and I doubt there are, the radio will remain for me a much preferred method of reception. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 12:25 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
 
Again, what advantage does a $185 custom-built TV radio offer over a standard $80 digirtal TV?  None that I can see.  The fact that some guy personally builds these gadgets himself in his basement still does not justify its high cost.  Can this TV radio be operated without the remote?  If not, what are you supposed to do if you lose or break the remote?  And what recourse do you have if the TV radio itself craps out?  Bring it to a local electronics repair shop?  I don’t think so.  Oehm Electronics doesn’t even have a web site where you can learn about its products or obtain customer support.  You have to call their long distance phone number and hope that Mr. Oehm isn’t on vacation or else is otherwise unavailable. 
  
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 11:37 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
You don't need speech output.  the manual clearly explains how to perform functions without speech.  And you are overgeneralizing.  Not every higher priced item is a ripoff and circumstances should be considered.  This is not some large company with a large production.  it is a one man operation, building radios in small numbers when ordered or only enough in advance to fill a small number of anticipated orders in advance.  The radios are worth every penny.  You can't necessarily just add speech to something if it is not built in already at little or no cost.  The chip used to operate the radio has no speech ability and it is not necessary. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:59 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 

This "accessible"TV radio seems grossly overpriced for what it offers.
For $185, you should at least expect some level of speech output.
Basically, all this box does is scan over-the -air stations into memory and
provides audible feedback to assist with antenna orientation , and that's
about it.  You still cannot identify which channel you are tuned to, and it
offers no advantage if you use a cable box.  I realize that this is a
custom-made product, but it really isn't that much more accessible than a
small-screen, basic mass-market digital TV that sells for $80 or less.   And
it is totally useless for other sighted family members in your household
because it lacks a screen.  Too bad OEHM Electronics does not offer a small,
Walkman-style TV radio, which would certainly have more widespread consumer
appeal.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Giovanelli
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:21 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

Hello,

It is certainly true that voice guidance in TV sets is helpful, but there is
another option.

There is a radio especially designed to guide blind people in locating and
listening to TV on-the-air programs. This DTV radio is made by Oehm
Electronics and costs $185. It is menu or command driven. One neat feature
is the ability to tell the user how strong a signal is. This is useful when
orienting the antenna. If the received signal falls below a critical level,
the user will know that the reception of that station will be marginal at
best.

This radio does not read what's on the air program information.

It seems to me to be a viable alternative to more expensive TV solutions.

Joe Giovanelli, W2PVY

 




Gene
 

you have stated before that you use cable.  Your comments indicate that you have no experience with digital reception and you are misapplying what you know because you don't understand variations in digital reception and there effects.
 
You do benefit significantly with a signal strength indicator.  Digital signals can stop and start repeatedly if they are not being received strongly.  There is a threshold below which you will receive nothing and above that threshold, you will receive the signal and it will be played properly.  If you are receiving a weak signal, play may stop and start repeatedly as it fluctuates over time. 
 
With a signal indicator, I can adjust my antenna position for different stations which are broadcasting from different directions and whose signals may vary significantly with antenna position.  I don't have to experiment with different positions on difficult to receive stations until I find a good one after what may be considerable inconvenience due to disrupted reception.  I can move the antenna around, look for the best position, and get good reception if it is possible from that station at my location. 
 
You appear to assume that a digital television signal is a constant unfluctuating signal.  If you are trying to get a difficult station or are far enough away from them, the strength fluctuates just as the strength of an analog station does.  But with digital television, these fluctuations may be far more disruptive since the signal just stops when it is too weak and plays when it is strong enough.  It is precisely this behavior that makes a signal strength indicator useful.  An analog signal may sound more distorted or have more static when it is weaker or it may be softer.  Moving an antenna can be an effective way of finding a good position from such changes.  With a digital signal, there are no such changes.  Either the station plays or it doesn't and if you have the antenna in a poor position, the station may play for a minute or two or longer, then stop and start again and you may miss enough of a program to matter.  the only way to determine efficiently what is a good antenna position for a marginal or difficult station is to use a signal indicator.  and even stations that come in well and are not marginal or difficult may require very different antenna positions for good reception than other stations in the area. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 1:59 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

 
All digital TV’s automatically scan for receivable channels as soon as you plug them in.  This is a one-time procedure that does not need to be repeated unless the TV is moved to a different location.  Even an audible signal strength indicator is of dubious value because with digital TB, it’s all or nothing; there is no such thing as a weak signal as there was with analog TV.  You either get perfect sound and picture or nothing at all.  So if you tune to a channel and hear no sound, it means that the signal is too weak to be received by the antenna, and so it needs to be reoriented.  But this brings up the biggest problem with digital TV in the first place.  Every time you change channels, you usually have to reorient the antenna to get a receivable signal, if you can even get one at all.  This can be a real nuisance, and is the main reason why most cable TV customers are reluctant to “”cut the cord”.  In the old days of analog TV, many consumers installed elaborate rooftop antennas with rotators to optimize reception.  In most large cities, this is no longer possible because most apartment building owners now prohibit the installation of rooftop antennas.  So if you cannot get decent reception with an indoor antenna,you’re out of luck, and no amount of antenna tweaking will make muchdifference, which is just what the cable companies want. 
 
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 1:57 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
I don't have a digital television.  I don't know if any of them have speech or what that speech allows you to do.  The radio does two important things that televisions well may not do and I really don't think a cheap lowest of the line television would. 
 
The radio lets you scan for stations independently.  You don't have to see a menu in order to scan or get sighted help to learn an inaccessible sequence.  You have to scan with every new digital television so it can find stations in your area and allow you to get to them by entering the correct channel number.  The radio is designed to allow completely independent scanning.
 
The signal strength indicator is a valuable feature.  There are some stations that come in poorly when your antenna is in a certain position and others that come in well.  By checking the strength indicator when you are on a station you want to watch, you can see if you can improve reception by trying different antenna positions.  There is no other good way to find the strongest signal for a wide variety of stations.  I'm sure sighted people have some sort of indicator.  When dealing with digital signals, a blind person has no way of determining the best signal aside from an audio indicator other than by a trial and error system seeing if this or that station has signal interruptions and playing with the antenna to try to prevent them. 
 
Unless there are televisions that have these features, and I doubt there are, the radio will remain for me a much preferred method of reception. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 12:25 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
 
Again, what advantage does a $185 custom-built TV radio offer over a standard $80 digirtal TV?  None that I can see.  The fact that some guy personally builds these gadgets himself in his basement still does not justify its high cost.  Can this TV radio be operated without the remote?  If not, what are you supposed to do if you lose or break the remote?  And what recourse do you have if the TV radio itself craps out?  Bring it to a local electronics repair shop?  I don’t think so.  Oehm Electronics doesn’t even have a web site where you can learn about its products or obtain customer support.  You have to call their long distance phone number and hope that Mr. Oehm isn’t on vacation or else is otherwise unavailable. 
  
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 11:37 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
You don't need speech output.  the manual clearly explains how to perform functions without speech.  And you are overgeneralizing.  Not every higher priced item is a ripoff and circumstances should be considered.  This is not some large company with a large production.  it is a one man operation, building radios in small numbers when ordered or only enough in advance to fill a small number of anticipated orders in advance.  The radios are worth every penny.  You can't necessarily just add speech to something if it is not built in already at little or no cost.  The chip used to operate the radio has no speech ability and it is not necessary. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:59 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 

This "accessible"TV radio seems grossly overpriced for what it offers.
For $185, you should at least expect some level of speech output.
Basically, all this box does is scan over-the -air stations into memory and
provides audible feedback to assist with antenna orientation , and that's
about it.  You still cannot identify which channel you are tuned to, and it
offers no advantage if you use a cable box.  I realize that this is a
custom-made product, but it really isn't that much more accessible than a
small-screen, basic mass-market digital TV that sells for $80 or less.   And
it is totally useless for other sighted family members in your household
because it lacks a screen.  Too bad OEHM Electronics does not offer a small,
Walkman-style TV radio, which would certainly have more widespread consumer
appeal.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Giovanelli
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:21 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

Hello,

It is certainly true that voice guidance in TV sets is helpful, but there is
another option.

There is a radio especially designed to guide blind people in locating and
listening to TV on-the-air programs. This DTV radio is made by Oehm
Electronics and costs $185. It is menu or command driven. One neat feature
is the ability to tell the user how strong a signal is. This is useful when
orienting the antenna. If the received signal falls below a critical level,
the user will know that the reception of that station will be marginal at
best.

This radio does not read what's on the air program information.

It seems to me to be a viable alternative to more expensive TV solutions.

Joe Giovanelli, W2PVY

 




Gerald Levy
 

 
The Zenith digital converter box I purchased from Radio Shack in 2009 to use with my analog TV automatically scanned for receivable signals as soon as it was plugged in and connected to an antenna.  There was no need to access the onscreen menus to do this.  But because the box could not receive satisfactory reception, I never used it, and so continue to rely on cable TV.  I checked the instruction manual for my Samsung digital TV, and it,, too, will automatically scan for available channels as soon as it is plugged in.  It is possible that some TV’s require activating an option from the onscreen menu to accomplish this, but this is a one-time procedure.
 
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 3:38 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
What are you basing your information on?  I have never heard that before nor was it true when I purchased a converter box.  I got my radio a while after I had the converter box and it uses standard components used to receive digital television signals and it won't do so either.  I doubt that any digital over air television or converter box scans automatically when plugged in. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 1:59 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
 
All digital TV’s automatically scan for receivable channels as soon as you plug them in.  This is a one-time procedure that does not need to be repeated unless the TV is moved to a different location.  Even an audible signal strength indicator is of dubious value because with digital TB, it’s all or nothing; there is no such thing as a weak signal as there was with analog TV.  You either get perfect sound and picture or nothing at all.  So if you tune to a channel and hear no sound, it means that the signal is too weak to be received by the antenna, and so it needs to be reoriented.  But this brings up the biggest problem with digital TV in the first place.  Every time you change channels, you usually have to reorient the antenna to get a receivable signal, if you can even get one at all.  This can be a real nuisance, and is the main reason why most cable TV customers are reluctant to “”cut the cord”.  In the old days of analog TV, many consumers installed elaborate rooftop antennas with rotators to optimize reception.  In most large cities, this is no longer possible because most apartment building owners now prohibit the installation of rooftop antennas.  So if you cannot get decent reception with an indoor antenna,you’re out of luck, and no amount of antenna tweaking will make muchdifference, which is just what the cable companies want. 
 
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 1:57 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
I don't have a digital television.  I don't know if any of them have speech or what that speech allows you to do.  The radio does two important things that televisions well may not do and I really don't think a cheap lowest of the line television would. 
 
The radio lets you scan for stations independently.  You don't have to see a menu in order to scan or get sighted help to learn an inaccessible sequence.  You have to scan with every new digital television so it can find stations in your area and allow you to get to them by entering the correct channel number.  The radio is designed to allow completely independent scanning.
 
The signal strength indicator is a valuable feature.  There are some stations that come in poorly when your antenna is in a certain position and others that come in well.  By checking the strength indicator when you are on a station you want to watch, you can see if you can improve reception by trying different antenna positions.  There is no other good way to find the strongest signal for a wide variety of stations.  I'm sure sighted people have some sort of indicator.  When dealing with digital signals, a blind person has no way of determining the best signal aside from an audio indicator other than by a trial and error system seeing if this or that station has signal interruptions and playing with the antenna to try to prevent them. 
 
Unless there are televisions that have these features, and I doubt there are, the radio will remain for me a much preferred method of reception. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 12:25 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
 
Again, what advantage does a $185 custom-built TV radio offer over a standard $80 digirtal TV?  None that I can see.  The fact that some guy personally builds these gadgets himself in his basement still does not justify its high cost.  Can this TV radio be operated without the remote?  If not, what are you supposed to do if you lose or break the remote?  And what recourse do you have if the TV radio itself craps out?  Bring it to a local electronics repair shop?  I don’t think so.  Oehm Electronics doesn’t even have a web site where you can learn about its products or obtain customer support.  You have to call their long distance phone number and hope that Mr. Oehm isn’t on vacation or else is otherwise unavailable. 
  
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 11:37 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
You don't need speech output.  the manual clearly explains how to perform functions without speech.  And you are overgeneralizing.  Not every higher priced item is a ripoff and circumstances should be considered.  This is not some large company with a large production.  it is a one man operation, building radios in small numbers when ordered or only enough in advance to fill a small number of anticipated orders in advance.  The radios are worth every penny.  You can't necessarily just add speech to something if it is not built in already at little or no cost.  The chip used to operate the radio has no speech ability and it is not necessary. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:59 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 

This "accessible"TV radio seems grossly overpriced for what it offers.
For $185, you should at least expect some level of speech output.
Basically, all this box does is scan over-the -air stations into memory and
provides audible feedback to assist with antenna orientation , and that's
about it.  You still cannot identify which channel you are tuned to, and it
offers no advantage if you use a cable box.  I realize that this is a
custom-made product, but it really isn't that much more accessible than a
small-screen, basic mass-market digital TV that sells for $80 or less.   And
it is totally useless for other sighted family members in your household
because it lacks a screen.  Too bad OEHM Electronics does not offer a small,
Walkman-style TV radio, which would certainly have more widespread consumer
appeal.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Giovanelli
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:21 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

Hello,

It is certainly true that voice guidance in TV sets is helpful, but there is
another option.

There is a radio especially designed to guide blind people in locating and
listening to TV on-the-air programs. This DTV radio is made by Oehm
Electronics and costs $185. It is menu or command driven. One neat feature
is the ability to tell the user how strong a signal is. This is useful when
orienting the antenna. If the received signal falls below a critical level,
the user will know that the reception of that station will be marginal at
best.

This radio does not read what's on the air program information.

It seems to me to be a viable alternative to more expensive TV solutions.

Joe Giovanelli, W2PVY

 




Gene
 

It isn't a one time procedure if a television station in your area changes its frequency or if new stations begin broadcasting over time.  It is not a one time procedure if you move or if, through some circumstances that may be unexpected, the television loses its information. 
 
You are really overgeneralizing from almost no experience.  You are stating overgeneralized conclusions as though they are generally applicable with no evidence that they are.  If this was the kind of wide spread behavior you believe it is, then why didn't I see any discussion of this during the transition period when places like AFB were publishing articles about the transition and what you should know. 
 
If the only reason to use the radio was to avoid scanning, then for someone who reasonably easily has help available, they might want to use a television or converter box.  But the signal strength indicator is a feature I consider very important and that when combined with the convenience and independence of being able to scan when I want in case I want to check for new stations or if a station changes its frequency, make the radio well worth the price in my opinion. 
 
You argue against specialized blindness appliances such as microwaves and there are good arguments not to use some or perhaps many such specialized products.  But you are overgeneralizing and applying your arguments to an appliance where they are not valid. 
A digital TV radio is used differently and the user has to contend with different circumstances than when using a microwave. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 3:06 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

 
The Zenith digital converter box I purchased from Radio Shack in 2009 to use with my analog TV automatically scanned for receivable signals as soon as it was plugged in and connected to an antenna.  There was no need to access the onscreen menus to do this.  But because the box could not receive satisfactory reception, I never used it, and so continue to rely on cable TV.  I checked the instruction manual for my Samsung digital TV, and it,, too, will automatically scan for available channels as soon as it is plugged in.  It is possible that some TV’s require activating an option from the onscreen menu to accomplish this, but this is a one-time procedure.
 
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 3:38 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
What are you basing your information on?  I have never heard that before nor was it true when I purchased a converter box.  I got my radio a while after I had the converter box and it uses standard components used to receive digital television signals and it won't do so either.  I doubt that any digital over air television or converter box scans automatically when plugged in. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 1:59 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
 
All digital TV’s automatically scan for receivable channels as soon as you plug them in.  This is a one-time procedure that does not need to be repeated unless the TV is moved to a different location.  Even an audible signal strength indicator is of dubious value because with digital TB, it’s all or nothing; there is no such thing as a weak signal as there was with analog TV.  You either get perfect sound and picture or nothing at all.  So if you tune to a channel and hear no sound, it means that the signal is too weak to be received by the antenna, and so it needs to be reoriented.  But this brings up the biggest problem with digital TV in the first place.  Every time you change channels, you usually have to reorient the antenna to get a receivable signal, if you can even get one at all.  This can be a real nuisance, and is the main reason why most cable TV customers are reluctant to “”cut the cord”.  In the old days of analog TV, many consumers installed elaborate rooftop antennas with rotators to optimize reception.  In most large cities, this is no longer possible because most apartment building owners now prohibit the installation of rooftop antennas.  So if you cannot get decent reception with an indoor antenna,you’re out of luck, and no amount of antenna tweaking will make muchdifference, which is just what the cable companies want. 
 
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 1:57 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
I don't have a digital television.  I don't know if any of them have speech or what that speech allows you to do.  The radio does two important things that televisions well may not do and I really don't think a cheap lowest of the line television would. 
 
The radio lets you scan for stations independently.  You don't have to see a menu in order to scan or get sighted help to learn an inaccessible sequence.  You have to scan with every new digital television so it can find stations in your area and allow you to get to them by entering the correct channel number.  The radio is designed to allow completely independent scanning.
 
The signal strength indicator is a valuable feature.  There are some stations that come in poorly when your antenna is in a certain position and others that come in well.  By checking the strength indicator when you are on a station you want to watch, you can see if you can improve reception by trying different antenna positions.  There is no other good way to find the strongest signal for a wide variety of stations.  I'm sure sighted people have some sort of indicator.  When dealing with digital signals, a blind person has no way of determining the best signal aside from an audio indicator other than by a trial and error system seeing if this or that station has signal interruptions and playing with the antenna to try to prevent them. 
 
Unless there are televisions that have these features, and I doubt there are, the radio will remain for me a much preferred method of reception. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 12:25 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
 
Again, what advantage does a $185 custom-built TV radio offer over a standard $80 digirtal TV?  None that I can see.  The fact that some guy personally builds these gadgets himself in his basement still does not justify its high cost.  Can this TV radio be operated without the remote?  If not, what are you supposed to do if you lose or break the remote?  And what recourse do you have if the TV radio itself craps out?  Bring it to a local electronics repair shop?  I don’t think so.  Oehm Electronics doesn’t even have a web site where you can learn about its products or obtain customer support.  You have to call their long distance phone number and hope that Mr. Oehm isn’t on vacation or else is otherwise unavailable. 
  
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 11:37 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
You don't need speech output.  the manual clearly explains how to perform functions without speech.  And you are overgeneralizing.  Not every higher priced item is a ripoff and circumstances should be considered.  This is not some large company with a large production.  it is a one man operation, building radios in small numbers when ordered or only enough in advance to fill a small number of anticipated orders in advance.  The radios are worth every penny.  You can't necessarily just add speech to something if it is not built in already at little or no cost.  The chip used to operate the radio has no speech ability and it is not necessary. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:59 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 

This "accessible"TV radio seems grossly overpriced for what it offers.
For $185, you should at least expect some level of speech output.
Basically, all this box does is scan over-the -air stations into memory and
provides audible feedback to assist with antenna orientation , and that's
about it.  You still cannot identify which channel you are tuned to, and it
offers no advantage if you use a cable box.  I realize that this is a
custom-made product, but it really isn't that much more accessible than a
small-screen, basic mass-market digital TV that sells for $80 or less.   And
it is totally useless for other sighted family members in your household
because it lacks a screen.  Too bad OEHM Electronics does not offer a small,
Walkman-style TV radio, which would certainly have more widespread consumer
appeal.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Giovanelli
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:21 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

Hello,

It is certainly true that voice guidance in TV sets is helpful, but there is
another option.

There is a radio especially designed to guide blind people in locating and
listening to TV on-the-air programs. This DTV radio is made by Oehm
Electronics and costs $185. It is menu or command driven. One neat feature
is the ability to tell the user how strong a signal is. This is useful when
orienting the antenna. If the received signal falls below a critical level,
the user will know that the reception of that station will be marginal at
best.

This radio does not read what's on the air program information.

It seems to me to be a viable alternative to more expensive TV solutions.

Joe Giovanelli, W2PVY

 




Gerald Levy
 

 
But scanning for channels needs to be done so infrequently that it is easier to just ask a sighted friend or family member to do it for you rather than spend $185 just so that you can do it yourself.  And you are merely reinforcing my argument against this product by admitting that you frequently rely on its audible signal strength indicator to continually readjust the antenna for optimum reception.  You may not find this to be much of a problem, but for most consumers, fiddling all the time  with the antenna would be a major nuisance.
 
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 4:21 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
It isn't a one time procedure if a television station in your area changes its frequency or if new stations begin broadcasting over time.  It is not a one time procedure if you move or if, through some circumstances that may be unexpected, the television loses its information. 
 
You are really overgeneralizing from almost no experience.  You are stating overgeneralized conclusions as though they are generally applicable with no evidence that they are.  If this was the kind of wide spread behavior you believe it is, then why didn't I see any discussion of this during the transition period when places like AFB were publishing articles about the transition and what you should know. 
 
If the only reason to use the radio was to avoid scanning, then for someone who reasonably easily has help available, they might want to use a television or converter box.  But the signal strength indicator is a feature I consider very important and that when combined with the convenience and independence of being able to scan when I want in case I want to check for new stations or if a station changes its frequency, make the radio well worth the price in my opinion. 
 
You argue against specialized blindness appliances such as microwaves and there are good arguments not to use some or perhaps many such specialized products.  But you are overgeneralizing and applying your arguments to an appliance where they are not valid. 
A digital TV radio is used differently and the user has to contend with different circumstances than when using a microwave. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 3:06 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
 
The Zenith digital converter box I purchased from Radio Shack in 2009 to use with my analog TV automatically scanned for receivable signals as soon as it was plugged in and connected to an antenna.  There was no need to access the onscreen menus to do this.  But because the box could not receive satisfactory reception, I never used it, and so continue to rely on cable TV.  I checked the instruction manual for my Samsung digital TV, and it,, too, will automatically scan for available channels as soon as it is plugged in.  It is possible that some TV’s require activating an option from the onscreen menu to accomplish this, but this is a one-time procedure.
 
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 3:38 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
What are you basing your information on?  I have never heard that before nor was it true when I purchased a converter box.  I got my radio a while after I had the converter box and it uses standard components used to receive digital television signals and it won't do so either.  I doubt that any digital over air television or converter box scans automatically when plugged in. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 1:59 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
 
All digital TV’s automatically scan for receivable channels as soon as you plug them in.  This is a one-time procedure that does not need to be repeated unless the TV is moved to a different location.  Even an audible signal strength indicator is of dubious value because with digital TB, it’s all or nothing; there is no such thing as a weak signal as there was with analog TV.  You either get perfect sound and picture or nothing at all.  So if you tune to a channel and hear no sound, it means that the signal is too weak to be received by the antenna, and so it needs to be reoriented.  But this brings up the biggest problem with digital TV in the first place.  Every time you change channels, you usually have to reorient the antenna to get a receivable signal, if you can even get one at all.  This can be a real nuisance, and is the main reason why most cable TV customers are reluctant to “”cut the cord”.  In the old days of analog TV, many consumers installed elaborate rooftop antennas with rotators to optimize reception.  In most large cities, this is no longer possible because most apartment building owners now prohibit the installation of rooftop antennas.  So if you cannot get decent reception with an indoor antenna,you’re out of luck, and no amount of antenna tweaking will make muchdifference, which is just what the cable companies want. 
 
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 1:57 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
I don't have a digital television.  I don't know if any of them have speech or what that speech allows you to do.  The radio does two important things that televisions well may not do and I really don't think a cheap lowest of the line television would. 
 
The radio lets you scan for stations independently.  You don't have to see a menu in order to scan or get sighted help to learn an inaccessible sequence.  You have to scan with every new digital television so it can find stations in your area and allow you to get to them by entering the correct channel number.  The radio is designed to allow completely independent scanning.
 
The signal strength indicator is a valuable feature.  There are some stations that come in poorly when your antenna is in a certain position and others that come in well.  By checking the strength indicator when you are on a station you want to watch, you can see if you can improve reception by trying different antenna positions.  There is no other good way to find the strongest signal for a wide variety of stations.  I'm sure sighted people have some sort of indicator.  When dealing with digital signals, a blind person has no way of determining the best signal aside from an audio indicator other than by a trial and error system seeing if this or that station has signal interruptions and playing with the antenna to try to prevent them. 
 
Unless there are televisions that have these features, and I doubt there are, the radio will remain for me a much preferred method of reception. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 12:25 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
 
Again, what advantage does a $185 custom-built TV radio offer over a standard $80 digirtal TV?  None that I can see.  The fact that some guy personally builds these gadgets himself in his basement still does not justify its high cost.  Can this TV radio be operated without the remote?  If not, what are you supposed to do if you lose or break the remote?  And what recourse do you have if the TV radio itself craps out?  Bring it to a local electronics repair shop?  I don’t think so.  Oehm Electronics doesn’t even have a web site where you can learn about its products or obtain customer support.  You have to call their long distance phone number and hope that Mr. Oehm isn’t on vacation or else is otherwise unavailable. 
  
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 11:37 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
You don't need speech output.  the manual clearly explains how to perform functions without speech.  And you are overgeneralizing.  Not every higher priced item is a ripoff and circumstances should be considered.  This is not some large company with a large production.  it is a one man operation, building radios in small numbers when ordered or only enough in advance to fill a small number of anticipated orders in advance.  The radios are worth every penny.  You can't necessarily just add speech to something if it is not built in already at little or no cost.  The chip used to operate the radio has no speech ability and it is not necessary. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:59 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 

This "accessible"TV radio seems grossly overpriced for what it offers.
For $185, you should at least expect some level of speech output.
Basically, all this box does is scan over-the -air stations into memory and
provides audible feedback to assist with antenna orientation , and that's
about it.  You still cannot identify which channel you are tuned to, and it
offers no advantage if you use a cable box.  I realize that this is a
custom-made product, but it really isn't that much more accessible than a
small-screen, basic mass-market digital TV that sells for $80 or less.   And
it is totally useless for other sighted family members in your household
because it lacks a screen.  Too bad OEHM Electronics does not offer a small,
Walkman-style TV radio, which would certainly have more widespread consumer
appeal.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Giovanelli
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:21 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

Hello,

It is certainly true that voice guidance in TV sets is helpful, but there is
another option.

There is a radio especially designed to guide blind people in locating and
listening to TV on-the-air programs. This DTV radio is made by Oehm
Electronics and costs $185. It is menu or command driven. One neat feature
is the ability to tell the user how strong a signal is. This is useful when
orienting the antenna. If the received signal falls below a critical level,
the user will know that the reception of that station will be marginal at
best.

This radio does not read what's on the air program information.

It seems to me to be a viable alternative to more expensive TV solutions.

Joe Giovanelli, W2PVY

 




Gene
 

Even if this radio didn't allow me to scan without help, the signal strength indicator is valuable enough that I would seriously consider getting the radio for that feature alone now that I've used it and developed an appreciation of it. 
 
Constantly fiddling is your characterization of what I said.  At first, when dealing with a difficult station, it may take experimentation.  But you know what's worse?  Not being able to do it and having the constant frustration of having the audio be lost because you can't determine a reliable reception position efficiently.  And once you have determined a good position, you can make a point of remembering it for that station.
 
Sighted people have an indicator that gives signal strength information visually.  I have already explained why this is not important for analog reception but why it is for digital reception. 
 
I am writing based on two or three years experience using this feature and comparing that with a year or two when I used a converter box without it.  You appear to be arguing not based on facts or experience.  You appear to be arguing based on your dislike of paying more money for adaptive products.  Like it or not, there are times when its worth getting an adaptive product. 
 
If I lived really close to the transmitters, such as downtown and reception was very easy, then it might not be a feature worth getting.  Most people don't live in anything approaching such ideal reception conditions.  I don't advocate using special adaptive products that are more expensive unless there is a real benefit and there is in this case. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 3:47 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

 
But scanning for channels needs to be done so infrequently that it is easier to just ask a sighted friend or family member to do it for you rather than spend $185 just so that you can do it yourself.  And you are merely reinforcing my argument against this product by admitting that you frequently rely on its audible signal strength indicator to continually readjust the antenna for optimum reception.  You may not find this to be much of a problem, but for most consumers, fiddling all the time  with the antenna would be a major nuisance.
 
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 4:21 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
It isn't a one time procedure if a television station in your area changes its frequency or if new stations begin broadcasting over time.  It is not a one time procedure if you move or if, through some circumstances that may be unexpected, the television loses its information. 
 
You are really overgeneralizing from almost no experience.  You are stating overgeneralized conclusions as though they are generally applicable with no evidence that they are.  If this was the kind of wide spread behavior you believe it is, then why didn't I see any discussion of this during the transition period when places like AFB were publishing articles about the transition and what you should know. 
 
If the only reason to use the radio was to avoid scanning, then for someone who reasonably easily has help available, they might want to use a television or converter box.  But the signal strength indicator is a feature I consider very important and that when combined with the convenience and independence of being able to scan when I want in case I want to check for new stations or if a station changes its frequency, make the radio well worth the price in my opinion. 
 
You argue against specialized blindness appliances such as microwaves and there are good arguments not to use some or perhaps many such specialized products.  But you are overgeneralizing and applying your arguments to an appliance where they are not valid. 
A digital TV radio is used differently and the user has to contend with different circumstances than when using a microwave. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 3:06 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
 
The Zenith digital converter box I purchased from Radio Shack in 2009 to use with my analog TV automatically scanned for receivable signals as soon as it was plugged in and connected to an antenna.  There was no need to access the onscreen menus to do this.  But because the box could not receive satisfactory reception, I never used it, and so continue to rely on cable TV.  I checked the instruction manual for my Samsung digital TV, and it,, too, will automatically scan for available channels as soon as it is plugged in.  It is possible that some TV’s require activating an option from the onscreen menu to accomplish this, but this is a one-time procedure.
 
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 3:38 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
What are you basing your information on?  I have never heard that before nor was it true when I purchased a converter box.  I got my radio a while after I had the converter box and it uses standard components used to receive digital television signals and it won't do so either.  I doubt that any digital over air television or converter box scans automatically when plugged in. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 1:59 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
 
All digital TV’s automatically scan for receivable channels as soon as you plug them in.  This is a one-time procedure that does not need to be repeated unless the TV is moved to a different location.  Even an audible signal strength indicator is of dubious value because with digital TB, it’s all or nothing; there is no such thing as a weak signal as there was with analog TV.  You either get perfect sound and picture or nothing at all.  So if you tune to a channel and hear no sound, it means that the signal is too weak to be received by the antenna, and so it needs to be reoriented.  But this brings up the biggest problem with digital TV in the first place.  Every time you change channels, you usually have to reorient the antenna to get a receivable signal, if you can even get one at all.  This can be a real nuisance, and is the main reason why most cable TV customers are reluctant to “”cut the cord”.  In the old days of analog TV, many consumers installed elaborate rooftop antennas with rotators to optimize reception.  In most large cities, this is no longer possible because most apartment building owners now prohibit the installation of rooftop antennas.  So if you cannot get decent reception with an indoor antenna,you’re out of luck, and no amount of antenna tweaking will make muchdifference, which is just what the cable companies want. 
 
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 1:57 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
I don't have a digital television.  I don't know if any of them have speech or what that speech allows you to do.  The radio does two important things that televisions well may not do and I really don't think a cheap lowest of the line television would. 
 
The radio lets you scan for stations independently.  You don't have to see a menu in order to scan or get sighted help to learn an inaccessible sequence.  You have to scan with every new digital television so it can find stations in your area and allow you to get to them by entering the correct channel number.  The radio is designed to allow completely independent scanning.
 
The signal strength indicator is a valuable feature.  There are some stations that come in poorly when your antenna is in a certain position and others that come in well.  By checking the strength indicator when you are on a station you want to watch, you can see if you can improve reception by trying different antenna positions.  There is no other good way to find the strongest signal for a wide variety of stations.  I'm sure sighted people have some sort of indicator.  When dealing with digital signals, a blind person has no way of determining the best signal aside from an audio indicator other than by a trial and error system seeing if this or that station has signal interruptions and playing with the antenna to try to prevent them. 
 
Unless there are televisions that have these features, and I doubt there are, the radio will remain for me a much preferred method of reception. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 12:25 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
 
Again, what advantage does a $185 custom-built TV radio offer over a standard $80 digirtal TV?  None that I can see.  The fact that some guy personally builds these gadgets himself in his basement still does not justify its high cost.  Can this TV radio be operated without the remote?  If not, what are you supposed to do if you lose or break the remote?  And what recourse do you have if the TV radio itself craps out?  Bring it to a local electronics repair shop?  I don’t think so.  Oehm Electronics doesn’t even have a web site where you can learn about its products or obtain customer support.  You have to call their long distance phone number and hope that Mr. Oehm isn’t on vacation or else is otherwise unavailable. 
  
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 11:37 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
You don't need speech output.  the manual clearly explains how to perform functions without speech.  And you are overgeneralizing.  Not every higher priced item is a ripoff and circumstances should be considered.  This is not some large company with a large production.  it is a one man operation, building radios in small numbers when ordered or only enough in advance to fill a small number of anticipated orders in advance.  The radios are worth every penny.  You can't necessarily just add speech to something if it is not built in already at little or no cost.  The chip used to operate the radio has no speech ability and it is not necessary. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:59 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 

This "accessible"TV radio seems grossly overpriced for what it offers.
For $185, you should at least expect some level of speech output.
Basically, all this box does is scan over-the -air stations into memory and
provides audible feedback to assist with antenna orientation , and that's
about it.  You still cannot identify which channel you are tuned to, and it
offers no advantage if you use a cable box.  I realize that this is a
custom-made product, but it really isn't that much more accessible than a
small-screen, basic mass-market digital TV that sells for $80 or less.   And
it is totally useless for other sighted family members in your household
because it lacks a screen.  Too bad OEHM Electronics does not offer a small,
Walkman-style TV radio, which would certainly have more widespread consumer
appeal.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Giovanelli
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:21 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

Hello,

It is certainly true that voice guidance in TV sets is helpful, but there is
another option.

There is a radio especially designed to guide blind people in locating and
listening to TV on-the-air programs. This DTV radio is made by Oehm
Electronics and costs $185. It is menu or command driven. One neat feature
is the ability to tell the user how strong a signal is. This is useful when
orienting the antenna. If the received signal falls below a critical level,
the user will know that the reception of that station will be marginal at
best.

This radio does not read what's on the air program information.

It seems to me to be a viable alternative to more expensive TV solutions.

Joe Giovanelli, W2PVY

 




Ron Canazzi
 

Hi Gene,


I missed the beginning of this thread.  You are talking about some sort of radio to receive TV signals: is that correct?  If so, what is the radio make and model and approximate cost?



On 11/21/2016 8:15 PM, Gene wrote:
Even if this radio didn't allow me to scan without help, the signal strength indicator is valuable enough that I would seriously consider getting the radio for that feature alone now that I've used it and developed an appreciation of it. 
 
Constantly fiddling is your characterization of what I said.  At first, when dealing with a difficult station, it may take experimentation.  But you know what's worse?  Not being able to do it and having the constant frustration of having the audio be lost because you can't determine a reliable reception position efficiently.  And once you have determined a good position, you can make a point of remembering it for that station.
 
Sighted people have an indicator that gives signal strength information visually.  I have already explained why this is not important for analog reception but why it is for digital reception. 
 
I am writing based on two or three years experience using this feature and comparing that with a year or two when I used a converter box without it.  You appear to be arguing not based on facts or experience.  You appear to be arguing based on your dislike of paying more money for adaptive products.  Like it or not, there are times when its worth getting an adaptive product. 
 
If I lived really close to the transmitters, such as downtown and reception was very easy, then it might not be a feature worth getting.  Most people don't live in anything approaching such ideal reception conditions.  I don't advocate using special adaptive products that are more expensive unless there is a real benefit and there is in this case. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 3:47 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

 
But scanning for channels needs to be done so infrequently that it is easier to just ask a sighted friend or family member to do it for you rather than spend $185 just so that you can do it yourself.  And you are merely reinforcing my argument against this product by admitting that you frequently rely on its audible signal strength indicator to continually readjust the antenna for optimum reception.  You may not find this to be much of a problem, but for most consumers, fiddling all the time  with the antenna would be a major nuisance.
 
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 4:21 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
It isn't a one time procedure if a television station in your area changes its frequency or if new stations begin broadcasting over time.  It is not a one time procedure if you move or if, through some circumstances that may be unexpected, the television loses its information. 
 
You are really overgeneralizing from almost no experience.  You are stating overgeneralized conclusions as though they are generally applicable with no evidence that they are.  If this was the kind of wide spread behavior you believe it is, then why didn't I see any discussion of this during the transition period when places like AFB were publishing articles about the transition and what you should know. 
 
If the only reason to use the radio was to avoid scanning, then for someone who reasonably easily has help available, they might want to use a television or converter box.  But the signal strength indicator is a feature I consider very important and that when combined with the convenience and independence of being able to scan when I want in case I want to check for new stations or if a station changes its frequency, make the radio well worth the price in my opinion. 
 
You argue against specialized blindness appliances such as microwaves and there are good arguments not to use some or perhaps many such specialized products.  But you are overgeneralizing and applying your arguments to an appliance where they are not valid. 
A digital TV radio is used differently and the user has to contend with different circumstances than when using a microwave. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 3:06 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
 
The Zenith digital converter box I purchased from Radio Shack in 2009 to use with my analog TV automatically scanned for receivable signals as soon as it was plugged in and connected to an antenna.  There was no need to access the onscreen menus to do this.  But because the box could not receive satisfactory reception, I never used it, and so continue to rely on cable TV.  I checked the instruction manual for my Samsung digital TV, and it,, too, will automatically scan for available channels as soon as it is plugged in.  It is possible that some TV’s require activating an option from the onscreen menu to accomplish this, but this is a one-time procedure.
 
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 3:38 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
What are you basing your information on?  I have never heard that before nor was it true when I purchased a converter box.  I got my radio a while after I had the converter box and it uses standard components used to receive digital television signals and it won't do so either.  I doubt that any digital over air television or converter box scans automatically when plugged in. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 1:59 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
 
All digital TV’s automatically scan for receivable channels as soon as you plug them in.  This is a one-time procedure that does not need to be repeated unless the TV is moved to a different location.  Even an audible signal strength indicator is of dubious value because with digital TB, it’s all or nothing; there is no such thing as a weak signal as there was with analog TV.  You either get perfect sound and picture or nothing at all.  So if you tune to a channel and hear no sound, it means that the signal is too weak to be received by the antenna, and so it needs to be reoriented.  But this brings up the biggest problem with digital TV in the first place.  Every time you change channels, you usually have to reorient the antenna to get a receivable signal, if you can even get one at all.  This can be a real nuisance, and is the main reason why most cable TV customers are reluctant to “”cut the cord”.  In the old days of analog TV, many consumers installed elaborate rooftop antennas with rotators to optimize reception.  In most large cities, this is no longer possible because most apartment building owners now prohibit the installation of rooftop antennas.  So if you cannot get decent reception with an indoor antenna,you’re out of luck, and no amount of antenna tweaking will make muchdifference, which is just what the cable companies want. 
 
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 1:57 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
I don't have a digital television.  I don't know if any of them have speech or what that speech allows you to do.  The radio does two important things that televisions well may not do and I really don't think a cheap lowest of the line television would. 
 
The radio lets you scan for stations independently.  You don't have to see a menu in order to scan or get sighted help to learn an inaccessible sequence.  You have to scan with every new digital television so it can find stations in your area and allow you to get to them by entering the correct channel number.  The radio is designed to allow completely independent scanning.
 
The signal strength indicator is a valuable feature.  There are some stations that come in poorly when your antenna is in a certain position and others that come in well.  By checking the strength indicator when you are on a station you want to watch, you can see if you can improve reception by trying different antenna positions.  There is no other good way to find the strongest signal for a wide variety of stations.  I'm sure sighted people have some sort of indicator.  When dealing with digital signals, a blind person has no way of determining the best signal aside from an audio indicator other than by a trial and error system seeing if this or that station has signal interruptions and playing with the antenna to try to prevent them. 
 
Unless there are televisions that have these features, and I doubt there are, the radio will remain for me a much preferred method of reception. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 12:25 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
 
Again, what advantage does a $185 custom-built TV radio offer over a standard $80 digirtal TV?  None that I can see.  The fact that some guy personally builds these gadgets himself in his basement still does not justify its high cost.  Can this TV radio be operated without the remote?  If not, what are you supposed to do if you lose or break the remote?  And what recourse do you have if the TV radio itself craps out?  Bring it to a local electronics repair shop?  I don’t think so.  Oehm Electronics doesn’t even have a web site where you can learn about its products or obtain customer support.  You have to call their long distance phone number and hope that Mr. Oehm isn’t on vacation or else is otherwise unavailable. 
  
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 11:37 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
You don't need speech output.  the manual clearly explains how to perform functions without speech.  And you are overgeneralizing.  Not every higher priced item is a ripoff and circumstances should be considered.  This is not some large company with a large production.  it is a one man operation, building radios in small numbers when ordered or only enough in advance to fill a small number of anticipated orders in advance.  The radios are worth every penny.  You can't necessarily just add speech to something if it is not built in already at little or no cost.  The chip used to operate the radio has no speech ability and it is not necessary. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:59 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 

This "accessible"TV radio seems grossly overpriced for what it offers.
For $185, you should at least expect some level of speech output.
Basically, all this box does is scan over-the -air stations into memory and
provides audible feedback to assist with antenna orientation , and that's
about it.  You still cannot identify which channel you are tuned to, and it
offers no advantage if you use a cable box.  I realize that this is a
custom-made product, but it really isn't that much more accessible than a
small-screen, basic mass-market digital TV that sells for $80 or less.   And
it is totally useless for other sighted family members in your household
because it lacks a screen.  Too bad OEHM Electronics does not offer a small,
Walkman-style TV radio, which would certainly have more widespread consumer
appeal.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Giovanelli
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:21 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

Hello,

It is certainly true that voice guidance in TV sets is helpful, but there is
another option.

There is a radio especially designed to guide blind people in locating and
listening to TV on-the-air programs. This DTV radio is made by Oehm
Electronics and costs $185. It is menu or command driven. One neat feature
is the ability to tell the user how strong a signal is. This is useful when
orienting the antenna. If the received signal falls below a critical level,
the user will know that the reception of that station will be marginal at
best.

This radio does not read what's on the air program information.

It seems to me to be a viable alternative to more expensive TV solutions.

Joe Giovanelli, W2PVY

 




--
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


Gene
 

The first message in the thread providing that information is at the bottom of the thread.  It's at the bottom of this message. 
 
Oehm Electronics.  Price $185.00.
 
I haven't looked on the Internet.  If you want to order one or get more information and can't find more with a search, I can see if I have such information.  I believe it's in the manual.
 
gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 8:27 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

Hi Gene,


I missed the beginning of this thread.  You are talking about some sort of radio to receive TV signals: is that correct?  If so, what is the radio make and model and approximate cost?



On 11/21/2016 8:15 PM, Gene wrote:
Even if this radio didn't allow me to scan without help, the signal strength indicator is valuable enough that I would seriously consider getting the radio for that feature alone now that I've used it and developed an appreciation of it. 
 
Constantly fiddling is your characterization of what I said.  At first, when dealing with a difficult station, it may take experimentation.  But you know what's worse?  Not being able to do it and having the constant frustration of having the audio be lost because you can't determine a reliable reception position efficiently.  And once you have determined a good position, you can make a point of remembering it for that station.
 
Sighted people have an indicator that gives signal strength information visually.  I have already explained why this is not important for analog reception but why it is for digital reception. 
 
I am writing based on two or three years experience using this feature and comparing that with a year or two when I used a converter box without it.  You appear to be arguing not based on facts or experience.  You appear to be arguing based on your dislike of paying more money for adaptive products.  Like it or not, there are times when its worth getting an adaptive product. 
 
If I lived really close to the transmitters, such as downtown and reception was very easy, then it might not be a feature worth getting.  Most people don't live in anything approaching such ideal reception conditions.  I don't advocate using special adaptive products that are more expensive unless there is a real benefit and there is in this case. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 3:47 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

 
But scanning for channels needs to be done so infrequently that it is easier to just ask a sighted friend or family member to do it for you rather than spend $185 just so that you can do it yourself.  And you are merely reinforcing my argument against this product by admitting that you frequently rely on its audible signal strength indicator to continually readjust the antenna for optimum reception.  You may not find this to be much of a problem, but for most consumers, fiddling all the time  with the antenna would be a major nuisance.
 
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 4:21 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
It isn't a one time procedure if a television station in your area changes its frequency or if new stations begin broadcasting over time.  It is not a one time procedure if you move or if, through some circumstances that may be unexpected, the television loses its information. 
 
You are really overgeneralizing from almost no experience.  You are stating overgeneralized conclusions as though they are generally applicable with no evidence that they are.  If this was the kind of wide spread behavior you believe it is, then why didn't I see any discussion of this during the transition period when places like AFB were publishing articles about the transition and what you should know. 
 
If the only reason to use the radio was to avoid scanning, then for someone who reasonably easily has help available, they might want to use a television or converter box.  But the signal strength indicator is a feature I consider very important and that when combined with the convenience and independence of being able to scan when I want in case I want to check for new stations or if a station changes its frequency, make the radio well worth the price in my opinion. 
 
You argue against specialized blindness appliances such as microwaves and there are good arguments not to use some or perhaps many such specialized products.  But you are overgeneralizing and applying your arguments to an appliance where they are not valid. 
A digital TV radio is used differently and the user has to contend with different circumstances than when using a microwave. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 3:06 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
 
The Zenith digital converter box I purchased from Radio Shack in 2009 to use with my analog TV automatically scanned for receivable signals as soon as it was plugged in and connected to an antenna.  There was no need to access the onscreen menus to do this.  But because the box could not receive satisfactory reception, I never used it, and so continue to rely on cable TV.  I checked the instruction manual for my Samsung digital TV, and it,, too, will automatically scan for available channels as soon as it is plugged in.  It is possible that some TV’s require activating an option from the onscreen menu to accomplish this, but this is a one-time procedure.
 
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 3:38 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
What are you basing your information on?  I have never heard that before nor was it true when I purchased a converter box.  I got my radio a while after I had the converter box and it uses standard components used to receive digital television signals and it won't do so either.  I doubt that any digital over air television or converter box scans automatically when plugged in. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 1:59 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
 
All digital TV’s automatically scan for receivable channels as soon as you plug them in.  This is a one-time procedure that does not need to be repeated unless the TV is moved to a different location.  Even an audible signal strength indicator is of dubious value because with digital TB, it’s all or nothing; there is no such thing as a weak signal as there was with analog TV.  You either get perfect sound and picture or nothing at all.  So if you tune to a channel and hear no sound, it means that the signal is too weak to be received by the antenna, and so it needs to be reoriented.  But this brings up the biggest problem with digital TV in the first place.  Every time you change channels, you usually have to reorient the antenna to get a receivable signal, if you can even get one at all.  This can be a real nuisance, and is the main reason why most cable TV customers are reluctant to “”cut the cord”.  In the old days of analog TV, many consumers installed elaborate rooftop antennas with rotators to optimize reception.  In most large cities, this is no longer possible because most apartment building owners now prohibit the installation of rooftop antennas.  So if you cannot get decent reception with an indoor antenna,you’re out of luck, and no amount of antenna tweaking will make muchdifference, which is just what the cable companies want. 
 
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 1:57 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
I don't have a digital television.  I don't know if any of them have speech or what that speech allows you to do.  The radio does two important things that televisions well may not do and I really don't think a cheap lowest of the line television would. 
 
The radio lets you scan for stations independently.  You don't have to see a menu in order to scan or get sighted help to learn an inaccessible sequence.  You have to scan with every new digital television so it can find stations in your area and allow you to get to them by entering the correct channel number.  The radio is designed to allow completely independent scanning.
 
The signal strength indicator is a valuable feature.  There are some stations that come in poorly when your antenna is in a certain position and others that come in well.  By checking the strength indicator when you are on a station you want to watch, you can see if you can improve reception by trying different antenna positions.  There is no other good way to find the strongest signal for a wide variety of stations.  I'm sure sighted people have some sort of indicator.  When dealing with digital signals, a blind person has no way of determining the best signal aside from an audio indicator other than by a trial and error system seeing if this or that station has signal interruptions and playing with the antenna to try to prevent them. 
 
Unless there are televisions that have these features, and I doubt there are, the radio will remain for me a much preferred method of reception. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 12:25 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
 
Again, what advantage does a $185 custom-built TV radio offer over a standard $80 digirtal TV?  None that I can see.  The fact that some guy personally builds these gadgets himself in his basement still does not justify its high cost.  Can this TV radio be operated without the remote?  If not, what are you supposed to do if you lose or break the remote?  And what recourse do you have if the TV radio itself craps out?  Bring it to a local electronics repair shop?  I don’t think so.  Oehm Electronics doesn’t even have a web site where you can learn about its products or obtain customer support.  You have to call their long distance phone number and hope that Mr. Oehm isn’t on vacation or else is otherwise unavailable. 
  
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 11:37 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
You don't need speech output.  the manual clearly explains how to perform functions without speech.  And you are overgeneralizing.  Not every higher priced item is a ripoff and circumstances should be considered.  This is not some large company with a large production.  it is a one man operation, building radios in small numbers when ordered or only enough in advance to fill a small number of anticipated orders in advance.  The radios are worth every penny.  You can't necessarily just add speech to something if it is not built in already at little or no cost.  The chip used to operate the radio has no speech ability and it is not necessary. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:59 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 

This "accessible"TV radio seems grossly overpriced for what it offers.
For $185, you should at least expect some level of speech output.
Basically, all this box does is scan over-the -air stations into memory and
provides audible feedback to assist with antenna orientation , and that's
about it.  You still cannot identify which channel you are tuned to, and it
offers no advantage if you use a cable box.  I realize that this is a
custom-made product, but it really isn't that much more accessible than a
small-screen, basic mass-market digital TV that sells for $80 or less.   And
it is totally useless for other sighted family members in your household
because it lacks a screen.  Too bad OEHM Electronics does not offer a small,
Walkman-style TV radio, which would certainly have more widespread consumer
appeal.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Giovanelli
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:21 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

Hello,

It is certainly true that voice guidance in TV sets is helpful, but there is
another option.

There is a radio especially designed to guide blind people in locating and
listening to TV on-the-air programs. This DTV radio is made by Oehm
Electronics and costs $185. It is menu or command driven. One neat feature
is the ability to tell the user how strong a signal is. This is useful when
orienting the antenna. If the received signal falls below a critical level,
the user will know that the reception of that station will be marginal at
best.

This radio does not read what's on the air program information.

It seems to me to be a viable alternative to more expensive TV solutions.

Joe Giovanelli, W2PVY

 




--
They Ask Me If I'm Happy; I say Yes.
They ask: "How Happy are You?"
I Say: "I'm as happy as a stow away chimpanzee on a banana boat!"


Pamela Dominguez
 

Yes.  When he was saying that, I was thinking:  “How did we get along with radios and stuff before?  When we had regular radios, or TV./radios, there was no speech saying what station we were on.  The cable boxes and modern TV.s need things to talk because there are so many other things that can be done with them, so we need a spoken display.  Pam.
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 11:37 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
You don't need speech output.  the manual clearly explains how to perform functions without speech.  And you are overgeneralizing.  Not every higher priced item is a ripoff and circumstances should be considered.  This is not some large company with a large production.  it is a one man operation, building radios in small numbers when ordered or only enough in advance to fill a small number of anticipated orders in advance.  The radios are worth every penny.  You can't necessarily just add speech to something if it is not built in already at little or no cost.  The chip used to operate the radio has no speech ability and it is not necessary. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:59 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 

This "accessible"TV radio seems grossly overpriced for what it offers.
For $185, you should at least expect some level of speech output.
Basically, all this box does is scan over-the -air stations into memory and
provides audible feedback to assist with antenna orientation , and that's
about it.  You still cannot identify which channel you are tuned to, and it
offers no advantage if you use a cable box.  I realize that this is a
custom-made product, but it really isn't that much more accessible than a
small-screen, basic mass-market digital TV that sells for $80 or less.   And
it is totally useless for other sighted family members in your household
because it lacks a screen.  Too bad OEHM Electronics does not offer a small,
Walkman-style TV radio, which would certainly have more widespread consumer
appeal.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Giovanelli
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:21 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

Hello,

It is certainly true that voice guidance in TV sets is helpful, but there is
another option.

There is a radio especially designed to guide blind people in locating and
listening to TV on-the-air programs. This DTV radio is made by Oehm
Electronics and costs $185. It is menu or command driven. One neat feature
is the ability to tell the user how strong a signal is. This is useful when
orienting the antenna. If the received signal falls below a critical level,
the user will know that the reception of that station will be marginal at
best.

This radio does not read what's on the air program information.

It seems to me to be a viable alternative to more expensive TV solutions.

Joe Giovanelli, W2PVY

 



No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2016.0.7924 / Virus Database: 4664/13450 - Release Date: 11/21/16


Pamela Dominguez
 

I forgot about the mention of the signal strength indicator when I was saying why did we need the TV/radio to talk?  But what I was referring to was tuning stations.  Pam.
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 4:01 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
you have stated before that you use cable.  Your comments indicate that you have no experience with digital reception and you are misapplying what you know because you don't understand variations in digital reception and there effects.
 
You do benefit significantly with a signal strength indicator.  Digital signals can stop and start repeatedly if they are not being received strongly.  There is a threshold below which you will receive nothing and above that threshold, you will receive the signal and it will be played properly.  If you are receiving a weak signal, play may stop and start repeatedly as it fluctuates over time. 
 
With a signal indicator, I can adjust my antenna position for different stations which are broadcasting from different directions and whose signals may vary significantly with antenna position.  I don't have to experiment with different positions on difficult to receive stations until I find a good one after what may be considerable inconvenience due to disrupted reception.  I can move the antenna around, look for the best position, and get good reception if it is possible from that station at my location. 
 
You appear to assume that a digital television signal is a constant unfluctuating signal.  If you are trying to get a difficult station or are far enough away from them, the strength fluctuates just as the strength of an analog station does.  But with digital television, these fluctuations may be far more disruptive since the signal just stops when it is too weak and plays when it is strong enough.  It is precisely this behavior that makes a signal strength indicator useful.  An analog signal may sound more distorted or have more static when it is weaker or it may be softer.  Moving an antenna can be an effective way of finding a good position from such changes.  With a digital signal, there are no such changes.  Either the station plays or it doesn't and if you have the antenna in a poor position, the station may play for a minute or two or longer, then stop and start again and you may miss enough of a program to matter.  the only way to determine efficiently what is a good antenna position for a marginal or difficult station is to use a signal indicator.  and even stations that come in well and are not marginal or difficult may require very different antenna positions for good reception than other stations in the area. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 1:59 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
 
All digital TV’s automatically scan for receivable channels as soon as you plug them in.  This is a one-time procedure that does not need to be repeated unless the TV is moved to a different location.  Even an audible signal strength indicator is of dubious value because with digital TB, it’s all or nothing; there is no such thing as a weak signal as there was with analog TV.  You either get perfect sound and picture or nothing at all.  So if you tune to a channel and hear no sound, it means that the signal is too weak to be received by the antenna, and so it needs to be reoriented.  But this brings up the biggest problem with digital TV in the first place.  Every time you change channels, you usually have to reorient the antenna to get a receivable signal, if you can even get one at all.  This can be a real nuisance, and is the main reason why most cable TV customers are reluctant to “”cut the cord”.  In the old days of analog TV, many consumers installed elaborate rooftop antennas with rotators to optimize reception.  In most large cities, this is no longer possible because most apartment building owners now prohibit the installation of rooftop antennas.  So if you cannot get decent reception with an indoor antenna,you’re out of luck, and no amount of antenna tweaking will make muchdifference, which is just what the cable companies want. 
 
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 1:57 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
I don't have a digital television.  I don't know if any of them have speech or what that speech allows you to do.  The radio does two important things that televisions well may not do and I really don't think a cheap lowest of the line television would. 
 
The radio lets you scan for stations independently.  You don't have to see a menu in order to scan or get sighted help to learn an inaccessible sequence.  You have to scan with every new digital television so it can find stations in your area and allow you to get to them by entering the correct channel number.  The radio is designed to allow completely independent scanning.
 
The signal strength indicator is a valuable feature.  There are some stations that come in poorly when your antenna is in a certain position and others that come in well.  By checking the strength indicator when you are on a station you want to watch, you can see if you can improve reception by trying different antenna positions.  There is no other good way to find the strongest signal for a wide variety of stations.  I'm sure sighted people have some sort of indicator.  When dealing with digital signals, a blind person has no way of determining the best signal aside from an audio indicator other than by a trial and error system seeing if this or that station has signal interruptions and playing with the antenna to try to prevent them. 
 
Unless there are televisions that have these features, and I doubt there are, the radio will remain for me a much preferred method of reception. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 12:25 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
 
Again, what advantage does a $185 custom-built TV radio offer over a standard $80 digirtal TV?  None that I can see.  The fact that some guy personally builds these gadgets himself in his basement still does not justify its high cost.  Can this TV radio be operated without the remote?  If not, what are you supposed to do if you lose or break the remote?  And what recourse do you have if the TV radio itself craps out?  Bring it to a local electronics repair shop?  I don’t think so.  Oehm Electronics doesn’t even have a web site where you can learn about its products or obtain customer support.  You have to call their long distance phone number and hope that Mr. Oehm isn’t on vacation or else is otherwise unavailable. 
  
Gerald
 
 
 
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 11:37 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 
You don't need speech output.  the manual clearly explains how to perform functions without speech.  And you are overgeneralizing.  Not every higher priced item is a ripoff and circumstances should be considered.  This is not some large company with a large production.  it is a one man operation, building radios in small numbers when ordered or only enough in advance to fill a small number of anticipated orders in advance.  The radios are worth every penny.  You can't necessarily just add speech to something if it is not built in already at little or no cost.  The chip used to operate the radio has no speech ability and it is not necessary. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:59 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea
 

This "accessible"TV radio seems grossly overpriced for what it offers.
For $185, you should at least expect some level of speech output.
Basically, all this box does is scan over-the -air stations into memory and
provides audible feedback to assist with antenna orientation , and that's
about it.  You still cannot identify which channel you are tuned to, and it
offers no advantage if you use a cable box.  I realize that this is a
custom-made product, but it really isn't that much more accessible than a
small-screen, basic mass-market digital TV that sells for $80 or less.   And
it is totally useless for other sighted family members in your household
because it lacks a screen.  Too bad OEHM Electronics does not offer a small,
Walkman-style TV radio, which would certainly have more widespread consumer
appeal.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Giovanelli
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:21 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

Hello,

It is certainly true that voice guidance in TV sets is helpful, but there is
another option.

There is a radio especially designed to guide blind people in locating and
listening to TV on-the-air programs. This DTV radio is made by Oehm
Electronics and costs $185. It is menu or command driven. One neat feature
is the ability to tell the user how strong a signal is. This is useful when
orienting the antenna. If the received signal falls below a critical level,
the user will know that the reception of that station will be marginal at
best.

This radio does not read what's on the air program information.

It seems to me to be a viable alternative to more expensive TV solutions.

Joe Giovanelli, W2PVY

 



No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2016.0.7924 / Virus Database: 4664/13453 - Release Date: 11/21/16


Chris G <jedikent@...>
 

Hi,

The 2016 Samsung TV's have voice guide built in.

When setting up the TV for the first time, it will scan the connected cable for channels. I have Verizon FIoS local, it connects directly to the TV without a cable box or converter connected. I only get over the air channels.
Because of my setup I can scan channels, connect the TV to my wifi, know what channel I'm on as well as read the guide, among other things.

The channels and guide will not talk if you are using a cable or satellite box. the boxes would need to talk in order for the channels and guide to talk.

During first time setup (at least on my TV) you hold the CC button to enable accessibility features. You can set up the TV independent without sight.

also if I have an apple TV, Fire TV etc connected, the TV will tell me when switching to the proper HDMI input.

-------- Original Message --------
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, Nov 21, 2016 3:38 PM EST
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

What are you basing your information on? I have never heard that before
nor was it true when I purchased a converter box. I got my radio a
while after I had the converter box and it uses standard components used
to receive digital television signals and it won't do so either. I
doubt that any digital over air television or converter box scans
automatically when plugged in.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Gerald Levy <mailto:bwaylimited@...>
*Sent:* Monday, November 21, 2016 1:59 PM
*To:* main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea


All digital TV’s automatically scan for receivable channels as soon as
you plug them in. This is a one-time procedure that does not need to be
repeated unless the TV is moved to a different location. Even an
audible signal strength indicator is of dubious value because with
digital TB, it’s all or nothing; there is no such thing as a weak signal
as there was with analog TV. You either get perfect sound and picture
or nothing at all. So if you tune to a channel and hear no sound, it
means that the signal is too weak to be received by the antenna, and so
it needs to be reoriented. But this brings up the biggest problem with
digital TV in the first place. Every time you change channels, you
usually have to reorient the antenna to get a receivable signal, if you
can even get one at all. This can be a real nuisance, and is the main
reason why most cable TV customers are reluctant to “”cut the cord”. In
the old days of analog TV, many consumers installed elaborate rooftop
antennas with rotators to optimize reception. In most large cities,
this is no longer possible because most apartment building owners now
prohibit the installation of rooftop antennas. So if you cannot get
decent reception with an indoor antenna,you’re out of luck, and no
amount of antenna tweaking will make muchdifference, which is just what
the cable companies want.

Gerald



*From:* Gene <mailto:gsasner@...>
*Sent:* Monday, November 21, 2016 1:57 PM
*To:* main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

I don't have a digital television. I don't know if any of them have
speech or what that speech allows you to do. The radio does two
important things that televisions well may not do and I really don't
think a cheap lowest of the line television would.

The radio lets you scan for stations independently. You don't have to
see a menu in order to scan or get sighted help to learn an inaccessible
sequence. You have to scan with every new digital television so it can
find stations in your area and allow you to get to them by entering the
correct channel number. The radio is designed to allow completely
independent scanning.

The signal strength indicator is a valuable feature. There are some
stations that come in poorly when your antenna is in a certain position
and others that come in well. By checking the strength indicator when
you are on a station you want to watch, you can see if you can improve
reception by trying different antenna positions. There is no other good
way to find the strongest signal for a wide variety of stations. I'm
sure sighted people have some sort of indicator. When dealing with
digital signals, a blind person has no way of determining the best
signal aside from an audio indicator other than by a trial and error
system seeing if this or that station has signal interruptions and
playing with the antenna to try to prevent them.

Unless there are televisions that have these features, and I doubt there
are, the radio will remain for me a much preferred method of reception.

Gene
*----- Original Message -----*
*From:* Gerald Levy <mailto:bwaylimited@...>
*Sent:* Monday, November 21, 2016 12:25 PM
*To:* main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea


Again, what advantage does a $185 custom-built TV radio offer over a
standard $80 digirtal TV? None that I can see. The fact that some guy
personally builds these gadgets himself in his basement still does not
justify its high cost. Can this TV radio be operated without the
remote? If not, what are you supposed to do if you lose or break the
remote? And what recourse do you have if the TV radio itself craps
out? Bring it to a local electronics repair shop? I don’t think so.
Oehm Electronics doesn’t even have a web site where you can learn about
its products or obtain customer support. You have to call their long
distance phone number and hope that Mr. Oehm isn’t on vacation or else
is otherwise unavailable.

Gerald



*From:* Gene <mailto:gsasner@...>
*Sent:* Monday, November 21, 2016 11:37 AM
*To:* main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

You don't need speech output. the manual clearly explains how to
perform functions without speech. And you are overgeneralizing. Not
every higher priced item is a ripoff and circumstances should be
considered. This is not some large company with a large production. it
is a one man operation, building radios in small numbers when ordered or
only enough in advance to fill a small number of anticipated orders in
advance. The radios are worth every penny. You can't necessarily just
add speech to something if it is not built in already at little or no
cost. The chip used to operate the radio has no speech ability and it
is not necessary.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Gerald Levy <mailto:bwaylimited@...>
*Sent:* Monday, November 21, 2016 9:59 AM
*To:* main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea


This "accessible"TV radio seems grossly overpriced for what it offers.
For $185, you should at least expect some level of speech output.
Basically, all this box does is scan over-the -air stations into memory and
provides audible feedback to assist with antenna orientation , and that's
about it. You still cannot identify which channel you are tuned to, and it
offers no advantage if you use a cable box. I realize that this is a
custom-made product, but it really isn't that much more accessible than a
small-screen, basic mass-market digital TV that sells for $80 or less.
And
it is totally useless for other sighted family members in your household
because it lacks a screen. Too bad OEHM Electronics does not offer a
small,
Walkman-style TV radio, which would certainly have more widespread consumer
appeal.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Giovanelli
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:21 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Subject: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

Hello,

It is certainly true that voice guidance in TV sets is helpful, but
there is
another option.

There is a radio especially designed to guide blind people in locating and
listening to TV on-the-air programs. This DTV radio is made by Oehm
Electronics and costs $185. It is menu or command driven. One neat feature
is the ability to tell the user how strong a signal is. This is useful when
orienting the antenna. If the received signal falls below a critical level,
the user will know that the reception of that station will be marginal at
best.

This radio does not read what's on the air program information.

It seems to me to be a viable alternative to more expensive TV solutions.

Joe Giovanelli, W2PVY


 

can you tell me the cheapest tv that would have the talking feature?

from samsung?
thanks
Hank

On 11/23/2016 7:52 PM, Chris G wrote:
Hi,

The 2016 Samsung TV's have voice guide built in.

When setting up the TV for the first time, it will scan the connected cable for channels. I have Verizon FIoS local, it connects directly to the TV without a cable box or converter connected. I only get over the air channels.
Because of my setup I can scan channels, connect the TV to my wifi, know what channel I'm on as well as read the guide, among other things.

The channels and guide will not talk if you are using a cable or satellite box. the boxes would need to talk in order for the channels and guide to talk.

During first time setup (at least on my TV) you hold the CC button to enable accessibility features. You can set up the TV independent without sight.

also if I have an apple TV, Fire TV etc connected, the TV will tell me when switching to the proper HDMI input.

-------- Original Message --------
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, Nov 21, 2016 3:38 PM EST
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

What are you basing your information on? I have never heard that before
nor was it true when I purchased a converter box. I got my radio a
while after I had the converter box and it uses standard components used
to receive digital television signals and it won't do so either. I
doubt that any digital over air television or converter box scans
automatically when plugged in.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Gerald Levy <mailto:bwaylimited@...>
*Sent:* Monday, November 21, 2016 1:59 PM
*To:* main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea


All digital TV’s automatically scan for receivable channels as soon as
you plug them in. This is a one-time procedure that does not need to be
repeated unless the TV is moved to a different location. Even an
audible signal strength indicator is of dubious value because with
digital TB, it’s all or nothing; there is no such thing as a weak signal
as there was with analog TV. You either get perfect sound and picture
or nothing at all. So if you tune to a channel and hear no sound, it
means that the signal is too weak to be received by the antenna, and so
it needs to be reoriented. But this brings up the biggest problem with
digital TV in the first place. Every time you change channels, you
usually have to reorient the antenna to get a receivable signal, if you
can even get one at all. This can be a real nuisance, and is the main
reason why most cable TV customers are reluctant to “”cut the cord”. In
the old days of analog TV, many consumers installed elaborate rooftop
antennas with rotators to optimize reception. In most large cities,
this is no longer possible because most apartment building owners now
prohibit the installation of rooftop antennas. So if you cannot get
decent reception with an indoor antenna,you’re out of luck, and no
amount of antenna tweaking will make muchdifference, which is just what
the cable companies want.

Gerald



*From:* Gene <mailto:gsasner@...>
*Sent:* Monday, November 21, 2016 1:57 PM
*To:* main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

I don't have a digital television. I don't know if any of them have
speech or what that speech allows you to do. The radio does two
important things that televisions well may not do and I really don't
think a cheap lowest of the line television would.

The radio lets you scan for stations independently. You don't have to
see a menu in order to scan or get sighted help to learn an inaccessible
sequence. You have to scan with every new digital television so it can
find stations in your area and allow you to get to them by entering the
correct channel number. The radio is designed to allow completely
independent scanning.

The signal strength indicator is a valuable feature. There are some
stations that come in poorly when your antenna is in a certain position
and others that come in well. By checking the strength indicator when
you are on a station you want to watch, you can see if you can improve
reception by trying different antenna positions. There is no other good
way to find the strongest signal for a wide variety of stations. I'm
sure sighted people have some sort of indicator. When dealing with
digital signals, a blind person has no way of determining the best
signal aside from an audio indicator other than by a trial and error
system seeing if this or that station has signal interruptions and
playing with the antenna to try to prevent them.

Unless there are televisions that have these features, and I doubt there
are, the radio will remain for me a much preferred method of reception.

Gene
*----- Original Message -----*
*From:* Gerald Levy <mailto:bwaylimited@...>
*Sent:* Monday, November 21, 2016 12:25 PM
*To:* main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea


Again, what advantage does a $185 custom-built TV radio offer over a
standard $80 digirtal TV? None that I can see. The fact that some guy
personally builds these gadgets himself in his basement still does not
justify its high cost. Can this TV radio be operated without the
remote? If not, what are you supposed to do if you lose or break the
remote? And what recourse do you have if the TV radio itself craps
out? Bring it to a local electronics repair shop? I don’t think so.
Oehm Electronics doesn’t even have a web site where you can learn about
its products or obtain customer support. You have to call their long
distance phone number and hope that Mr. Oehm isn’t on vacation or else
is otherwise unavailable.

Gerald



*From:* Gene <mailto:gsasner@...>
*Sent:* Monday, November 21, 2016 11:37 AM
*To:* main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

You don't need speech output. the manual clearly explains how to
perform functions without speech. And you are overgeneralizing. Not
every higher priced item is a ripoff and circumstances should be
considered. This is not some large company with a large production. it
is a one man operation, building radios in small numbers when ordered or
only enough in advance to fill a small number of anticipated orders in
advance. The radios are worth every penny. You can't necessarily just
add speech to something if it is not built in already at little or no
cost. The chip used to operate the radio has no speech ability and it
is not necessary.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Gerald Levy <mailto:bwaylimited@...>
*Sent:* Monday, November 21, 2016 9:59 AM
*To:* main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea


This "accessible"TV radio seems grossly overpriced for what it offers.
For $185, you should at least expect some level of speech output.
Basically, all this box does is scan over-the -air stations into memory and
provides audible feedback to assist with antenna orientation , and that's
about it. You still cannot identify which channel you are tuned to, and it
offers no advantage if you use a cable box. I realize that this is a
custom-made product, but it really isn't that much more accessible than a
small-screen, basic mass-market digital TV that sells for $80 or less.
And
it is totally useless for other sighted family members in your household
because it lacks a screen. Too bad OEHM Electronics does not offer a
small,
Walkman-style TV radio, which would certainly have more widespread consumer
appeal.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Giovanelli
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:21 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Subject: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

Hello,

It is certainly true that voice guidance in TV sets is helpful, but
there is
another option.

There is a radio especially designed to guide blind people in locating and
listening to TV on-the-air programs. This DTV radio is made by Oehm
Electronics and costs $185. It is menu or command driven. One neat feature
is the ability to tell the user how strong a signal is. This is useful when
orienting the antenna. If the received signal falls below a critical level,
the user will know that the reception of that station will be marginal at
best.

This radio does not read what's on the air program information.

It seems to me to be a viable alternative to more expensive TV solutions.

Joe Giovanelli, W2PVY









Mich Verrier
 

hi I to would like to know this as well and also if any of these tv's are sold in canada? from mich.

-----Original Message-----
From: The Wolf
Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2016 10:38 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

can you tell me the cheapest tv that would have the talking feature?

from samsung?
thanks
Hank

On 11/23/2016 7:52 PM, Chris G wrote:
Hi,

The 2016 Samsung TV's have voice guide built in.

When setting up the TV for the first time, it will scan the connected cable for channels. I have Verizon FIoS local, it connects directly to the TV without a cable box or converter connected. I only get over the air channels.
Because of my setup I can scan channels, connect the TV to my wifi, know what channel I'm on as well as read the guide, among other things.

The channels and guide will not talk if you are using a cable or satellite box. the boxes would need to talk in order for the channels and guide to talk.

During first time setup (at least on my TV) you hold the CC button to enable accessibility features. You can set up the TV independent without sight.

also if I have an apple TV, Fire TV etc connected, the TV will tell me when switching to the proper HDMI input.

-------- Original Message --------
From: Gene
Sent: Monday, Nov 21, 2016 3:38 PM EST
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

What are you basing your information on? I have never heard that before
nor was it true when I purchased a converter box. I got my radio a
while after I had the converter box and it uses standard components used
to receive digital television signals and it won't do so either. I
doubt that any digital over air television or converter box scans
automatically when plugged in.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Gerald Levy <mailto:bwaylimited@...>
*Sent:* Monday, November 21, 2016 1:59 PM
*To:* main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea


All digital TV’s automatically scan for receivable channels as soon as
you plug them in. This is a one-time procedure that does not need to be
repeated unless the TV is moved to a different location. Even an
audible signal strength indicator is of dubious value because with
digital TB, it’s all or nothing; there is no such thing as a weak signal
as there was with analog TV. You either get perfect sound and picture
or nothing at all. So if you tune to a channel and hear no sound, it
means that the signal is too weak to be received by the antenna, and so
it needs to be reoriented. But this brings up the biggest problem with
digital TV in the first place. Every time you change channels, you
usually have to reorient the antenna to get a receivable signal, if you
can even get one at all. This can be a real nuisance, and is the main
reason why most cable TV customers are reluctant to “”cut the cord”. In
the old days of analog TV, many consumers installed elaborate rooftop
antennas with rotators to optimize reception. In most large cities,
this is no longer possible because most apartment building owners now
prohibit the installation of rooftop antennas. So if you cannot get
decent reception with an indoor antenna,you’re out of luck, and no
amount of antenna tweaking will make muchdifference, which is just what
the cable companies want.

Gerald



*From:* Gene <mailto:gsasner@...>
*Sent:* Monday, November 21, 2016 1:57 PM
*To:* main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

I don't have a digital television. I don't know if any of them have
speech or what that speech allows you to do. The radio does two
important things that televisions well may not do and I really don't
think a cheap lowest of the line television would.

The radio lets you scan for stations independently. You don't have to
see a menu in order to scan or get sighted help to learn an inaccessible
sequence. You have to scan with every new digital television so it can
find stations in your area and allow you to get to them by entering the
correct channel number. The radio is designed to allow completely
independent scanning.

The signal strength indicator is a valuable feature. There are some
stations that come in poorly when your antenna is in a certain position
and others that come in well. By checking the strength indicator when
you are on a station you want to watch, you can see if you can improve
reception by trying different antenna positions. There is no other good
way to find the strongest signal for a wide variety of stations. I'm
sure sighted people have some sort of indicator. When dealing with
digital signals, a blind person has no way of determining the best
signal aside from an audio indicator other than by a trial and error
system seeing if this or that station has signal interruptions and
playing with the antenna to try to prevent them.

Unless there are televisions that have these features, and I doubt there
are, the radio will remain for me a much preferred method of reception.

Gene
*----- Original Message -----*
*From:* Gerald Levy <mailto:bwaylimited@...>
*Sent:* Monday, November 21, 2016 12:25 PM
*To:* main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea


Again, what advantage does a $185 custom-built TV radio offer over a
standard $80 digirtal TV? None that I can see. The fact that some guy
personally builds these gadgets himself in his basement still does not
justify its high cost. Can this TV radio be operated without the
remote? If not, what are you supposed to do if you lose or break the
remote? And what recourse do you have if the TV radio itself craps
out? Bring it to a local electronics repair shop? I don’t think so.
Oehm Electronics doesn’t even have a web site where you can learn about
its products or obtain customer support. You have to call their long
distance phone number and hope that Mr. Oehm isn’t on vacation or else
is otherwise unavailable.

Gerald



*From:* Gene <mailto:gsasner@...>
*Sent:* Monday, November 21, 2016 11:37 AM
*To:* main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

You don't need speech output. the manual clearly explains how to
perform functions without speech. And you are overgeneralizing. Not
every higher priced item is a ripoff and circumstances should be
considered. This is not some large company with a large production. it
is a one man operation, building radios in small numbers when ordered or
only enough in advance to fill a small number of anticipated orders in
advance. The radios are worth every penny. You can't necessarily just
add speech to something if it is not built in already at little or no
cost. The chip used to operate the radio has no speech ability and it
is not necessary.

Gene
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Gerald Levy <mailto:bwaylimited@...>
*Sent:* Monday, November 21, 2016 9:59 AM
*To:* main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
*Subject:* Re: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea


This "accessible"TV radio seems grossly overpriced for what it offers.
For $185, you should at least expect some level of speech output.
Basically, all this box does is scan over-the -air stations into memory and
provides audible feedback to assist with antenna orientation , and that's
about it. You still cannot identify which channel you are tuned to, and it
offers no advantage if you use a cable box. I realize that this is a
custom-made product, but it really isn't that much more accessible than a
small-screen, basic mass-market digital TV that sells for $80 or less.
And
it is totally useless for other sighted family members in your household
because it lacks a screen. Too bad OEHM Electronics does not offer a
small,
Walkman-style TV radio, which would certainly have more widespread consumer
appeal.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Giovanelli
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:21 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Subject: [TechTalk] talking tv sets, a different idea

Hello,

It is certainly true that voice guidance in TV sets is helpful, but
there is
another option.

There is a radio especially designed to guide blind people in locating and
listening to TV on-the-air programs. This DTV radio is made by Oehm
Electronics and costs $185. It is menu or command driven. One neat feature
is the ability to tell the user how strong a signal is. This is useful when
orienting the antenna. If the received signal falls below a critical level,
the user will know that the reception of that station will be marginal at
best.

This radio does not read what's on the air program information.

It seems to me to be a viable alternative to more expensive TV solutions.

Joe Giovanelli, W2PVY