preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??


Mary Otten <maryotten@...>
 

Hi all,


I have come from a Windows xp machine using a very old email client, and I have also used the Mac native email client in its classic view. Both of these have the distinction of being able to use a single keystroke to get to a preview pane where you can read much of, and sometimes all of, an email message, without having to open the message and start a say all, then close the message and delete it. I find the preview pane to be a more efficient means of dealing with a lot of email. I have both Outlook from Office 16, which I haven't even looked at yet, because I figure it is seriously complicated, and Thunderbird, latest release version. Is there a way in either of these clients to have them open with focus either in the inbox, or at least on the folder preview of available boxes for a given account, then let you get into the inbox and have a preview pane available with one press of the tab key? Also, in T-bird, it always opens to the tool bar with the inbox tab selected. I would prefer that it open with the inbox tree view in focus, not that useless tab. More wasted keystrokes. Is there a way to make this happen?\


Mary


Gene
 

Here is a rather long message where I discuss various aspects of e-mail programs you may not know about.  It may help you decide which program you want to use.
 
It's unfortunate that in implementing accessibility for Thunderbird, such conveniences haven't been added.  Also, if you are annoyed, as a lot of blind people and many sighted people are as well, by the subject line being shown first in message headers in Thunderbird, you can change     this but it isn't accessible using program commands from the keyboard.  It requires use of drag and drop.  Others can explain how you do this with whatever screen-reader you are using.  Ask if you want to know.  It's little annoyances like this, which go uncorrected and unaddressed for years, that is one reason I don't use thunderbird.  I use Windows Live Mail, which shows the from line first, and which allows adjustment of all these things from the keyboard.  it also allows you to jump to the inbox with one shortcut command from wherever you are in the program.  But recently, Thunderbird has generally passed Windows Live Mail in moving among folders.  there is an add on that lets you use first letter navigation in folders.  This didn't used to be available in either Windows Live Mail or thunderbird.  So it depends on which inconveniences you want.  I don't use thunderbird, but I know something about it.  I believe you can get to the message list much faster if you use f6 after opening the prohgram. 
 
As for Outlook, if you have some specific reason to use it, that's fine but I see more complaints about it than about any of the other popular Windows programs discussed here, that is Windows Live Mail, the Windows 10 e-mail app and Thunderbird. 
 
If you use message rules, I should point out that both Outlook and Thunderbird support establishing message rules in the program itself, rather than having to do it on the server if you use IMAP.  This may or may not matter to you.  Outlook also allows you to set rules in the program with IMAP.  Windows Live Mail doesn't.  I don't know this but I would think that if you use this feature, it only applies to Outlook or Thunderbird and doesn't cause message rules to be applied in any other device you are using.  So you may have to set them on the server anyway.
 
Gene
----- )Original Message -----

From: Mary Otten
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 8:12 AM
Subject: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi all,


I have come from a Windows xp machine using a very old email client, and
I have also used the Mac native email client in its classic view. Both
of these have the distinction of being able to use a single keystroke to
get to a preview pane where you can read much of, and sometimes all of,
an email message, without having to open the message and start a say
all, then close the message and delete it. I find the preview pane to be
a more efficient means of dealing with a lot of email. I have both
Outlook from Office 16, which I haven't even looked at yet, because I
figure it is seriously complicated, and Thunderbird, latest release
version. Is there a way in either of these clients to have them open
with focus either in the inbox, or at least on the folder preview of
available boxes for a given account, then let you get into the inbox and
have a preview pane available with one press of the tab key? Also, in
T-bird, it always opens to the tool bar with the inbox tab selected. I
would prefer that it open with the inbox tree view in focus, not that
useless tab. More wasted keystrokes. Is there a way to make this happen?\


Mary




Mary Otten <maryotten@...>
 

Thanks, Gene,


I started out on this machine with the native windows 10 email app, since I understood that Windows live mail was kind of fading out or wasn't available for Win 10. I didn't like the native app because of all the crazy tab, tab, tabbing I had to do. I did look through David Moore's tutorial on that subject. I guess it is a simple enough app, but I wanted something a bit more robust, so I got T-bird. I do like the fact that T-bird lets you set message rules, although I haven't done it yet, because I'm not settled on it as my final destination as an email client. I do like t-bird better with NVDA than with JAWS, because it doesn't read the subject line once you open a message and start a say all. And I'm ok with subject first when email is being scrolled through, but I agree that it should be user adjustable. If I'm wrong about WLM and win 10, feel free to set me straight, and I'll try to find install and check it out.


Mary


On 12/1/2017 6:31 AM, Gene wrote:
Here is a rather long message where I discuss various aspects of e-mail programs you may not know about.  It may help you decide which program you want to use.
 
It's unfortunate that in implementing accessibility for Thunderbird, such conveniences haven't been added.  Also, if you are annoyed, as a lot of blind people and many sighted people are as well, by the subject line being shown first in message headers in Thunderbird, you can change     this but it isn't accessible using program commands from the keyboard.  It requires use of drag and drop.  Others can explain how you do this with whatever screen-reader you are using.  Ask if you want to know.  It's little annoyances like this, which go uncorrected and unaddressed for years, that is one reason I don't use thunderbird.  I use Windows Live Mail, which shows the from line first, and which allows adjustment of all these things from the keyboard.  it also allows you to jump to the inbox with one shortcut command from wherever you are in the program.  But recently, Thunderbird has generally passed Windows Live Mail in moving among folders.  there is an add on that lets you use first letter navigation in folders.  This didn't used to be available in either Windows Live Mail or thunderbird.  So it depends on which inconveniences you want.  I don't use thunderbird, but I know something about it.  I believe you can get to the message list much faster if you use f6 after opening the prohgram. 
 
As for Outlook, if you have some specific reason to use it, that's fine but I see more complaints about it than about any of the other popular Windows programs discussed here, that is Windows Live Mail, the Windows 10 e-mail app and Thunderbird. 
 
If you use message rules, I should point out that both Outlook and Thunderbird support establishing message rules in the program itself, rather than having to do it on the server if you use IMAP.  This may or may not matter to you.  Outlook also allows you to set rules in the program with IMAP.  Windows Live Mail doesn't.  I don't know this but I would think that if you use this feature, it only applies to Outlook or Thunderbird and doesn't cause message rules to be applied in any other device you are using.  So you may have to set them on the server anyway.
 
Gene
----- )Original Message -----
From: Mary Otten
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 8:12 AM
Subject: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi all,


I have come from a Windows xp machine using a very old email client, and
I have also used the Mac native email client in its classic view. Both
of these have the distinction of being able to use a single keystroke to
get to a preview pane where you can read much of, and sometimes all of,
an email message, without having to open the message and start a say
all, then close the message and delete it. I find the preview pane to be
a more efficient means of dealing with a lot of email. I have both
Outlook from Office 16, which I haven't even looked at yet, because I
figure it is seriously complicated, and Thunderbird, latest release
version. Is there a way in either of these clients to have them open
with focus either in the inbox, or at least on the folder preview of
available boxes for a given account, then let you get into the inbox and
have a preview pane available with one press of the tab key? Also, in
T-bird, it always opens to the tool bar with the inbox tab selected. I
would prefer that it open with the inbox tree view in focus, not that
useless tab. More wasted keystrokes. Is there a way to make this happen?\


Mary





Gene
 

I don’t have Windows 10 but my impression from user comments is that it works well in Windows 10, but there may be a quirk.  When writing a message, at least some people evidently have to leave and return to the message to be able to read what they have written.  This can be very quickly and easily done by pressing alt twice.
 
As far as an installer is concerned, other list members may know where to direct you.  I believe I have the installer in my Drop Box account and I should be able to send it to you.  If you don't hear anything in a reasonable time, I'll send it. 
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
From: Mary Otten
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 9:56 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Thanks, Gene,


I started out on this machine with the native windows 10 email app, since I understood that Windows live mail was kind of fading out or wasn't available for Win 10. I didn't like the native app because of all the crazy tab, tab, tabbing I had to do. I did look through David Moore's tutorial on that subject. I guess it is a simple enough app, but I wanted something a bit more robust, so I got T-bird. I do like the fact that T-bird lets you set message rules, although I haven't done it yet, because I'm not settled on it as my final destination as an email client. I do like t-bird better with NVDA than with JAWS, because it doesn't read the subject line once you open a message and start a say all. And I'm ok with subject first when email is being scrolled through, but I agree that it should be user adjustable. If I'm wrong about WLM and win 10, feel free to set me straight, and I'll try to find install and check it out.


Mary


On 12/1/2017 6:31 AM, Gene wrote:
Here is a rather long message where I discuss various aspects of e-mail programs you may not know about.  It may help you decide which program you want to use.
 
It's unfortunate that in implementing accessibility for Thunderbird, such conveniences haven't been added.  Also, if you are annoyed, as a lot of blind people and many sighted people are as well, by the subject line being shown first in message headers in Thunderbird, you can change     this but it isn't accessible using program commands from the keyboard.  It requires use of drag and drop.  Others can explain how you do this with whatever screen-reader you are using.  Ask if you want to know.  It's little annoyances like this, which go uncorrected and unaddressed for years, that is one reason I don't use thunderbird.  I use Windows Live Mail, which shows the from line first, and which allows adjustment of all these things from the keyboard.  it also allows you to jump to the inbox with one shortcut command from wherever you are in the program.  But recently, Thunderbird has generally passed Windows Live Mail in moving among folders.  there is an add on that lets you use first letter navigation in folders.  This didn't used to be available in either Windows Live Mail or thunderbird.  So it depends on which inconveniences you want.  I don't use thunderbird, but I know something about it.  I believe you can get to the message list much faster if you use f6 after opening the prohgram. 
 
As for Outlook, if you have some specific reason to use it, that's fine but I see more complaints about it than about any of the other popular Windows programs discussed here, that is Windows Live Mail, the Windows 10 e-mail app and Thunderbird. 
 
If you use message rules, I should point out that both Outlook and Thunderbird support establishing message rules in the program itself, rather than having to do it on the server if you use IMAP.  This may or may not matter to you.  Outlook also allows you to set rules in the program with IMAP.  Windows Live Mail doesn't.  I don't know this but I would think that if you use this feature, it only applies to Outlook or Thunderbird and doesn't cause message rules to be applied in any other device you are using.  So you may have to set them on the server anyway.
 
Gene
----- )Original Message -----
From: Mary Otten
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 8:12 AM
Subject: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi all,


I have come from a Windows xp machine using a very old email client, and
I have also used the Mac native email client in its classic view. Both
of these have the distinction of being able to use a single keystroke to
get to a preview pane where you can read much of, and sometimes all of,
an email message, without having to open the message and start a say
all, then close the message and delete it. I find the preview pane to be
a more efficient means of dealing with a lot of email. I have both
Outlook from Office 16, which I haven't even looked at yet, because I
figure it is seriously complicated, and Thunderbird, latest release
version. Is there a way in either of these clients to have them open
with focus either in the inbox, or at least on the folder preview of
available boxes for a given account, then let you get into the inbox and
have a preview pane available with one press of the tab key? Also, in
T-bird, it always opens to the tool bar with the inbox tab selected. I
would prefer that it open with the inbox tree view in focus, not that
useless tab. More wasted keystrokes. Is there a way to make this happen?\


Mary





Vicky Vaughan
 

Hi Gene, I am using Outlook 2016 with Jaws 2018 on a 64 bit Win 10 computer.

 

Is the message header list, the preview pain?

 

What exactly do I need to do make the messages easier to read?

 

Is there any way to delete the message without having to close it first?

 

Many and sincere Thanks!

 

Vicky

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, December 1, 2017 11:12 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

 

I don’t have Windows 10 but my impression from user comments is that it works well in Windows 10, but there may be a quirk.  When writing a message, at least some people evidently have to leave and return to the message to be able to read what they have written.  This can be very quickly and easily done by pressing alt twice.

 

As far as an installer is concerned, other list members may know where to direct you.  I believe I have the installer in my Drop Box account and I should be able to send it to you.  If you don't hear anything in a reasonable time, I'll send it. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Mary Otten

Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 9:56 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

 

Thanks, Gene,

 

I started out on this machine with the native windows 10 email app, since I understood that Windows live mail was kind of fading out or wasn't available for Win 10. I didn't like the native app because of all the crazy tab, tab, tabbing I had to do. I did look through David Moore's tutorial on that subject. I guess it is a simple enough app, but I wanted something a bit more robust, so I got T-bird. I do like the fact that T-bird lets you set message rules, although I haven't done it yet, because I'm not settled on it as my final destination as an email client. I do like t-bird better with NVDA than with JAWS, because it doesn't read the subject line once you open a message and start a say all. And I'm ok with subject first when email is being scrolled through, but I agree that it should be user adjustable. If I'm wrong about WLM and win 10, feel free to set me straight, and I'll try to find install and check it out.

 

Mary

 

On 12/1/2017 6:31 AM, Gene wrote:

Here is a rather long message where I discuss various aspects of e-mail programs you may not know about.  It may help you decide which program you want to use.

 

It's unfortunate that in implementing accessibility for Thunderbird, such conveniences haven't been added.  Also, if you are annoyed, as a lot of blind people and many sighted people are as well, by the subject line being shown first in message headers in Thunderbird, you can change     this but it isn't accessible using program commands from the keyboard.  It requires use of drag and drop.  Others can explain how you do this with whatever screen-reader you are using.  Ask if you want to know.  It's little annoyances like this, which go uncorrected and unaddressed for years, that is one reason I don't use thunderbird.  I use Windows Live Mail, which shows the from line first, and which allows adjustment of all these things from the keyboard.  it also allows you to jump to the inbox with one shortcut command from wherever you are in the program.  But recently, Thunderbird has generally passed Windows Live Mail in moving among folders.  there is an add on that lets you use first letter navigation in folders.  This didn't used to be available in either Windows Live Mail or thunderbird.  So it depends on which inconveniences you want.  I don't use thunderbird, but I know something about it.  I believe you can get to the message list much faster if you use f6 after opening the prohgram. 

 

As for Outlook, if you have some specific reason to use it, that's fine but I see more complaints about it than about any of the other popular Windows programs discussed here, that is Windows Live Mail, the Windows 10 e-mail app and Thunderbird. 

 

If you use message rules, I should point out that both Outlook and Thunderbird support establishing message rules in the program itself, rather than having to do it on the server if you use IMAP.  This may or may not matter to you.  Outlook also allows you to set rules in the program with IMAP.  Windows Live Mail doesn't.  I don't know this but I would think that if you use this feature, it only applies to Outlook or Thunderbird and doesn't cause message rules to be applied in any other device you are using.  So you may have to set them on the server anyway.

 

Gene

----- )Original Message -----

From: Mary Otten

Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 8:12 AM

Subject: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

 

Hi all,


I have come from a Windows xp machine using a very old email client, and
I have also used the Mac native email client in its classic view. Both
of these have the distinction of being able to use a single keystroke to
get to a preview pane where you can read much of, and sometimes all of,
an email message, without having to open the message and start a say
all, then close the message and delete it. I find the preview pane to be
a more efficient means of dealing with a lot of email. I have both
Outlook from Office 16, which I haven't even looked at yet, because I
figure it is seriously complicated, and Thunderbird, latest release
version. Is there a way in either of these clients to have them open
with focus either in the inbox, or at least on the folder preview of
available boxes for a given account, then let you get into the inbox and
have a preview pane available with one press of the tab key? Also, in
T-bird, it always opens to the tool bar with the inbox tab selected. I
would prefer that it open with the inbox tree view in focus, not that
useless tab. More wasted keystrokes. Is there a way to make this happen?\


Mary


 


Virus-free. www.avg.com


Gene
 

I don't use Outlook so someone else will have to tell you how to turn the preview pane on.  The preview pane allows you to read messages by tabbing to the text without pressing enter on the message.  When you move to a message in the message list, the message automatically opens in the preview pane or opens enough to show the text.  If you aren't reading messages in plain text, it may be more dangerous to open messages in the preview pane because malicious content in a message might run but my impression is that with the settings used by default in e-mail programs today, this isn't much of a threat anymore.
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 9:11 PM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi Gene, I am using Outlook 2016 with Jaws 2018 on a 64 bit Win 10 computer.

 

Is the message header list, the preview pain?

 

What exactly do I need to do make the messages easier to read?

 

Is there any way to delete the message without having to close it first?

 

Many and sincere Thanks!

 

Vicky

 

From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, December 1, 2017 11:12 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

 

I don’t have Windows 10 but my impression from user comments is that it works well in Windows 10, but there may be a quirk.  When writing a message, at least some people evidently have to leave and return to the message to be able to read what they have written.  This can be very quickly and easily done by pressing alt twice.

 

As far as an installer is concerned, other list members may know where to direct you.  I believe I have the installer in my Drop Box account and I should be able to send it to you.  If you don't hear anything in a reasonable time, I'll send it. 

 

Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Mary Otten

Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 9:56 AM

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

 

Thanks, Gene,

 

I started out on this machine with the native windows 10 email app, since I understood that Windows live mail was kind of fading out or wasn't available for Win 10. I didn't like the native app because of all the crazy tab, tab, tabbing I had to do. I did look through David Moore's tutorial on that subject. I guess it is a simple enough app, but I wanted something a bit more robust, so I got T-bird. I do like the fact that T-bird lets you set message rules, although I haven't done it yet, because I'm not settled on it as my final destination as an email client. I do like t-bird better with NVDA than with JAWS, because it doesn't read the subject line once you open a message and start a say all. And I'm ok with subject first when email is being scrolled through, but I agree that it should be user adjustable. If I'm wrong about WLM and win 10, feel free to set me straight, and I'll try to find install and check it out.

 

Mary

 

On 12/1/2017 6:31 AM, Gene wrote:

Here is a rather long message where I discuss various aspects of e-mail programs you may not know about.  It may help you decide which program you want to use.

 

It's unfortunate that in implementing accessibility for Thunderbird, such conveniences haven't been added.  Also, if you are annoyed, as a lot of blind people and many sighted people are as well, by the subject line being shown first in message headers in Thunderbird, you can change     this but it isn't accessible using program commands from the keyboard.  It requires use of drag and drop.  Others can explain how you do this with whatever screen-reader you are using.  Ask if you want to know.  It's little annoyances like this, which go uncorrected and unaddressed for years, that is one reason I don't use thunderbird.  I use Windows Live Mail, which shows the from line first, and which allows adjustment of all these things from the keyboard.  it also allows you to jump to the inbox with one shortcut command from wherever you are in the program.  But recently, Thunderbird has generally passed Windows Live Mail in moving among folders.  there is an add on that lets you use first letter navigation in folders.  This didn't used to be available in either Windows Live Mail or thunderbird.  So it depends on which inconveniences you want.  I don't use thunderbird, but I know something about it.  I believe you can get to the message list much faster if you use f6 after opening the prohgram. 

 

As for Outlook, if you have some specific reason to use it, that's fine but I see more complaints about it than about any of the other popular Windows programs discussed here, that is Windows Live Mail, the Windows 10 e-mail app and Thunderbird. 

 

If you use message rules, I should point out that both Outlook and Thunderbird support establishing message rules in the program itself, rather than having to do it on the server if you use IMAP.  This may or may not matter to you.  Outlook also allows you to set rules in the program with IMAP.  Windows Live Mail doesn't.  I don't know this but I would think that if you use this feature, it only applies to Outlook or Thunderbird and doesn't cause message rules to be applied in any other device you are using.  So you may have to set them on the server anyway.

 

Gene

----- )Original Message -----

From: Mary Otten

Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 8:12 AM

Subject: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

 

Hi all,


I have come from a Windows xp machine using a very old email client, and
I have also used the Mac native email client in its classic view. Both
of these have the distinction of being able to use a single keystroke to
get to a preview pane where you can read much of, and sometimes all of,
an email message, without having to open the message and start a say
all, then close the message and delete it. I find the preview pane to be
a more efficient means of dealing with a lot of email. I have both
Outlook from Office 16, which I haven't even looked at yet, because I
figure it is seriously complicated, and Thunderbird, latest release
version. Is there a way in either of these clients to have them open
with focus either in the inbox, or at least on the folder preview of
available boxes for a given account, then let you get into the inbox and
have a preview pane available with one press of the tab key? Also, in
T-bird, it always opens to the tool bar with the inbox tab selected. I
would prefer that it open with the inbox tree view in focus, not that
useless tab. More wasted keystrokes. Is there a way to make this happen?\


Mary


 


Virus-free. www.avg.com


Rod Hutton
 

Hi Mary,

I use Outlook in Office 365, and I can whiz through messages which open as soon as you delete the one you're reading.
I haven't configured the preview pane since, coming from using Window-Eyes, and, indeed, continuing to use it, the Window-Eyes Outlook Enhance app always turns it off automatically.
The key is to set up Outlook to load the next or previous message automatically, depending on how you sort them in your current folder.
Since I sort my messages by subject, and then by date, with oldest at the bottom, I set up Outlook in the Outlook Mail Options to load the previous message automatically, and so this loads the newest message as soon as I delete it using the Outlook hotkey Ctrl-D.
As for reading the current message automatically, I use a Window-Eyes Cursor key definition for the cursor key Ctrl-D to execute the read to end command, and this just reads the next loaded message after you manually delete the current one.
With Jaws, the automatic reading of messages is set up using the quick verbosity dialog, accessed with Insert-V.
That's all there is to it, although, I admit, perhaps it may sound a little complicated. (smile)

Best,

Rod

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Mary Otten
Sent: December 1, 2017 9:12 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi all,


I have come from a Windows xp machine using a very old email client, and I have also used the Mac native email client in its classic view. Both of these have the distinction of being able to use a single keystroke to get to a preview pane where you can read much of, and sometimes all of, an email message, without having to open the message and start a say all, then close the message and delete it. I find the preview pane to be a more efficient means of dealing with a lot of email. I have both Outlook from Office 16, which I haven't even looked at yet, because I figure it is seriously complicated, and Thunderbird, latest release version. Is there a way in either of these clients to have them open with focus either in the inbox, or at least on the folder preview of available boxes for a given account, then let you get into the inbox and have a preview pane available with one press of the tab key? Also, in T-bird, it always opens to the tool bar with the inbox tab selected. I would prefer that it open with the inbox tree view in focus, not that useless tab. More wasted keystrokes. Is there a way to make this happen?\


Mary


Carolyn Arnold
 

In Outlook, press Alt+v+p+n to get to the pain. I don't think you'll like it on. I tried it, did not like it at all.

Best from,

Carolyn

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, December 1, 2017 10:17 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

I don't use Outlook so someone else will have to tell you how to turn the preview pane on. The preview pane allows you to read messages by tabbing to the text without pressing enter on the message. When you move to a message in the message list, the message automatically opens in the preview pane or opens enough to show the text. If you aren't reading messages in plain text, it may be more dangerous to open messages in the preview pane because malicious content in a message might run but my impression is that with the settings used by default in e-mail programs today, this isn't much of a threat anymore.

Gene
----- Original Message -----

From: Vicky Vaughan <mailto:vrvaughan63@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 9:11 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??


Hi Gene, I am using Outlook 2016 with Jaws 2018 on a 64 bit Win 10 computer.



Is the message header list, the preview pain?



What exactly do I need to do make the messages easier to read?



Is there any way to delete the message without having to close it first?



Many and sincere Thanks!



Vicky



From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io> [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, December 1, 2017 11:12 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??



I don’t have Windows 10 but my impression from user comments is that it works well in Windows 10, but there may be a quirk. When writing a message, at least some people evidently have to leave and return to the message to be able to read what they have written. This can be very quickly and easily done by pressing alt twice.



As far as an installer is concerned, other list members may know where to direct you. I believe I have the installer in my Drop Box account and I should be able to send it to you. If you don't hear anything in a reasonable time, I'll send it.



Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Mary Otten <mailto:maryotten@comcast.net>

Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 9:56 AM

To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??



Thanks, Gene,



I started out on this machine with the native windows 10 email app, since I understood that Windows live mail was kind of fading out or wasn't available for Win 10. I didn't like the native app because of all the crazy tab, tab, tabbing I had to do. I did look through David Moore's tutorial on that subject. I guess it is a simple enough app, but I wanted something a bit more robust, so I got T-bird. I do like the fact that T-bird lets you set message rules, although I haven't done it yet, because I'm not settled on it as my final destination as an email client. I do like t-bird better with NVDA than with JAWS, because it doesn't read the subject line once you open a message and start a say all. And I'm ok with subject first when email is being scrolled through, but I agree that it should be user adjustable. If I'm wrong about WLM and win 10, feel free to set me straight, and I'll try to find install and check it out.



Mary



On 12/1/2017 6:31 AM, Gene wrote:

Here is a rather long message where I discuss various aspects of e-mail programs you may not know about. It may help you decide which program you want to use.



It's unfortunate that in implementing accessibility for Thunderbird, such conveniences haven't been added. Also, if you are annoyed, as a lot of blind people and many sighted people are as well, by the subject line being shown first in message headers in Thunderbird, you can change this but it isn't accessible using program commands from the keyboard. It requires use of drag and drop. Others can explain how you do this with whatever screen-reader you are using. Ask if you want to know. It's little annoyances like this, which go uncorrected and unaddressed for years, that is one reason I don't use thunderbird. I use Windows Live Mail, which shows the from line first, and which allows adjustment of all these things from the keyboard. it also allows you to jump to the inbox with one shortcut command from wherever you are in the program. But recently, Thunderbird has generally passed Windows Live Mail in moving among folders. there is an add on that lets you use first letter navigation in folders. This didn't used to be available in either Windows Live Mail or thunderbird. So it depends on which inconveniences you want. I don't use thunderbird, but I know something about it. I believe you can get to the message list much faster if you use f6 after opening the prohgram.



As for Outlook, if you have some specific reason to use it, that's fine but I see more complaints about it than about any of the other popular Windows programs discussed here, that is Windows Live Mail, the Windows 10 e-mail app and Thunderbird.



If you use message rules, I should point out that both Outlook and Thunderbird support establishing message rules in the program itself, rather than having to do it on the server if you use IMAP. This may or may not matter to you. Outlook also allows you to set rules in the program with IMAP. Windows Live Mail doesn't. I don't know this but I would think that if you use this feature, it only applies to Outlook or Thunderbird and doesn't cause message rules to be applied in any other device you are using. So you may have to set them on the server anyway.



Gene

----- )Original Message -----

From: Mary Otten <mailto:maryotten@comcast.net>

Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 8:12 AM

To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>

Subject: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??



Hi all,


I have come from a Windows xp machine using a very old email client, and
I have also used the Mac native email client in its classic view. Both
of these have the distinction of being able to use a single keystroke to
get to a preview pane where you can read much of, and sometimes all of,
an email message, without having to open the message and start a say
all, then close the message and delete it. I find the preview pane to be
a more efficient means of dealing with a lot of email. I have both
Outlook from Office 16, which I haven't even looked at yet, because I
figure it is seriously complicated, and Thunderbird, latest release
version. Is there a way in either of these clients to have them open
with focus either in the inbox, or at least on the folder preview of
available boxes for a given account, then let you get into the inbox and
have a preview pane available with one press of the tab key? Also, in
T-bird, it always opens to the tool bar with the inbox tab selected. I
would prefer that it open with the inbox tree view in focus, not that
useless tab. More wasted keystrokes. Is there a way to make this happen?\


Mary







<http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> Virus-free. www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient>


Vicky Vaughan
 

Hi, Thank you Carolyn.

Sincerely, Vicky

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Carolyn Arnold
Sent: Saturday, December 2, 2017 11:39 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

In Outlook, press Alt+v+p+n to get to the pain. I don't think you'll like it on. I tried it, did not like it at all.

Best from,

Carolyn

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, December 1, 2017 10:17 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

I don't use Outlook so someone else will have to tell you how to turn the preview pane on. The preview pane allows you to read messages by tabbing to the text without pressing enter on the message. When you move to a message in the message list, the message automatically opens in the preview pane or opens enough to show the text. If you aren't reading messages in plain text, it may be more dangerous to open messages in the preview pane because malicious content in a message might run but my impression is that with the settings used by default in e-mail programs today, this isn't much of a threat anymore.

Gene
----- Original Message -----

From: Vicky Vaughan <mailto:vrvaughan63@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 9:11 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??


Hi Gene, I am using Outlook 2016 with Jaws 2018 on a 64 bit Win 10 computer.



Is the message header list, the preview pain?



What exactly do I need to do make the messages easier to read?



Is there any way to delete the message without having to close it first?



Many and sincere Thanks!



Vicky



From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io> [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, December 1, 2017 11:12 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??



I don’t have Windows 10 but my impression from user comments is that it works well in Windows 10, but there may be a quirk. When writing a message, at least some people evidently have to leave and return to the message to be able to read what they have written. This can be very quickly and easily done by pressing alt twice.



As far as an installer is concerned, other list members may know where to direct you. I believe I have the installer in my Drop Box account and I should be able to send it to you. If you don't hear anything in a reasonable time, I'll send it.



Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Mary Otten <mailto:maryotten@comcast.net>

Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 9:56 AM

To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??



Thanks, Gene,



I started out on this machine with the native windows 10 email app, since I understood that Windows live mail was kind of fading out or wasn't available for Win 10. I didn't like the native app because of all the crazy tab, tab, tabbing I had to do. I did look through David Moore's tutorial on that subject. I guess it is a simple enough app, but I wanted something a bit more robust, so I got T-bird. I do like the fact that T-bird lets you set message rules, although I haven't done it yet, because I'm not settled on it as my final destination as an email client. I do like t-bird better with NVDA than with JAWS, because it doesn't read the subject line once you open a message and start a say all. And I'm ok with subject first when email is being scrolled through, but I agree that it should be user adjustable. If I'm wrong about WLM and win 10, feel free to set me straight, and I'll try to find install and check it out.



Mary



On 12/1/2017 6:31 AM, Gene wrote:

Here is a rather long message where I discuss various aspects of e-mail programs you may not know about. It may help you decide which program you want to use.



It's unfortunate that in implementing accessibility for Thunderbird, such conveniences haven't been added. Also, if you are annoyed, as a lot of blind people and many sighted people are as well, by the subject line being shown first in message headers in Thunderbird, you can change this but it isn't accessible using program commands from the keyboard. It requires use of drag and drop. Others can explain how you do this with whatever screen-reader you are using. Ask if you want to know. It's little annoyances like this, which go uncorrected and unaddressed for years, that is one reason I don't use thunderbird. I use Windows Live Mail, which shows the from line first, and which allows adjustment of all these things from the keyboard. it also allows you to jump to the inbox with one shortcut command from wherever you are in the program. But recently, Thunderbird has generally passed Windows Live Mail in moving among folders. there is an add on that lets you use first letter navigation in folders. This didn't used to be available in either Windows Live Mail or thunderbird. So it depends on which inconveniences you want. I don't use thunderbird, but I know something about it. I believe you can get to the message list much faster if you use f6 after opening the prohgram.



As for Outlook, if you have some specific reason to use it, that's fine but I see more complaints about it than about any of the other popular Windows programs discussed here, that is Windows Live Mail, the Windows 10 e-mail app and Thunderbird.



If you use message rules, I should point out that both Outlook and Thunderbird support establishing message rules in the program itself, rather than having to do it on the server if you use IMAP. This may or may not matter to you. Outlook also allows you to set rules in the program with IMAP. Windows Live Mail doesn't. I don't know this but I would think that if you use this feature, it only applies to Outlook or Thunderbird and doesn't cause message rules to be applied in any other device you are using. So you may have to set them on the server anyway.



Gene

----- )Original Message -----

From: Mary Otten <mailto:maryotten@comcast.net>

Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 8:12 AM

To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>

Subject: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??



Hi all,


I have come from a Windows xp machine using a very old email client, and
I have also used the Mac native email client in its classic view. Both
of these have the distinction of being able to use a single keystroke to
get to a preview pane where you can read much of, and sometimes all of,
an email message, without having to open the message and start a say
all, then close the message and delete it. I find the preview pane to be
a more efficient means of dealing with a lot of email. I have both
Outlook from Office 16, which I haven't even looked at yet, because I
figure it is seriously complicated, and Thunderbird, latest release
version. Is there a way in either of these clients to have them open
with focus either in the inbox, or at least on the folder preview of
available boxes for a given account, then let you get into the inbox and
have a preview pane available with one press of the tab key? Also, in
T-bird, it always opens to the tool bar with the inbox tab selected. I
would prefer that it open with the inbox tree view in focus, not that
useless tab. More wasted keystrokes. Is there a way to make this happen?\


Mary







<http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> Virus-free. www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient>








---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
http://www.avg.com


Mary Otten <maryotten@...>
 

Hi Carolyn,
Why didn’t you like it on?
Mary

Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 2, 2017, at 8:39 AM, Carolyn Arnold <4carolyna@windstream.net> wrote:

In Outlook, press Alt+v+p+n to get to the pain. I don't think you'll like it on. I tried it, did not like it at all.

Best from,

Carolyn

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, December 1, 2017 10:17 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

I don't use Outlook so someone else will have to tell you how to turn the preview pane on. The preview pane allows you to read messages by tabbing to the text without pressing enter on the message. When you move to a message in the message list, the message automatically opens in the preview pane or opens enough to show the text. If you aren't reading messages in plain text, it may be more dangerous to open messages in the preview pane because malicious content in a message might run but my impression is that with the settings used by default in e-mail programs today, this isn't much of a threat anymore.

Gene
----- Original Message -----

From: Vicky Vaughan <mailto:vrvaughan63@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 9:11 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??


Hi Gene, I am using Outlook 2016 with Jaws 2018 on a 64 bit Win 10 computer.



Is the message header list, the preview pain?



What exactly do I need to do make the messages easier to read?



Is there any way to delete the message without having to close it first?



Many and sincere Thanks!



Vicky



From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io> [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, December 1, 2017 11:12 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??



I don’t have Windows 10 but my impression from user comments is that it works well in Windows 10, but there may be a quirk. When writing a message, at least some people evidently have to leave and return to the message to be able to read what they have written. This can be very quickly and easily done by pressing alt twice.



As far as an installer is concerned, other list members may know where to direct you. I believe I have the installer in my Drop Box account and I should be able to send it to you. If you don't hear anything in a reasonable time, I'll send it.



Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Mary Otten <mailto:maryotten@comcast.net>

Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 9:56 AM

To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??



Thanks, Gene,



I started out on this machine with the native windows 10 email app, since I understood that Windows live mail was kind of fading out or wasn't available for Win 10. I didn't like the native app because of all the crazy tab, tab, tabbing I had to do. I did look through David Moore's tutorial on that subject. I guess it is a simple enough app, but I wanted something a bit more robust, so I got T-bird. I do like the fact that T-bird lets you set message rules, although I haven't done it yet, because I'm not settled on it as my final destination as an email client. I do like t-bird better with NVDA than with JAWS, because it doesn't read the subject line once you open a message and start a say all. And I'm ok with subject first when email is being scrolled through, but I agree that it should be user adjustable. If I'm wrong about WLM and win 10, feel free to set me straight, and I'll try to find install and check it out.



Mary



On 12/1/2017 6:31 AM, Gene wrote:

Here is a rather long message where I discuss various aspects of e-mail programs you may not know about. It may help you decide which program you want to use.



It's unfortunate that in implementing accessibility for Thunderbird, such conveniences haven't been added. Also, if you are annoyed, as a lot of blind people and many sighted people are as well, by the subject line being shown first in message headers in Thunderbird, you can change this but it isn't accessible using program commands from the keyboard. It requires use of drag and drop. Others can explain how you do this with whatever screen-reader you are using. Ask if you want to know. It's little annoyances like this, which go uncorrected and unaddressed for years, that is one reason I don't use thunderbird. I use Windows Live Mail, which shows the from line first, and which allows adjustment of all these things from the keyboard. it also allows you to jump to the inbox with one shortcut command from wherever you are in the program. But recently, Thunderbird has generally passed Windows Live Mail in moving among folders. there is an add on that lets you use first letter navigation in folders. This didn't used to be available in either Windows Live Mail or thunderbird. So it depends on which inconveniences you want. I don't use thunderbird, but I know something about it. I believe you can get to the message list much faster if you use f6 after opening the prohgram.



As for Outlook, if you have some specific reason to use it, that's fine but I see more complaints about it than about any of the other popular Windows programs discussed here, that is Windows Live Mail, the Windows 10 e-mail app and Thunderbird.



If you use message rules, I should point out that both Outlook and Thunderbird support establishing message rules in the program itself, rather than having to do it on the server if you use IMAP. This may or may not matter to you. Outlook also allows you to set rules in the program with IMAP. Windows Live Mail doesn't. I don't know this but I would think that if you use this feature, it only applies to Outlook or Thunderbird and doesn't cause message rules to be applied in any other device you are using. So you may have to set them on the server anyway.



Gene

----- )Original Message -----

From: Mary Otten <mailto:maryotten@comcast.net>

Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 8:12 AM

To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>

Subject: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??



Hi all,


I have come from a Windows xp machine using a very old email client, and
I have also used the Mac native email client in its classic view. Both
of these have the distinction of being able to use a single keystroke to
get to a preview pane where you can read much of, and sometimes all of,
an email message, without having to open the message and start a say
all, then close the message and delete it. I find the preview pane to be
a more efficient means of dealing with a lot of email. I have both
Outlook from Office 16, which I haven't even looked at yet, because I
figure it is seriously complicated, and Thunderbird, latest release
version. Is there a way in either of these clients to have them open
with focus either in the inbox, or at least on the folder preview of
available boxes for a given account, then let you get into the inbox and
have a preview pane available with one press of the tab key? Also, in
T-bird, it always opens to the tool bar with the inbox tab selected. I
would prefer that it open with the inbox tree view in focus, not that
useless tab. More wasted keystrokes. Is there a way to make this happen?\


Mary







<http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> Virus-free. www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient>






Gene
 

Here is a link to the installer for the newer ribbon version of Windows Live Mail.  There is an older menu version.  I think they both work in Windows 10 but I don't recall the little discussion I've seen of that.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/3dk1rfpnpzezb3t/windows%20Live%20Mail%20newer%20newlsetup-all.exe?dl=1
 
Gene

----- Original Message -----
From: Gene
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 10:11 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

I don’t have Windows 10 but my impression from user comments is that it works well in Windows 10, but there may be a quirk.  When writing a message, at least some people evidently have to leave and return to the message to be able to read what they have written.  This can be very quickly and easily done by pressing alt twice.
 
As far as an installer is concerned, other list members may know where to direct you.  I believe I have the installer in my Drop Box account and I should be able to send it to you.  If you don't hear anything in a reasonable time, I'll send it. 
 
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Mary Otten
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 9:56 AM
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Thanks, Gene,


I started out on this machine with the native windows 10 email app, since I understood that Windows live mail was kind of fading out or wasn't available for Win 10. I didn't like the native app because of all the crazy tab, tab, tabbing I had to do. I did look through David Moore's tutorial on that subject. I guess it is a simple enough app, but I wanted something a bit more robust, so I got T-bird. I do like the fact that T-bird lets you set message rules, although I haven't done it yet, because I'm not settled on it as my final destination as an email client. I do like t-bird better with NVDA than with JAWS, because it doesn't read the subject line once you open a message and start a say all. And I'm ok with subject first when email is being scrolled through, but I agree that it should be user adjustable. If I'm wrong about WLM and win 10, feel free to set me straight, and I'll try to find install and check it out.


Mary


On 12/1/2017 6:31 AM, Gene wrote:
Here is a rather long message where I discuss various aspects of e-mail programs you may not know about.  It may help you decide which program you want to use.
 
It's unfortunate that in implementing accessibility for Thunderbird, such conveniences haven't been added.  Also, if you are annoyed, as a lot of blind people and many sighted people are as well, by the subject line being shown first in message headers in Thunderbird, you can change     this but it isn't accessible using program commands from the keyboard.  It requires use of drag and drop.  Others can explain how you do this with whatever screen-reader you are using.  Ask if you want to know.  It's little annoyances like this, which go uncorrected and unaddressed for years, that is one reason I don't use thunderbird.  I use Windows Live Mail, which shows the from line first, and which allows adjustment of all these things from the keyboard.  it also allows you to jump to the inbox with one shortcut command from wherever you are in the program.  But recently, Thunderbird has generally passed Windows Live Mail in moving among folders.  there is an add on that lets you use first letter navigation in folders.  This didn't used to be available in either Windows Live Mail or thunderbird.  So it depends on which inconveniences you want.  I don't use thunderbird, but I know something about it.  I believe you can get to the message list much faster if you use f6 after opening the prohgram. 
 
As for Outlook, if you have some specific reason to use it, that's fine but I see more complaints about it than about any of the other popular Windows programs discussed here, that is Windows Live Mail, the Windows 10 e-mail app and Thunderbird. 
 
If you use message rules, I should point out that both Outlook and Thunderbird support establishing message rules in the program itself, rather than having to do it on the server if you use IMAP.  This may or may not matter to you.  Outlook also allows you to set rules in the program with IMAP.  Windows Live Mail doesn't.  I don't know this but I would think that if you use this feature, it only applies to Outlook or Thunderbird and doesn't cause message rules to be applied in any other device you are using.  So you may have to set them on the server anyway.
 
Gene
----- )Original Message -----
From: Mary Otten
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 8:12 AM
Subject: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi all,


I have come from a Windows xp machine using a very old email client, and
I have also used the Mac native email client in its classic view. Both
of these have the distinction of being able to use a single keystroke to
get to a preview pane where you can read much of, and sometimes all of,
an email message, without having to open the message and start a say
all, then close the message and delete it. I find the preview pane to be
a more efficient means of dealing with a lot of email. I have both
Outlook from Office 16, which I haven't even looked at yet, because I
figure it is seriously complicated, and Thunderbird, latest release
version. Is there a way in either of these clients to have them open
with focus either in the inbox, or at least on the folder preview of
available boxes for a given account, then let you get into the inbox and
have a preview pane available with one press of the tab key? Also, in
T-bird, it always opens to the tool bar with the inbox tab selected. I
would prefer that it open with the inbox tree view in focus, not that
useless tab. More wasted keystrokes. Is there a way to make this happen?\


Mary





Rod Hutton
 

Hi Mary,

I'm not sure whether this made it to the list, and so I just thought I'd send it again.
Please let me know if I can help in any way with Outlook.

Best,

Rod

-----Original Message-----
From: Rod Hutton
Sent: December 2, 2017 6:13 AM
To: 'main@TechTalk.groups.io' <main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Subject: RE: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi Mary,

I use Outlook in Office 365, and I can whiz through messages which open as soon as you delete the one you're reading.
I haven't configured the preview pane since, coming from using Window-Eyes, and, indeed, continuing to use it, the Window-Eyes Outlook Enhance app always turns it off automatically.
The key is to set up Outlook to load the next or previous message automatically, depending on how you sort them in your current folder.
Since I sort my messages by subject, and then by date, with oldest at the bottom, I set up Outlook in the Outlook Mail Options to load the previous message automatically, and so this loads the newest message as soon as I delete it using the Outlook hotkey Ctrl-D.
As for reading the current message automatically, I use a Window-Eyes Cursor key definition for the cursor key Ctrl-D to execute the read to end command, and this just reads the next loaded message after you manually delete the current one.
With Jaws, the automatic reading of messages is set up using the quick verbosity dialog, accessed with Insert-V.
That's all there is to it, although, I admit, perhaps it may sound a little complicated. (smile)

Best,

Rod


-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Mary Otten
Sent: December 1, 2017 9:12 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi all,


I have come from a Windows xp machine using a very old email client, and I have also used the Mac native email client in its classic view. Both of these have the distinction of being able to use a single keystroke to get to a preview pane where you can read much of, and sometimes all of, an email message, without having to open the message and start a say all, then close the message and delete it. I find the preview pane to be a more efficient means of dealing with a lot of email. I have both Outlook from Office 16, which I haven't even looked at yet, because I figure it is seriously complicated, and Thunderbird, latest release version. Is there a way in either of these clients to have them open with focus either in the inbox, or at least on the folder preview of available boxes for a given account, then let you get into the inbox and have a preview pane available with one press of the tab key? Also, in T-bird, it always opens to the tool bar with the inbox tab selected. I would prefer that it open with the inbox tree view in focus, not that useless tab. More wasted keystrokes. Is there a way to make this happen?\


Mary


Mary Otten <maryotten@...>
 

Thank you, Rod. I did see your message and saved it. I don’t have window eyes on my new machine, but I do have jaws and NVDA.
Mary


Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 2, 2017, at 2:13 PM, Rod Hutton <rod_hutton@hotmail.com> wrote:

Hi Mary,

I'm not sure whether this made it to the list, and so I just thought I'd send it again.
Please let me know if I can help in any way with Outlook.

Best,

Rod

-----Original Message-----
From: Rod Hutton
Sent: December 2, 2017 6:13 AM
To: 'main@TechTalk.groups.io' <main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Subject: RE: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi Mary,

I use Outlook in Office 365, and I can whiz through messages which open as soon as you delete the one you're reading.
I haven't configured the preview pane since, coming from using Window-Eyes, and, indeed, continuing to use it, the Window-Eyes Outlook Enhance app always turns it off automatically.
The key is to set up Outlook to load the next or previous message automatically, depending on how you sort them in your current folder.
Since I sort my messages by subject, and then by date, with oldest at the bottom, I set up Outlook in the Outlook Mail Options to load the previous message automatically, and so this loads the newest message as soon as I delete it using the Outlook hotkey Ctrl-D.
As for reading the current message automatically, I use a Window-Eyes Cursor key definition for the cursor key Ctrl-D to execute the read to end command, and this just reads the next loaded message after you manually delete the current one.
With Jaws, the automatic reading of messages is set up using the quick verbosity dialog, accessed with Insert-V.
That's all there is to it, although, I admit, perhaps it may sound a little complicated. (smile)

Best,

Rod


-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Mary Otten
Sent: December 1, 2017 9:12 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi all,


I have come from a Windows xp machine using a very old email client, and I have also used the Mac native email client in its classic view. Both of these have the distinction of being able to use a single keystroke to get to a preview pane where you can read much of, and sometimes all of, an email message, without having to open the message and start a say all, then close the message and delete it. I find the preview pane to be a more efficient means of dealing with a lot of email. I have both Outlook from Office 16, which I haven't even looked at yet, because I figure it is seriously complicated, and Thunderbird, latest release version. Is there a way in either of these clients to have them open with focus either in the inbox, or at least on the folder preview of available boxes for a given account, then let you get into the inbox and have a preview pane available with one press of the tab key? Also, in T-bird, it always opens to the tool bar with the inbox tab selected. I would prefer that it open with the inbox tree view in focus, not that useless tab. More wasted keystrokes. Is there a way to make this happen?\


Mary







Rod Hutton
 

Okay, Marry,

Just wanted to be sure. (smile)

Best,

Rod

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Mary Otten
Sent: December 2, 2017 6:20 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Thank you, Rod. I did see your message and saved it. I don’t have window eyes on my new machine, but I do have jaws and NVDA.
Mary


Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 2, 2017, at 2:13 PM, Rod Hutton <rod_hutton@hotmail.com> wrote:

Hi Mary,

I'm not sure whether this made it to the list, and so I just thought I'd send it again.
Please let me know if I can help in any way with Outlook.

Best,

Rod

-----Original Message-----
From: Rod Hutton
Sent: December 2, 2017 6:13 AM
To: 'main@TechTalk.groups.io' <main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Subject: RE: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi Mary,

I use Outlook in Office 365, and I can whiz through messages which open as soon as you delete the one you're reading.
I haven't configured the preview pane since, coming from using Window-Eyes, and, indeed, continuing to use it, the Window-Eyes Outlook Enhance app always turns it off automatically.
The key is to set up Outlook to load the next or previous message automatically, depending on how you sort them in your current folder.
Since I sort my messages by subject, and then by date, with oldest at the bottom, I set up Outlook in the Outlook Mail Options to load the previous message automatically, and so this loads the newest message as soon as I delete it using the Outlook hotkey Ctrl-D.
As for reading the current message automatically, I use a Window-Eyes Cursor key definition for the cursor key Ctrl-D to execute the read to end command, and this just reads the next loaded message after you manually delete the current one.
With Jaws, the automatic reading of messages is set up using the quick verbosity dialog, accessed with Insert-V.
That's all there is to it, although, I admit, perhaps it may sound a
little complicated. (smile)

Best,

Rod


-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On
Behalf Of Mary Otten
Sent: December 1, 2017 9:12 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi all,


I have come from a Windows xp machine using a very old email client,
and I have also used the Mac native email client in its classic view.
Both of these have the distinction of being able to use a single
keystroke to get to a preview pane where you can read much of, and
sometimes all of, an email message, without having to open the message
and start a say all, then close the message and delete it. I find the
preview pane to be a more efficient means of dealing with a lot of
email. I have both Outlook from Office 16, which I haven't even looked
at yet, because I figure it is seriously complicated, and Thunderbird,
latest release version. Is there a way in either of these clients to
have them open with focus either in the inbox, or at least on the
folder preview of available boxes for a given account, then let you
get into the inbox and have a preview pane available with one press of
the tab key? Also, in T-bird, it always opens to the tool bar with the
inbox tab selected. I would prefer that it open with the inbox tree
view in focus, not that useless tab. More wasted keystrokes. Is there
a way to make this happen?\


Mary







Carolyn Arnold
 

I can't remember, so I just turned it back on, will see how it does.

Best from,

Carolyn

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Mary Otten
Sent: Saturday, December 2, 2017 12:01 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi Carolyn,
Why didn’t you like it on?
Mary

Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 2, 2017, at 8:39 AM, Carolyn Arnold <4carolyna@windstream.net> wrote:

In Outlook, press Alt+v+p+n to get to the pain. I don't think you'll like it on. I tried it, did not like it at all.

Best from,

Carolyn

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On
Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, December 1, 2017 10:17 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

I don't use Outlook so someone else will have to tell you how to turn the preview pane on. The preview pane allows you to read messages by tabbing to the text without pressing enter on the message. When you move to a message in the message list, the message automatically opens in the preview pane or opens enough to show the text. If you aren't reading messages in plain text, it may be more dangerous to open messages in the preview pane because malicious content in a message might run but my impression is that with the settings used by default in e-mail programs today, this isn't much of a threat anymore.

Gene
----- Original Message -----

From: Vicky Vaughan <mailto:vrvaughan63@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 9:11 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??


Hi Gene, I am using Outlook 2016 with Jaws 2018 on a 64 bit Win 10 computer.



Is the message header list, the preview pain?



What exactly do I need to do make the messages easier to read?



Is there any way to delete the message without having to close it first?



Many and sincere Thanks!



Vicky



From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
[mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, December 1, 2017 11:12 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??



I don’t have Windows 10 but my impression from user comments is that it works well in Windows 10, but there may be a quirk. When writing a message, at least some people evidently have to leave and return to the message to be able to read what they have written. This can be very quickly and easily done by pressing alt twice.



As far as an installer is concerned, other list members may know where to direct you. I believe I have the installer in my Drop Box account and I should be able to send it to you. If you don't hear anything in a reasonable time, I'll send it.



Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Mary Otten <mailto:maryotten@comcast.net>

Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 9:56 AM

To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??



Thanks, Gene,



I started out on this machine with the native windows 10 email app, since I understood that Windows live mail was kind of fading out or wasn't available for Win 10. I didn't like the native app because of all the crazy tab, tab, tabbing I had to do. I did look through David Moore's tutorial on that subject. I guess it is a simple enough app, but I wanted something a bit more robust, so I got T-bird. I do like the fact that T-bird lets you set message rules, although I haven't done it yet, because I'm not settled on it as my final destination as an email client. I do like t-bird better with NVDA than with JAWS, because it doesn't read the subject line once you open a message and start a say all. And I'm ok with subject first when email is being scrolled through, but I agree that it should be user adjustable. If I'm wrong about WLM and win 10, feel free to set me straight, and I'll try to find install and check it out.



Mary



On 12/1/2017 6:31 AM, Gene wrote:

Here is a rather long message where I discuss various aspects of e-mail programs you may not know about. It may help you decide which program you want to use.



It's unfortunate that in implementing accessibility for Thunderbird, such conveniences haven't been added. Also, if you are annoyed, as a lot of blind people and many sighted people are as well, by the subject line being shown first in message headers in Thunderbird, you can change this but it isn't accessible using program commands from the keyboard. It requires use of drag and drop. Others can explain how you do this with whatever screen-reader you are using. Ask if you want to know. It's little annoyances like this, which go uncorrected and unaddressed for years, that is one reason I don't use thunderbird. I use Windows Live Mail, which shows the from line first, and which allows adjustment of all these things from the keyboard. it also allows you to jump to the inbox with one shortcut command from wherever you are in the program. But recently, Thunderbird has generally passed Windows Live Mail in moving among folders. there is an add on that lets you use first letter navigation in folders. This didn't used to be available in either Windows Live Mail or thunderbird. So it depends on which inconveniences you want. I don't use thunderbird, but I know something about it. I believe you can get to the message list much faster if you use f6 after opening the prohgram.



As for Outlook, if you have some specific reason to use it, that's fine but I see more complaints about it than about any of the other popular Windows programs discussed here, that is Windows Live Mail, the Windows 10 e-mail app and Thunderbird.



If you use message rules, I should point out that both Outlook and Thunderbird support establishing message rules in the program itself, rather than having to do it on the server if you use IMAP. This may or may not matter to you. Outlook also allows you to set rules in the program with IMAP. Windows Live Mail doesn't. I don't know this but I would think that if you use this feature, it only applies to Outlook or Thunderbird and doesn't cause message rules to be applied in any other device you are using. So you may have to set them on the server anyway.



Gene

----- )Original Message -----

From: Mary Otten <mailto:maryotten@comcast.net>

Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 8:12 AM

To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>

Subject: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??



Hi all,


I have come from a Windows xp machine using a very old email client, and
I have also used the Mac native email client in its classic view. Both
of these have the distinction of being able to use a single keystroke to
get to a preview pane where you can read much of, and sometimes all of,
an email message, without having to open the message and start a say
all, then close the message and delete it. I find the preview pane to be
a more efficient means of dealing with a lot of email. I have both
Outlook from Office 16, which I haven't even looked at yet, because I
figure it is seriously complicated, and Thunderbird, latest release
version. Is there a way in either of these clients to have them open
with focus either in the inbox, or at least on the folder preview of
available boxes for a given account, then let you get into the inbox and
have a preview pane available with one press of the tab key? Also, in
T-bird, it always opens to the tool bar with the inbox tab selected. I
would prefer that it open with the inbox tree view in focus, not that
useless tab. More wasted keystrokes. Is there a way to make this
happen?\


Mary







<http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> Virus-free. www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient>






Carolyn Arnold
 

I can't seem to get it back on, but the best that I remember is that it was like too much traffic or too much reading, when I needed to get into a message.

Best from,

Carolyn

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Mary Otten
Sent: Saturday, December 2, 2017 12:01 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi Carolyn,
Why didn’t you like it on?
Mary

Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 2, 2017, at 8:39 AM, Carolyn Arnold <4carolyna@windstream.net> wrote:

In Outlook, press Alt+v+p+n to get to the pain. I don't think you'll like it on. I tried it, did not like it at all.

Best from,

Carolyn

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On
Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, December 1, 2017 10:17 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

I don't use Outlook so someone else will have to tell you how to turn the preview pane on. The preview pane allows you to read messages by tabbing to the text without pressing enter on the message. When you move to a message in the message list, the message automatically opens in the preview pane or opens enough to show the text. If you aren't reading messages in plain text, it may be more dangerous to open messages in the preview pane because malicious content in a message might run but my impression is that with the settings used by default in e-mail programs today, this isn't much of a threat anymore.

Gene
----- Original Message -----

From: Vicky Vaughan <mailto:vrvaughan63@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 9:11 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??


Hi Gene, I am using Outlook 2016 with Jaws 2018 on a 64 bit Win 10 computer.



Is the message header list, the preview pain?



What exactly do I need to do make the messages easier to read?



Is there any way to delete the message without having to close it first?



Many and sincere Thanks!



Vicky



From: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>
[mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Friday, December 1, 2017 11:12 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??



I don’t have Windows 10 but my impression from user comments is that it works well in Windows 10, but there may be a quirk. When writing a message, at least some people evidently have to leave and return to the message to be able to read what they have written. This can be very quickly and easily done by pressing alt twice.



As far as an installer is concerned, other list members may know where to direct you. I believe I have the installer in my Drop Box account and I should be able to send it to you. If you don't hear anything in a reasonable time, I'll send it.



Gene

----- Original Message -----

From: Mary Otten <mailto:maryotten@comcast.net>

Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 9:56 AM

To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>

Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??



Thanks, Gene,



I started out on this machine with the native windows 10 email app, since I understood that Windows live mail was kind of fading out or wasn't available for Win 10. I didn't like the native app because of all the crazy tab, tab, tabbing I had to do. I did look through David Moore's tutorial on that subject. I guess it is a simple enough app, but I wanted something a bit more robust, so I got T-bird. I do like the fact that T-bird lets you set message rules, although I haven't done it yet, because I'm not settled on it as my final destination as an email client. I do like t-bird better with NVDA than with JAWS, because it doesn't read the subject line once you open a message and start a say all. And I'm ok with subject first when email is being scrolled through, but I agree that it should be user adjustable. If I'm wrong about WLM and win 10, feel free to set me straight, and I'll try to find install and check it out.



Mary



On 12/1/2017 6:31 AM, Gene wrote:

Here is a rather long message where I discuss various aspects of e-mail programs you may not know about. It may help you decide which program you want to use.



It's unfortunate that in implementing accessibility for Thunderbird, such conveniences haven't been added. Also, if you are annoyed, as a lot of blind people and many sighted people are as well, by the subject line being shown first in message headers in Thunderbird, you can change this but it isn't accessible using program commands from the keyboard. It requires use of drag and drop. Others can explain how you do this with whatever screen-reader you are using. Ask if you want to know. It's little annoyances like this, which go uncorrected and unaddressed for years, that is one reason I don't use thunderbird. I use Windows Live Mail, which shows the from line first, and which allows adjustment of all these things from the keyboard. it also allows you to jump to the inbox with one shortcut command from wherever you are in the program. But recently, Thunderbird has generally passed Windows Live Mail in moving among folders. there is an add on that lets you use first letter navigation in folders. This didn't used to be available in either Windows Live Mail or thunderbird. So it depends on which inconveniences you want. I don't use thunderbird, but I know something about it. I believe you can get to the message list much faster if you use f6 after opening the prohgram.



As for Outlook, if you have some specific reason to use it, that's fine but I see more complaints about it than about any of the other popular Windows programs discussed here, that is Windows Live Mail, the Windows 10 e-mail app and Thunderbird.



If you use message rules, I should point out that both Outlook and Thunderbird support establishing message rules in the program itself, rather than having to do it on the server if you use IMAP. This may or may not matter to you. Outlook also allows you to set rules in the program with IMAP. Windows Live Mail doesn't. I don't know this but I would think that if you use this feature, it only applies to Outlook or Thunderbird and doesn't cause message rules to be applied in any other device you are using. So you may have to set them on the server anyway.



Gene

----- )Original Message -----

From: Mary Otten <mailto:maryotten@comcast.net>

Sent: Friday, December 01, 2017 8:12 AM

To: main@TechTalk.groups.io <mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io>

Subject: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??



Hi all,


I have come from a Windows xp machine using a very old email client, and
I have also used the Mac native email client in its classic view. Both
of these have the distinction of being able to use a single keystroke to
get to a preview pane where you can read much of, and sometimes all of,
an email message, without having to open the message and start a say
all, then close the message and delete it. I find the preview pane to be
a more efficient means of dealing with a lot of email. I have both
Outlook from Office 16, which I haven't even looked at yet, because I
figure it is seriously complicated, and Thunderbird, latest release
version. Is there a way in either of these clients to have them open
with focus either in the inbox, or at least on the folder preview of
available boxes for a given account, then let you get into the inbox and
have a preview pane available with one press of the tab key? Also, in
T-bird, it always opens to the tool bar with the inbox tab selected. I
would prefer that it open with the inbox tree view in focus, not that
useless tab. More wasted keystrokes. Is there a way to make this
happen?\


Mary







<http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> Virus-free. www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient>






Rod Hutton
 

Hi Mary,

Further to my message, I have since learned that, in addition to simply deleting a message which automatically displays the next message, you can press Ctrl-< and Ctrl-> to view the previous and next messages, respectively.
Please review the above commands carefully; otherwise, you will miss the normally unspoken less-than and greater-than characters.

Best,

Rod

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Mary Otten
Sent: December 2, 2017 6:20 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Thank you, Rod. I did see your message and saved it. I don’t have window eyes on my new machine, but I do have jaws and NVDA.
Mary


Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 2, 2017, at 2:13 PM, Rod Hutton <rod_hutton@hotmail.com> wrote:

Hi Mary,

I'm not sure whether this made it to the list, and so I just thought I'd send it again.
Please let me know if I can help in any way with Outlook.

Best,

Rod

-----Original Message-----
From: Rod Hutton
Sent: December 2, 2017 6:13 AM
To: 'main@TechTalk.groups.io' <main@TechTalk.groups.io>
Subject: RE: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi Mary,

I use Outlook in Office 365, and I can whiz through messages which open as soon as you delete the one you're reading.
I haven't configured the preview pane since, coming from using Window-Eyes, and, indeed, continuing to use it, the Window-Eyes Outlook Enhance app always turns it off automatically.
The key is to set up Outlook to load the next or previous message automatically, depending on how you sort them in your current folder.
Since I sort my messages by subject, and then by date, with oldest at the bottom, I set up Outlook in the Outlook Mail Options to load the previous message automatically, and so this loads the newest message as soon as I delete it using the Outlook hotkey Ctrl-D.
As for reading the current message automatically, I use a Window-Eyes Cursor key definition for the cursor key Ctrl-D to execute the read to end command, and this just reads the next loaded message after you manually delete the current one.
With Jaws, the automatic reading of messages is set up using the quick verbosity dialog, accessed with Insert-V.
That's all there is to it, although, I admit, perhaps it may sound a
little complicated. (smile)

Best,

Rod


-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On
Behalf Of Mary Otten
Sent: December 1, 2017 9:12 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi all,


I have come from a Windows xp machine using a very old email client,
and I have also used the Mac native email client in its classic view.
Both of these have the distinction of being able to use a single
keystroke to get to a preview pane where you can read much of, and
sometimes all of, an email message, without having to open the message
and start a say all, then close the message and delete it. I find the
preview pane to be a more efficient means of dealing with a lot of
email. I have both Outlook from Office 16, which I haven't even looked
at yet, because I figure it is seriously complicated, and Thunderbird,
latest release version. Is there a way in either of these clients to
have them open with focus either in the inbox, or at least on the
folder preview of available boxes for a given account, then let you
get into the inbox and have a preview pane available with one press of
the tab key? Also, in T-bird, it always opens to the tool bar with the
inbox tab selected. I would prefer that it open with the inbox tree
view in focus, not that useless tab. More wasted keystrokes. Is there
a way to make this happen?\


Mary







Vicky Vaughan
 

Hello,
Are you using Outlook 2016, Windows 10 and JAWS 2018?

I am unable to use Ctrl-D to drop into the next message body.
Please advise.
Thanks

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Rod Hutton
Sent: Saturday, December 2, 2017 6:13 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi Mary,

I use Outlook in Office 365, and I can whiz through messages which open as soon as you delete the one you're reading.
I haven't configured the preview pane since, coming from using Window-Eyes, and, indeed, continuing to use it, the Window-Eyes Outlook Enhance app always turns it off automatically.
The key is to set up Outlook to load the next or previous message automatically, depending on how you sort them in your current folder.
Since I sort my messages by subject, and then by date, with oldest at the bottom, I set up Outlook in the Outlook Mail Options to load the previous message automatically, and so this loads the newest message as soon as I delete it using the Outlook hotkey Ctrl-D.
As for reading the current message automatically, I use a Window-Eyes Cursor key definition for the cursor key Ctrl-D to execute the read to end command, and this just reads the next loaded message after you manually delete the current one.
With Jaws, the automatic reading of messages is set up using the quick verbosity dialog, accessed with Insert-V.
That's all there is to it, although, I admit, perhaps it may sound a little complicated. (smile)

Best,

Rod


-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Mary Otten
Sent: December 1, 2017 9:12 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi all,


I have come from a Windows xp machine using a very old email client, and I have also used the Mac native email client in its classic view. Both of these have the distinction of being able to use a single keystroke to get to a preview pane where you can read much of, and sometimes all of, an email message, without having to open the message and start a say all, then close the message and delete it. I find the preview pane to be a more efficient means of dealing with a lot of email. I have both Outlook from Office 16, which I haven't even looked at yet, because I figure it is seriously complicated, and Thunderbird, latest release version. Is there a way in either of these clients to have them open with focus either in the inbox, or at least on the folder preview of available boxes for a given account, then let you get into the inbox and have a preview pane available with one press of the tab key? Also, in T-bird, it always opens to the tool bar with the inbox tab selected. I would prefer that it open with the inbox tree view in focus, not that useless tab. More wasted keystrokes. Is there a way to make this happen?\


Mary









---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
http://www.avg.com


Rod Hutton
 

Hi Vicky,

Yes, except that I'm using Window-Eyes rather than JFW, and, yet, this shouldn't matter whatsoever.
So, what happens if you press Ctrl-D when viewing a message that you want to delete?

Best,

Rod

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Vicky Vaughan
Sent: December 4, 2017 1:37 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hello,
Are you using Outlook 2016, Windows 10 and JAWS 2018?

I am unable to use Ctrl-D to drop into the next message body.
Please advise.
Thanks


-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Rod Hutton
Sent: Saturday, December 2, 2017 6:13 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi Mary,

I use Outlook in Office 365, and I can whiz through messages which open as soon as you delete the one you're reading.
I haven't configured the preview pane since, coming from using Window-Eyes, and, indeed, continuing to use it, the Window-Eyes Outlook Enhance app always turns it off automatically.
The key is to set up Outlook to load the next or previous message automatically, depending on how you sort them in your current folder.
Since I sort my messages by subject, and then by date, with oldest at the bottom, I set up Outlook in the Outlook Mail Options to load the previous message automatically, and so this loads the newest message as soon as I delete it using the Outlook hotkey Ctrl-D.
As for reading the current message automatically, I use a Window-Eyes Cursor key definition for the cursor key Ctrl-D to execute the read to end command, and this just reads the next loaded message after you manually delete the current one.
With Jaws, the automatic reading of messages is set up using the quick verbosity dialog, accessed with Insert-V.
That's all there is to it, although, I admit, perhaps it may sound a little complicated. (smile)

Best,

Rod


-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Mary Otten
Sent: December 1, 2017 9:12 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi all,


I have come from a Windows xp machine using a very old email client, and I have also used the Mac native email client in its classic view. Both of these have the distinction of being able to use a single keystroke to get to a preview pane where you can read much of, and sometimes all of, an email message, without having to open the message and start a say all, then close the message and delete it. I find the preview pane to be a more efficient means of dealing with a lot of email. I have both Outlook from Office 16, which I haven't even looked at yet, because I figure it is seriously complicated, and Thunderbird, latest release version. Is there a way in either of these clients to have them open with focus either in the inbox, or at least on the folder preview of available boxes for a given account, then let you get into the inbox and have a preview pane available with one press of the tab key? Also, in T-bird, it always opens to the tool bar with the inbox tab selected. I would prefer that it open with the inbox tree view in focus, not that useless tab. More wasted keystrokes. Is there a way to make this happen?\


Mary









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Vicky Vaughan
 

Hi Rob. If I press Control plus D, the message is deleted and I am placed on the header of the next message, but it does not open.

Thank you.

Vicky

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Rod Hutton
Sent: Monday, December 4, 2017 1:54 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi Vicky,

Yes, except that I'm using Window-Eyes rather than JFW, and, yet, this shouldn't matter whatsoever.
So, what happens if you press Ctrl-D when viewing a message that you want to delete?

Best,

Rod

-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Vicky Vaughan
Sent: December 4, 2017 1:37 PM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hello,
Are you using Outlook 2016, Windows 10 and JAWS 2018?

I am unable to use Ctrl-D to drop into the next message body.
Please advise.
Thanks


-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Rod Hutton
Sent: Saturday, December 2, 2017 6:13 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: Re: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi Mary,

I use Outlook in Office 365, and I can whiz through messages which open as soon as you delete the one you're reading.
I haven't configured the preview pane since, coming from using Window-Eyes, and, indeed, continuing to use it, the Window-Eyes Outlook Enhance app always turns it off automatically.
The key is to set up Outlook to load the next or previous message automatically, depending on how you sort them in your current folder.
Since I sort my messages by subject, and then by date, with oldest at the bottom, I set up Outlook in the Outlook Mail Options to load the previous message automatically, and so this loads the newest message as soon as I delete it using the Outlook hotkey Ctrl-D.
As for reading the current message automatically, I use a Window-Eyes Cursor key definition for the cursor key Ctrl-D to execute the read to end command, and this just reads the next loaded message after you manually delete the current one.
With Jaws, the automatic reading of messages is set up using the quick verbosity dialog, accessed with Insert-V.
That's all there is to it, although, I admit, perhaps it may sound a little complicated. (smile)

Best,

Rod


-----Original Message-----
From: main@TechTalk.groups.io [mailto:main@TechTalk.groups.io] On Behalf Of Mary Otten
Sent: December 1, 2017 9:12 AM
To: main@TechTalk.groups.io
Subject: [TechTalk] preview pane in Outlook or Thunderbird??

Hi all,


I have come from a Windows xp machine using a very old email client, and I have also used the Mac native email client in its classic view. Both of these have the distinction of being able to use a single keystroke to get to a preview pane where you can read much of, and sometimes all of, an email message, without having to open the message and start a say all, then close the message and delete it. I find the preview pane to be a more efficient means of dealing with a lot of email. I have both Outlook from Office 16, which I haven't even looked at yet, because I figure it is seriously complicated, and Thunderbird, latest release version. Is there a way in either of these clients to have them open with focus either in the inbox, or at least on the folder preview of available boxes for a given account, then let you get into the inbox and have a preview pane available with one press of the tab key? Also, in T-bird, it always opens to the tool bar with the inbox tab selected. I would prefer that it open with the inbox tree view in focus, not that useless tab. More wasted keystrokes. Is there a way to make this happen?\


Mary









---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
http://www.avg.com